First .45 acp?

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The 1911 is an older design... And while I really like my modern pistols... the 1911 also has a place in my heart.

If you get the chance to try one, do so... Especially if it is a quality example. The triggers are smooth, light and easy to use without jerking or affecting aim. Know that while a bad 1911 trigger is still very good compared to a Glock and other striker pistols, there is a range in quality of 1911 triggers all the same.

A 1911 with a target trigger is almost impossible to miss with inside 10yds. Heck a 1911 with a good defense trigger is hard to miss with.

The Ruger 1911, if it can be found on sale for around the $650-700 mark, is a good way to go. They are a lot of gun for the money, and have garnered a lot of fans. The R1 Enhanced doesn't look too bad either, at a similar, but a bit higher price, last I looked.

Rock Island Armory makes good 1911s, their fit and finish isn't quite as good as say, the Ruger, but they are typically build well, work reliably, and have decent triggers. They are also cheaper than others, topping out at around $600 or a bit less, for their higher end versions.



A newer design that would be worth a look... is the Sig P series... Design is from the late 70s-80s, so it isn't "new" but it looks good and modern. It has been updated through the years.

There are several models, double stack and single stack, with 45 versions available. Very nice feeling pistol in the hand, very good trigger and very smooth shooting. I own a P226 (9mm) and it is the smoothest shooting pistol I own.


Now as far as modern polymer designs... Lets see...

I really like my M&Ps, the ergos are great. And the trigger out of the box on the new ones are not horrible. Reset is improved over the older ones, not as good as some other designs but not bad. I am not one who subscribes to the whole riding the reset thing, though I have found myself doing it subconsciously.

For about $30 you can order a replacement trigger from Apex that makes the M&P trigger feel much better. For about $70 more, you can get their trigger enhancement kit that really makes the trigger shine as one of the best. The parts are easy to swap out yourself, but if in doubt a smith could do it in under an hour.

Glocks are fine pistols, but I, like others, find the ergos a little off putting. I find them a little large, even in the smaller caliber versions. The 45 is worse... The Gen 4 version (17/19) is the only one I don't feel like I am holding a large wood block. (Just a slightly smaller one :D )

I would suggest the FNS as a good option, but they make no 45... They do make a 45 in the FNX hammer fired pistol though.

Ruger makes good pistols, but I am not a fan of all the nanny safeties they have on their striker designs. The new American pistol does away with them, but I do not think there is a 45 version.

The XD line of pistols are pretty nice as well. I find them ergonomic and the triggers are decent/good.

The Walther PPQ is a very nice pistol, one of the best feeling/ergonomic pistols I have handled. The trigger is also very good. They released a 45 version not too long back.


Now a not modern design, but a fine pistol is the CZ 75... Outside of the US, it is (and copies of it) the most used pistol in competitions, heck it may be the most used competition pistol even including the US... They make a 45 version called the CZ 97. The CZ pistols are very comfortable in the hand and to shoot. The 45 version is a little on the large size though, and small handed shooters would have issues with it.


In general, I find most 45 pistols just a bit too big for my medium sized hands. Usually its a problem with trigger reach. I can shoot them fine, but how I hold them to reach the trigger makes them not lined up well with my arm. Makes recoil management less effective.

Single stack 45s like the 1911 do not have this problem for me.


45 also has a very stout pushing feel recoil, that a heavier pistol helps soak up. Though some modern polymer designs handle it well enough.


For me, 45 is not a primary caliber, so I go with something fun over strictly practical when picking out a pistol chambered in it. (but my 1911 could be used for practical matters if need be)
 
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For steel- the CZ97b. I paid $600 for mine, and it's perfect-bone stock. The gun shoots like a gun that costs more. A lot more. Mine's a beautiful glossy blue polycoat. I will admit, I bought it 15+ years ago. The price may be more now. Not for small hands. Check around on gunbroker.

In polymer, I'd go with a Walther PPQ. I don't have one, but want one very badly. They're about 6 bills, and can't imagine doing anything to it to improve an already perfect gun. Except maybe giving it a paddle style mag release. :(

I like a good 1911, but I believe they are best chambered in 10mm.
 
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Like others have said I prefer a big heavy gun to soak up the push from a .45 ACP. Several folks have recommended a CZ97 which I believe is a little over your budget. Something similar to that but much more affordable would be an EAA SAR K2. I've never handled one but by all accounts they are built like tanks and have pretty good triggers, the only complaint I've read about them is that they are big and heavy, as you would expect an all steel 14+1 round .45 ACP to be.

Check it out: https://www.cdnnsports.com/eaa-sar-k2-45acp.html
 
Here's my opinion on the matter, If you don't know what a good trigger pull is, go ahead and get a Glock. If you do know, you won't be happy with a Glock.

My best friend got the small one (.45, I forget the model#). He got it on Friday, we went shooting Saturday, Monday he took it back to the gunshop and traded it off.

Between us, we've got over 80 years experience shooting all kinds of handguns, large and small. And there's a good reason we both like the 1911 style guns, and SIGs.

My .45acp guns are 1911A1 pattern or a Browning BDA (SIG P220). OR they are revolvers. ok, I have a barrel for my Contender, too.;)

Try as many different types as you can, see what fits you best. DON'T jump into something just because it LOOKS good.
 
Here's my opinion on the matter, If you don't know what a good trigger pull is, go ahead and get a Glock. If you do know, you won't be happy with a Glock.

My best friend got the small one (.45, I forget the model#). He got it on Friday, we went shooting Saturday, Monday he took it back to the gunshop and traded it off.

That was kinda silly, all he had to do was drop in a better connector
and do a little spring changing...
it ain't like Glock trigger's are hard to make nice...
and if you live near Glock USA & go visit, they'll trick it out for you :)

Same can be said for the S&W M&P series...
altho they just came out with a new & improved trigger for 2016...


There are some other gun boards that try to make a trigger job
seem like an almost-mystical prestidigitation of mythical proportions,
but in all honesty, they're easy as heck for just about anyone to learn.
Main thing is researching your particular weapon and then
Doing It Carefully ;)
 
I didn't buy a 1911 until I was 68 years old because they were known to be expensive, heavy and "old timey". I finally broke down and bought a RIA because it was under $500 out the door and RIA has a good reputation for reliability and good warranty service.

It is the most accurate of all of my other guns and it has been totally reliable. I wish I had done it years ago. I still carry my plastic guns but my 1911 is my favorite gun to shoot.
 
That was kinda silly, all he had to do was drop in a better connector
and do a little spring changing...

The trigger pull on the gun my friend took back wasn't just the normal Glock crappy trigger, (which we were familiar with) but it also wasn't consistent. Pull weight, and the amount of felt trigger travel changed in random fashion with EVERY SHOT.

Now, it may seem silly, but that's just a point of view, he wanted a gun that performed a certain way, without having to rebuild the guts to get there, wasn't happy with what he got, and took it back, trading it for something else.

We also shot several other guns in the same general class, from Springfield, Kahr, S&W, and maybe others, I don't recall now, but that GLock had the worst trigger of any of them.

Now, I realize that it was probably just that individual gun, and its quirks, and its not fair to judge them ALL based on one poor example, BUT, we have only two standards for judgment, hearsay (what everyone says about them) and what the gun in your hands actually does.

In this case, that particular Glock while having a great reputation, had the worst actual performance. Not all of them are that bad, but "Perfection" they ain't.
 
Dashunde


At your price point, before you buy anything, locate and wrap your hands around a Glock 21 Short Frame (Glock 21SF).

I haven't handled one yet, but I will buy a used SF locally if/when it pops up in the $500 range.

RyanCW When I decided to purchase my first .45, I went with a used Gen II G21 because it was cheap & I prefer not to have finger grooves. I didn't get to enjoy the groove-less grip long, after I discovered a problem with the original frame Glock replaced it with a GEN III - No charge :)

I enjoy shooting the 21 and recently added a pristine Gen II to my collection, it will be suppressed in the near future. I recommend getting a .45 Glock.

Oh yeah, I don't care for the 1911 either. I guess it's fine, but it's not for me.

.
 
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RyanCW said:
Hello all, this is my first post/thread. I have just recently started purchasing handguns, though I have owned a rifle and still own my 870. I purchased my first handgun, a G19 gen 4, and am very happy with it. I have an itch to try a .45acp and have about $600 to spend. I am not particularly against a 1911, I am just younger and don't have the attraction to one that most seem to have from using them in the service, passed down from father, etc. I would like to know the thoughts of you guys on the g21 gen 4 vs the m&p45. I have shot the m&p9 fs and thought it was a pretty nice gun, though the 45 is likely a bit bigger. I also have held the g21 G4 but am not quite sure if I could comfortably shoot it with both thumbs forward. On a final note, I am not against any other pistols, these are just the two that I have the most experience with and I know they're both pretty popular.

Welcome to the board.

I don't have any experience with either gun you are considering. I have shot Glocks and M&Ps in other calibers, but own neither in any caliber. Out of the two, I never really liked the Glock that much, and wanted to love the M&P. Well, I will probably buy a Glock soon (trigger is acceptable, points well for me, OK feel, measurements are about perfect, most are quite reliable, and darned near indestructible) and doubt I'll ever buy a M&P unless the price is right (I actually like the Glock trigger better than the M&P).

A few guns you should consider in your price range are:
-A used Ruger P series (go with the alloy P90 over the polymer versions)
-The current Ruger SR 45
-If you like a long but smooth revolver style DA trigger, try the SIG P250. I have the P250 Compact in .45 and love it.
-If you would prefer a striker fired pistol with a lighter trigger, try the SIG P320.
-Used SIG P220 (even used it will be at the top of your price range)

All that said, I know you said you aren't interested in the 1911, but try it out. There is a reason it is by far the most popular .45ACP out there, and it isn't just old fogies buying them. I am a history guy, but when I first started shooting I just wasn't interested in the 1911. Then, a gun shop employee put one in my hand and had me try the trigger. Between the smooth and light SAO trigger (even the cheapest 1911s have great triggers compared to almost everything else), how well it pointed, and how it almost felt like an extension of my hand, I was hooked. Handle one at the shop, and if you can, try to rent one. If you do and still aren't interested, that is fine, but you just may fall in love with the gun like so many of the rest of us.

Now, whatever you get, I'd try to handle as many guns as I could at the gun store to see what feels good in your hands. Then, once you narrow your list down a bit, try to find local ranges where you can rent all (or at least most) of your top choices. What seems good on paper, sometimes doesn't quite fit in your hand, and what feels good at the store, sometimes doesn't quite work for you at the range.
 
I would recommend the Springfield XDM or a used XDS model.
I have the original XD-45 and I love it.
I was about to post "What--no love for the XD?" Mine is about the only handgun I have that is "unfooled with-- stock" that shoots great.
 
Just a fyi folks... the op has one post here, it was the start of this thread back on March 20th with his last activity on March 23... he's long gone.
 
marine6680: said:
Glocks are fine pistols, but I, like others, find the ergos a little off putting. I find them a little large, even in the smaller caliber versions. The 45 is worse... The Gen 4 version (17/19) is the only one I don't feel like I am holding a large wood block. (Just a slightly smaller one )

I agree that having a pistol grip that fits your hand ideally can help you hit your targets. But for those of us with big hands, I also agree you can learn to shoot most any pistol well with practice, even though it may not fit your hand "ideally".

I have my Gen4 Glock 21 setup with the large BT backstrap, it's set up so that I can hit my targets with it. Nobody else I know has a Gen4 21 grip setup like this! And I agree that it is an odd way to set up a gun grip, and it does feel a bit like a 2X4 in my hand, but no matter, this setup works for me!:rolleyes:
 
+1 Glock21 SF. Glock 30 is also a great choice and will take the G21 mags.
+1 for the Ruger 1911's! I have 2 SR1911's greats guns for the price!
Might check out Kahr arms. I have several Kahr models that were less than 600$ and I have been very happy with.
 
Even if price weren't an issue, I'd recommend a Walther PPQ .45. At your $600 price point, it's an absolutely fantastic option. It's a tad light for a .45, but for me that's offset by it's great ergonomics. The trigger, the accuracy, the top-notch German engineering...what a gun!
 
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