Concealed Handguns vs Orlando terrorism last night

COME ON!!!!

If you cant be responsible enough to go into a bar while carrying and NOT drink, maybe you arent responsible enough to carry at all

I went into a "sports bar" tonight for dinner (best grilled chicken sandwich in town). I had 2 diet Cokes!!! The urge to get plastered didnt hit me at ALL:rolleyes:
 
COME ON!!!!

If you cant be responsible enough to go into a bar while carrying and NOT drink, maybe you arent responsible enough to carry at all
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Keep in mind that it wasn't all that long ago that it was considered perfectly responsible to have a couple of beers, but not too many, while driving. "Responsibility" is value or emotion about behavior. We don't all share the same values nor are they equally shared by state laws, particularly concerning guns.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=430692&highlight=gun+club+drinking

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=330181&highlight=gun+club+drinking
 
Really? Because some of us older and wiser folks got that way by not playing Rambo? Please...........
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Saving people being gunned down by a nutjob ain't "playing Rambo".

There are several cases where people stopped mass murderers in their tracks with a gun.

That ain't Rambo, that's being good folk.

Deaf
 
Active duty 1972 to 1976 plus reserves. 45 years experience with having my CCW. I carry my Colt Cobra when off work all the time .I carry even when mowing my yard.
I can have a beer or 2 while I carry as it is legal in my state. In Florida they do not allow drinking with their CCW.
I avoid ghetto situations because I am not a COP. I do not go around looking for a situation I can use my revolver in.
Finally I would never go in place like the Pulse as I am neither category for that interest.
 
In Florida they do not allow drinking with their CCW.
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That's not actually the way the law reads in Florida. Bars are off limits, but having a drink in a restaurant is not; nor is there a specific blood alcohol limit in the law. I know, it's a little odd, but that is the law we have been living with since the 1980s.

As far as the incident itself: Quite a few people survived by hunkering down and awaiting rescue. That is not an argument against concealed carry, only an acknowledgement that different tactics might each have at least some success rate greater than zero.
 
Why we carry is for self defense, not for bravado. Most people who do regularly carry, the few that they are, mostly are not going to have the attitude that they are willing to die to save a room full of strangers.
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You seem to look at life with the glass is half empty attitude.

I doubt anybody goes into a fire fight with the attitude of "willing to die for strangers" but they do go in with the attitude of do as much as possible to help those who cannot help themselves.
 
I doubt anybody goes into a fire fight with the attitude of "willing to die for strangers" but they do go in with the attitude of do as much as possible to help those who cannot help themselves.
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This was not a shooting in a room full of defenseless school children.

Personally I would advocate that every able bodied mentally stable adult should carry a handgun for the protection of his or herself and family. Society is working very hard to demonize gun owners and supporters of gun rights. In the face of limited time, a limited budget, and the fact that carrying limits where I can go I decide to carry a firearm.

Others have made the decision not to. I respect that decision. It is not my duty to free them from any consequences of that decision especially when my attempt to do so (such as in this case) is going to be unlikely to succeed and likely to create further harm.
 
I do not have a choice, I am not aloud to carry in NJ. That being said, if I was in a shooting situation I would not have a problem trying to protect others. Maybe its the boyscout or military blood in my veins but sitting back is not an option and running is only an option after everyone else is safe. If I was aloud to carry here I would be able to fight back with some force
 
what I read in this thread is there is enough evidence a CCW would make a difference in a mass shooting.
the problem is America has villified the idea of lawful carry as "part of the problem" and lesgislated the rights and freedom away, gun free zones, no carry in bars. Its clearly evident to me that these laws are not only ineffective at preventing shootings, they are getting people killed.
 
That's not actually the way the law reads in Florida. Bars are off limits, but having a drink in a restaurant is not; nor is there a specific blood alcohol limit in the law. I know, it's a little odd, but that is the law we have been living with since the 1980s
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True and if you should get caught drunk driving and convicted on felony charges I'll be willing to bet the CCW is gone and worse yet if your carrying in the above
 
JEEZ...
Dont drive drunk. Dont carry drunk. Dont operate heavy machinery drunk.

Just do the right thing ethically. All the laws on the books will not fix bad judgement. Some of the posts sound a lot like the gun control arguements. Pretty sad really
 
I went into a "sports bar" tonight for dinner (best grilled chicken sandwich in town). I had 2 diet Cokes!!! The urge to get plastered didnt hit me at ALL
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And that has what to do with a crowded nightclub full of folks drinking at 2AM?:rolleyes:
 
And that has what to do with a crowded nightclub full of folks drinking at 2AM?
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For those that seem to have trouble following the thread. There are A LOT of posters that are saying no one should carry anyplace there is Alcohol being consumed. Even if i had been out at a "Nightclub", i would have still been carrying AND would have CHOSEN not to drink. Its that frickin simple. Be responsible in your behavior.
 
Not in FL you wouldn't have been; in weapons in nightclubs. Sports "bars" and similar like Chili's are fine in FL, you can even drink - just not at the bar. That said this thread was about having a gun in a crowded nightclub with flashing lights, thunderous music and hundreds of folks moving all over the place and somehow there are those who think they would have easily taken out the bad guy in the mass hysteria and confusion with no clear line of sight, the real possibility if killing bystanders while trying to "save the day", and other assorted video game BS.

The establishment had a uniformed off-duty police office at the door. The real question should be - how did he get past him without killing him first to gain entry?
 
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and other assorted video game BS.
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Brother, I can assure you my experience does NOT come from video games. Heres the truth, a lone gunman (this was) can only look and shoot in one direction at a time. It would not be hard (if he was facing away) to shoot him in the back of the head from 5-7 yds.

In my younger days i used to moonlight at a night club in a crappy part of Riverside Co Calif. i MOST definitely know what the environment looks like to an armed person. One of my shooting was in that parking lot. All of the guys i worked with would have taken the shot in that crowded club to STOP the threat.

Its not pretty. Its not perfect
 
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True and if you should get caught drunk driving and convicted on felony charges I'll be willing to bet the CCW is gone and worse yet if your carrying in the above
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I wouldn't take your bet, friend, but I am not sure the same would be true if one had a glass of beer or wine with dinner; thus, my response to a post that stated unequivocally that drinking and concealed carry were forbidden in Florida.

The unfortunately phrased Florida law made certain that no one at Pulse - not even a designated driver or a person who wanted to dance and drink diet Coke - had the means to resist the assault that occurred that night. We will never know if the outcome would have been different with a different law.

I had always accepted as a good thing the law as it is written. This thread makes me question it.
 
I wouldn't say that America has "vilified" the concept of CCW, rather it's so new that many of the ramifications have not been thought out.
 
SIGSHR said:
I wouldn't say that America has "vilified" the concept of CCW, rather it's so new that many of the ramifications have not been thought out.
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I think so, if it wasn’t vilified we wouldn’t need to keep them concealed. We wouldn’t be threatened with the loss of our jobs for carrying against workplace rules. We would be welcome in all places of businesses or their wouldn’t be signage laws. There wouldn’t be any gun free zones, at all, including bars. You can trust me when I say that the anti-gun politicians mean when they say "common sense" is really that you don’t need to carry a gun anywhere outside your home. They support that by vilifying lawful citizens who do want to carry as "living in fear" and "not qualified".
 
...having a gun in a crowded nightclub with flashing lights, thunderous music and hundreds of folks moving all over the place and somehow there are those who think they would have easily taken out the bad guy in the mass hysteria and confusion with no clear line of sight, the real possibility if killing bystanders while trying to "save the day", and other assorted video game BS.
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straight up anti-gun propaganda right there. If armed citizens do not have the capability of defending themselves then citizens should not have the right to carry anywhere in public.

I guarantee you if even just one of the hostages in Orlando had a CCW they would have made a difference. But they don’t have the right to choose in Florida if they want to socialize at a club.
 
No, it isn't propaganda and you can't guarantee anything of the sort.

However, I do like the notion that you are saying that the CCW with the gun is a person who opted to hide in a crowded bathroom and not do anything first, then wait to become a hostage before acting. Interesting scenario. Of course, once they became hostages, most of the shooting was over except for the killing of Mateen by the cops.
 
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