Breaking up a fight

I suffered a lot of bruises, knots, blood loss, and a couple of funerals learning my lessons. If two punks on the sidewalk desire the same education at the school of hard knocks, then cest la vie. Let them have at it. I figure I can count on folks like you to jump in and get educated as well. Me, I'm crossing the street and I will be sitting at home having a rum and coke while you are explaining your actions at the precinct house. I do not think my character and integrity rests on my response to two punks on the street


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I dont think I could have said it any better myself. Times have changed , and with it so must we.
 
Xavierbreath,

There was also a time when taking babies out of the womb and killing them, two men....acting as a man and a woman do backward (I don't want to get graphic on a public forum but that, as a sanitized description, is what homosexuality is, it's not just two sissy men holding hands as an "alternative lifestyle" like TV and movies portray.), 10 year old kids killing each other, teenagers blowing each other away in school, teachers molesting children, children murdering parents, etc. were all unthinkable and shocking to say the least.
You're right, we do live in a different world....THAT'S THE PROBLEM. Who are we of 2005 to judge people who lived 100 years ago with their problems? Seems to me our situation is FAR worse. As Jesus told the Pharisees "get the log out of your own eye and then you will see clearly enough to get the splinter out of your brother's eye."
I'm not saying "go punch somebody in the nose for being a jerk." (as much as they may deserve it :D) You do want to evaluate and approach the situation wisely. You do want to be prudent and choose your battles. It's not all about you saving the world, it's about you being a part of the community you live in. You might go to jail for a night and after the smoke is cleared, have to explain yourself in court (that's an extreme point but it can happen) but I'd rather just do what is right and leave the rest to Providence. There have been times I have walked away from a confrontation (not necessarily a violent one) and felt ashamed. There have been times I have walked away and felt it was the wise thing to do. If you see two gang bangers in due rags mouthing off that look like they probably have pistols in their baggy pants and baggy t shirts that is most likely not a situation you want to involve yourself in. (but then again, you might have to. depending on what is going on) If two clean cut college boys are cursing each other out ready to start swinging and making a scene, then maybe you and others might need to confront this. But to just take any given situation and just say "You should walk away and call 911, let your own neck be saved" is a retreatist prejudgement.
Perhaps the original poster was right in getting involved (I wasn't there, I didn't see everything going on. Maybe it was between both those two guys and needed to be left that way, but then maybe it was loud and offensive and disturbing to the whole establishment.), perhaps he wasn't, perhaps his tactics needed some rethinking. That was the point of his whole posting. He did say he was walking by and it was practically in his path as he was walking out of the restraunt. Maybe he and his friend happened by and, by the grace of God, defused a situation that would have lead to two boys going to jail. My dad always told me, do what you think is right at the time, sounds like that's what this fellow did. I'm glad it worked out okay.
I'll close with a final thought from Edmund Burke:
"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph, is for good men to do nothing."
 
Doug,
You are assuming that two punks fighting in the street is evil, and therefore good men must do something to prevent it from occuring. I do not assign it any value at all on an ethical or moral scale. I just see it as the process of natural selection.

I do my fair share of good in the world in my profession. The night that I spend in jail because of two college students fighting on the street and my own intervention might be the same night an infant needs to be placed on a ventilator and I am not available to intubate. Intubation would then fall on a lesser qualified individual who may not suceed. Infant might die as a result.

We are all in our communities together, as you say. Sometimes though, a heck of a lot more is at stake if you screw up. I devote my life to helping others. Over time, I have learned one truth. I can help those who want to be helped, save the lives of those who want to be saved. There are plenty of those people available, wanting to receive help and live. I cannot be a martyr to those who do not care enough to help themselves, and I will not place myself or others at risk for two drunk college kids fighting on the street. They will work it out, and hopefully become a little wiser in the process. If one or both of them ends up in the ER, I'll assist them there.

FWIW, I look at John Wesley Hardin, Billy the Kid, Clyde Barrow, John Dillinger, Jesse James, and even the law enforcement officers who tracked them down, and I do not see much difference in the behavior of men 100 years ago and today. The names and the equipment have changed, and the victims have been forgotten, but the crimes and the motivations are always the same.
 
Stay Out Of Situations That Don't Concern You!

Breaking up a scuffle between strangers on the street is not a good idea packing or not. I have learned from personal experiences that even if you were doing the honorable thing you might be the person they will be hauling in the back of the police car. The only scuffles I break up now are between my family in my home or at a relative’s house. A person mentioned it also can be a set up for a robbery which has happened to a buddy of mine who was trying to be a hero and got knocked out supposedly trying to help a woman who was screaming for help and it was actually a setup by all the parties involved. They ended up taking his wallet that had about $400 cash and the gold chain they ripped from his neck when he was on the ground bleeding. Be cautious when trying to be a hero!!!
 
It's not all about you saving the world, it's about you being a part of the community you live in. You might go to jail for a night and after the smoke is cleared, have to explain yourself in court (that's an extreme point but it can happen) but I'd rather just do what is right and leave the rest to Providence.
Click to expand...

You can't attach the same idealistic methodology to the originally posted scenario, as you would to, say, if you found someone's wallet on the sidewalk.

What is right? You give the fella a call, and return his wallet - money intact. But, two adult morons willingly getting physical in an attempt to prove “who's the bigger man,” is not a scenario that warrants the same righteous response.

All this talk about the honorable thing to do, really makes me :rolleyes: . It used to be honorable in war-time to line up and fire at your enemy who was also lined up, right there, out in the open.

Then someone got smart and started using cover. That’s me.

Carrying a gun and running around breaking up fights is not smart – period.
 
Getting Involved

Good Day,
I am not a lawyer or a LEO; however, in some public places, (jurisdictions), moving toward a fight makes you an agressor in the eyes of the law. ( My step son went to where a fight was going to happen while in Jr. H.S. He got attacked and was arrested.) If you are armed it would be really bad juju. Going back inside and calling 911 was the best advice. In the case of self defense, the agressor is identified by advancing on, or outright attacking you. The case of preventing death or serious bodily harm to another needs to be very well defined, especially in a public place. This is what most other replies stated, I hope I clarified it a bit.
Best,
Rob
 
Some of you seem to forget that this is a free country. You look at this situation with your value set and judge according to your prejudices. I am a Christian but is it my right impose my beliefs and values on others? I do not condone homosexuality (using the example given my Doug.38PR) and I can voice my opinion against it, but is it really my place to tell total strangers how to live?

As for DTakas, how would you know who is the agressor in the fight? If I got into a fight, and you (a total stranger and not a police officer) tried to break it up, I would tell you to mind your own G D business. If you wanted to get into the ruckus, keep trying to break it up. I haven't been in a fight since the 5th grade but I imagine that most people in a fight would respond that way. It is great that you have your own ideals and morals. Just remember that this is a free country and that you have NO RIGHT TO IMPOSE THOSE IDEALS AND MORALS ON OTHERS!

I just want to clear this up. If you are talking about a situation in which there is clearly a victim (especially a man beating on a woman or someone picking on the elderly), then I feel there is a need to step in. If it is two punks that want to rough each other up, well, thats their problem. I will call 911 since they are disturbing the peace but I've given up on saving the world... especially for those who don't want to be saved.
 
Once again I remind people that saving the world is not what we’re talking about here. As far as knowing who the aggressor is, the original poster watched the event unfold directly in front of him. He could probably easily tell who was the first one to take things from mere words to the physical realm. As far as not forcing your values on others. Stephen426, from what you say it seems that your moral stance says that, it’s OK to have a moral perspective and that all people are entitled to their own perspective but it is not acceptable to force those views on others. Based on that same argument you have no right to try and force your views on me. You stand in no position to correct me by the same means you condemn. Not to mention that each person having their own views and no other questioning that leads to moral relativism. Right and wrong are simply personal preferences in one’s own eyes. Right and wrong are not subjective. That same way of thinking is what leads punks to think it’s ok to mug people on the street. After all they need the money to support their drug habit. Since they need it they feel it’s OK to take it. I don’t want to get involved in a debate off topic (as I am currently involved in) so I will not post any further on this thread. While I do have further opinions on this topic this forum is not the place to continue the current discussion.
 
Best thing to do in a situation like that is to let them fight, until they both get worn out, then step in and break it up. The only time you should step in is if it looks more like a 1 sided beating than a mutual fight. As long as no one is getting seriously injured, and one guy isnt getting his ass kicked, theres no sense in a third person stepping in and getting hurt. Doesnt make much sense to me :confused:
 
DON'T Break it up!!!

Let them wear each other down a bit first...

and then if you feel you must interfere... you will have the advantage!!

The best hero is the guy who knows when... :D
 
I'd just like to bring to mind a famous quote that goes something like this, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
 
Pointer said:
Let them wear each other down a bit first...

and then if you feel you must interfere... you will have the advantage!!

The best hero is the guy who knows when...
Click to expand...

Another good point by Pointer, hence the name. :D
 
Not to sound cock but, if I'm toe to toe with another dude mind your own business. Now if imminent danger is a factor that’s a different story.
 
two women broke into a fight inside a mall in New Jersey. I saw the whole thing and thought about stopping it. It was like a jungle scene. A real cat fight. Eventually, the mall security came and broke it off. but I thought what if one pulled a knife. Society is falling apart.
 
Seriously Dumb

Not to be rude...but "seriously dumb" comes to mind.

There is no reason to get involved in an affray between people you don'k know... in fact there usually isn't a good reason to get involved in an affray between peopleyou know.

The risks of a bad outcome, far outweigh the chance of a good outcome... I'd say you were VERY lucky.

On the positive side, it didn't get to felony stupid... You are a lucky guy. :p

V/r

Chuck
 
Reality check

I have to say that I was disgusted when I read the majority of replies here. I agree with Doug.38PR too much of turning a blind eye and making excuses for it going on. Everyone saying, just call the cops let them handle it and go on. That’s something to be ashamed of. I hate to break it to you people but legality and morality are mutually exclusive.
Click to expand...
Legality and morality may be mutually exclusive, but it's the law that will put your "anus" behind bars for a good number of years if you jump in to a street brawl and you end up having to shoot one or both of the contestants in order for you to come out of it alive.

The prosecutor will label you a "mutual combatant," your interference "predictably esclating the situation," the use of your firearm "vigilante justice," and you "a Charles Bronson wannabe."

A jury of The Sheeple will swallow his bait whole and you will become inmate #1234567 for the next 10 to 20 years - that is, if you are not stabbed to death in the fight.

Think about it.
 
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