Gasp! Shock! Savage Arms use an ... Indian!!!

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Good grief, this thread came back from the dead.
It probably should have stayed dead.
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Actually, in this instance bringing back an old thread is ok (and I believe it is the very first instance I have ever thought so). NINE brought it back for a specific reason (poke fun at himself about his rifle purchase). I don't think it would have worked if he had started a new thread.

On the Redskins Football Team name: A little team history might help - or it might not. The Redskins were originally a Boston team. They were named Redskins in honor of the band of "Indians" who had that little tea party we've all heard about. Unfortunately, that aspect of the name has been long lost over the years. If the team owners had thought a little about it, they should have realized their true meaning would soon be lost even if the team had stayed in Boston, but those were different times and, most likely, it never crossed their minds.
 
The Accu-trigger is OUTSTANDING. Very crisp, no creep whatsoever. I have it dialed down to the lowest setting, it surprises you when it breaks, like it should.


I like it so much I'd volunteer to be the mascot. I'll run around with a loin cloth, tomahawk and everything.

:D
 
"I'll run around with a loin cloth ..."

Whatever you do in the privacy of your own home, etc. But, please, no pictures!

:D
 
These threads crack me up. I work with two full blooded souix, another one has his kid on my hockey team, we talk frankly about this stuff. Not one of them feels offended by the image of a indian in a headdress, not one of them finds chief, or brave or indian insulting.

Infact they refer to themselves as indian far more than native american...when approached by a soccermom Welstone supporter about how wonderful it was we were now playing in the "blaze's " arena instead of the awful "braves" arena. ( it had just been renamed) My friend Raymond looked right at her and said, " what the hell is a blaze and why do we want our kids to be an arsonist instead of noble, loyal, warrior." The woman had no respnse, as she walked away raymond leaned over to me and said ''Well at least they named it the Blaze instead of the "fall-down-sloppy-drunks' like most of us are now"

None of them feel the PC movement has anything to do with the needs and wants of the indian nations. As for the Souix, The big thing now is tracing you ancestry to the right guy so you qualify for casino payouts, Raymond now gets $975,000 a year in casino Profit sharing. The other two guys are working on DNA testing to prove that their mom was a half daughter of a band member in order to qualify.
 
Nine...

Nice post. I had to re-read it a second time to make sure I took it all in, but it gave me a good smile this morning.
 
when indians WERE considered savages
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The official nomenclature per the Department of War (courtesy of either General William Tecumseh [what irony] Sherman or General Philip Sheridan) was "hostile." So, today's Washington Redskins should be called the Washington Hostiles, but then people would confuse them with Congress and the President.
 
Didn't bother reading the entire thread. I don't know Mr. ATTICUS views/opinions on anything else, but on this I agree with him/her. If you really can't tell the difference between "fighting irish" and "redskins" and "savage", then you really can't see, and is just lost on you. That would be cool and all, except that density is what continues the problem. I am very aware of my own prejudices, but I don't dare call anyone a derogatory name/slur, less of course they're waging a war to kill my fellow countrymen, then I'd slaughter the lot of them. It would be akin, as stated, calling all whites "drunk micks" "nazi's" "potato eating, can't even grow potatos to eat so they come pollute America, anti semite mofo's", etc. Actually, I don't own savage arms, I consider them cheap, but it don't bother me when I'm in a thinkin mood. The Washington redskins, I always, since a kid, thought was racist...at least not the wisest choice as a moniker. Hey, but the Irish are a bunch of funny speaking, drabbiliy dressed, smelly(in a comical way), impoverished peoples, who like to kill themselves and others in the name of the Lord, ..kind of guys. I do like the occassional stout..tho the last time I was in Ireland, the cheap bastard behind the bar gave me nothing but foam...at least in London I was led to believe there were laws against such things.
 
"Hey, but the Irish are a bunch of funny speaking, drabbiliy dressed, smelly(in a comical way), impoverished peoples, who like to kill themselves and others in the name of the Lord, ..kind of guys."

:confused: :barf:
 
Lemme say, that anytime I hear about something offending someone, I have to wonder why the supposedly offended group is not the one making the claim, but some civil rights group, probably looking for TV time.
 
"The official nomenclature per the Department of War (courtesy of either General William Tecumseh [what irony] Sherman or General Philip Sheridan) was "hostile."

And the lexicon of the day is peppered with references to indians, any indians, as savages.

Newspapers, books, speeches, even in use by politicians and military leaders.

"There is something in the character and traits of the north American savage taken in connection with the scenery over which he is accustomed to range, its vast lakes, boundless forest, majestic rivers, and trackless plains that is, to my mind, wonderfully striking and sublime..."

Washington Irving, Sketch Book

"In the savage, the organs of generation are small and feeble. He has no hair, no beard, no ardour for the female. Though nimbler than the European, because more accustomed to running, his strength is not so great. His sensations are less acute; and yet he is more cowardly and timid. He has no vivacity, no activity of mind. ... It is easy to discover the cause of the scattered life of the savages, and of their estrangement from society. They have been refused the most precious spark of Nature's fire. They have no ardour for women, and, of course, no love of mankind. ... Their heart is frozen, their society cold, and their empire cruel."

Georges-Louis Leclerc, Comte de Buffon, Histoire naturelle, générale et particulière, 1749-89


It gets a LOT worse.

In fact, this is how much worse it gets...

"The present King of Great Britain...has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers; the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions."

Care to even GUESS who wrote that, and where?


Try the Declaration of Independence, 1776, by Thomas Jefferson.

By the time Arthur Savage landed on these shores and started Savage Firearms, the Battle of Little Big Horn was still fresh in the memories of many people, as was the Plains Indians War with its final uprising in the 1880s with the Ghost Dance movement, Wounded Knee, etc.

Thinking a little more about this, I'm really wondering if Arthur Savage wasn't, in his own way, paying tribute to the American indians?
 
Your last comment may have some merit, Mike. BTW was just using your quote as a take-off point, not something that needed correction. I find you don't need correction, at least from me. ;)
 
As the name America did not come from the natives of this part of the world then Native American is not right either. These people have their names for the various tribes, but a name was given to them because of a major navigational error. Then as others arrived this name was applied to all the natives no matter what name they had for themselves.
Saying Native American would be the same as saying Native European, but those people won't have any of that. They want to be reconized by their differences. Why do today's Americans now want to force yet another new name on these people?
 
Either way, seems like almost EVERY white person I've met is "part indian".
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Probably because its true, just like most Indians are "part white" or "part black".

There are ways of telling who has native blood. Most thorough is DNA kinship testing, somewhere in the middle is geneology trees and easiest is dental anatomy. The anatomy is pretty fascinating and quick.

:confused:

Yes, I'll give an example. Feel the back of your front eight teeth, the incisors. Europeans and Africans have nearly 100% incidence of incisors which have rounded backs. East Asians, and incidentally, 'indians' have hollowed incisors, like the inside of a shovel blade, hence the term 'shovel incisors'. Anyone who has shovel incisors has significant 'indian' ancestry.

:D

Like it or not, the first two hundred years of European settlement in North America, especially the Southeat, was primarily by batchelors. Then came a lot of bidirectional adoption, both forced and voluntary. So there has been a lot, excuse me, a LOT of intermarriage. This is how so many Indians got quaint English names like 'William Weatherford', 'John Ross' and 'George Guess'.
 
Looks can be deceving: Savage arms NOT racist.

I know this is a ZOMBIE thread but here is my 2 cents.

I was looking at buying a new 30-06 rifle and I was considering on from Savage Arms. I saw the logo and thought nothing of it. The following week I was eating some oatmeal (Quaker oats) Then I thought Quaker oats = a Quaker on the box, Savage arms = a savage on the box. But I know there had to be an explanation so I did some research and this is what I found:

Arthur Savage (The founder "Savage"), was given a gift from Lame Deer a Indian Chief. This gift was the permission to use his likeness for their logo.
The Chief and his people were given discounts on rifles and the tribe gave their endorsement to Savage arms.

So the name "Savage" is a coincidence.
http://www.savagearms.com/history/

Not Racist at all!!!



Side note - To TwoGuns MeekAndMild:

My wife is a Geneticist, and its kinda funny. She has delt with alot of people asking to find what tribe their ancestor is from (most white, some black).
And hands down 90% of the time they have no Native American blood, and this is in Oklahoma geesh.

The reason been many mixed slaves were trying for find away to escape slavery. Some that were half Black and half White could pass for white (That guy from prison break show), and some passed for Native American (Haley Berry could imo).

I thought I was part native on my mothers side turns out Im 3% African :confused:.
In fact less that 5% of Whites and Blacks have any Native Blood. :eek:
However 30% of White people have some black heritage,
and 98% of Blacks have White heritage.
 
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