Bob Barr Enters Presidential Race as Libertarian

Will you consider voting for Bob Barr for President?

  • Yes

    Votes: 64 45.4%
  • No

    Votes: 77 54.6%

  • Total voters
    141
GoSlash27 said:
...Reagan and Goldwater were also portrayed as fringe whackos for sayin' the same stuff Paul says....
But they also managed to gain much wider and broader support. Perhaps that had something to do with their personalities and abilities to engage and inspire a wide range of people. Maybe they were just a lot more skillful at what they did.
 
Stage2, not adhering to the Constitution and being an "evil hater of the constitution" are not the same thing. As I have said before, some (even most) people do not make adhering to the Constitution their top priority when it comes to politics and legislation. They, of course adhere to the Constitution when it is something they agree with (say RKBA, for instance) but are unwilling to adhere to the Constitution when it is something that they don't agree with (say federal drug legislation, for instance).

But feel free to ignore this rational discussion, if you will. And go ahead and throw in a little insult while you are at it. At this point, I expect nothing less from you.
 
You have a high opinion of your intellect and that's fine. Just don't expect to sway people by pounding your chest and putting people down. Some people will see right through it.

Coming from the master of the ad hominem LOL

But feel free to ignore this rational discussion, if you will. And go ahead and throw in a little insult while you are at it. At this point, I expect nothing less from you.

There is no rational discussion. There is screeching from the fringe, while the rest of us figure out a way to defeat Barack Obama.

Nominating kooks like Paul and hypocritical haters like Barr isnt going to do it.

WildisubmitthereisnodifferencebetweenthefringeleftandfringerightAlaska TM
 
while the rest of us figure out a way to defeat Barack Obama.

Amen bro. At this point that's all that matters. I'd even vote for Hillary if she was running directly against Obama.:eek: Come to think of it I did in the primaries. :D
 
i submit there is no difference between the fringe left and fringe right

Now just what do you mean by a statement like that. You know one side is absolutely correct and the other side absolutely wrong. Everyone in the middle is just dumb, stupid, ignorant sheeple and 90% wrong. :D
 
PT111,Now just what do you mean by a statement like that. You know one side is absolutely correct and the other side absolutely wrong. Everyone in the middle is just dumb, stupid, ignorant sheeple and 90% wrong.

The political "middle"? Tell me PT111... what do these people in the middle believe in exactly? What positions do they hold on energy... on foreign policy and on taxation, for example? How do the people in the middle feel about the war on terror?

If you avoid an attempt at answering the question, I will understand.
 
Bob Barr is officially the Libertarian Party nominee

Bob Barr is officially the Libertarian Party nominee.

I look forward to voting for him in November. My State's(GA) electoral votes should safely go to McCain unless he really blows it. "Swing State " voters might have a diferent rationale for their pick. I'm glad there is a truly pro-Second Amendment/pro-Liberty candidate for President.
 
The political "middle"? Tell me PT111... what do these people in the middle believe in exactly? What positions do they hold on energy... on foreign policy and on taxation, for example? How do the people in the middle feel about the war on terror?

I think that you are demonstrating my point precisely in that it does not matter what I say you will point out how wrong they are. You are of the extreme fringe that anyone who does not agree with you 100% even to the point of wasting, and yes I said wasting, your vote is wrong. Just what are your, Ron Paul and Bob Barr's position on these subjects? If they are anything like what I have read on Ron Paul's web site (is his web site an accurate description of his position?) I will not vote for him or Barr. You keep saying that they are defenders of the constitution but they evidently don't read or have the same constitution that I have.

I have read enough of this BS about Paul being perfect if only the media wasn't so against him. It's not the media that is against him but the impression that the public gets of him, being a wacko is correct. I agreed with him on guns to a large extent but that is about the only thing I could agree with him on and to tell the truth if he were tunning I would certainly consider voting for Al Sharpton before Ron Paul. At least with AS I know what I am getting.
 
Firemax
The political "middle"? Tell me PT111... what do these people in the middle believe in exactly? What positions do they hold on energy... on foreign policy and on taxation, for example? How do the people in the middle feel about the war on terror?
PT911
I think that you are demonstrating my point precisely in that it does not matter what I say you will point out how wrong they are. You are of the extreme fringe

Funny, you can't even define what you claim to be a part of, this great undefinable political "middle"... and instead you call me extreme. Gotcha. :rolleyes:

What is so extreme in asking someone what they believe in?
 
Hawg Haggen
For me it is. I'm not wasting a vote to make a statement. Now if Obama wasn't running it might be different.

I certainly understand wishing to defeat Obama. I just can't vote for a liberal candidate in order to do so. I've tried to forget McCain's liberalism in an effort to consider voting for him. But then, when I am just about ready to forget that he actively threatened to leave the republican party in 2001, and the fact that he voted against the Bush tax cuts, and the fact that he wants to end private person to person gun sales, and the fact that he co-authored McCain Feingold bill which limits our free speech during an election...... well, he starts talking liberal nonsense once again such as his most recent speech in Oregon where he explained his belief in global warming and the need to tax American corporations.

It's more than John McCain is not a conservative. It's as if he enjoys throwing it in the faces of conservatives that he doesn't need them to win this election. I think he genuinely despises conservatives. As well he should, because this conservative despises him.
 
What is so extreme in asking someone what they believe in?

A couple of minor points. One is I believe that we should not have a special class of people that do not have to pay income taxes. I realize that drug dealers do not pay taxes but they are not doing it leagally and can in fact be prosecuted for that. Al Capone was finally sent to prison for tax evasion since it was almost impossible to convict him on the other 1,000 crimes. I don't believe that a person should be exempt from income taxes just because the work as a waiter like Ron Paul proposes.

I don't care to do away with the inalienable right of natural born citizenship. Since the founding of the country those born here are considered ctizens. Ron Paul wants to do away with that and require your parents to be citizens before you are a citizen.

Should I go on?
 
the fact that he voted against the Bush tax cuts, and the fact that he wants to end private person to person gun sales, and the fact that he co-authored McCain Feingold bill which limits our free speech during an election...... well, he starts talking liberal nonsense once again such as his most recent speech in Oregon where he explained his belief in global warming and the need to tax American corporations.

I understand and I don't like these facets any more than you do but just think of how much worse Obama is going to be. It's going to be McCain or Obama, no getting around that. A vote for a third party is helping Obama, you can't deny that.
 
Wild wrote in part:

If you honestly think McCain is a socialist then clearly the American educational system has failed.

You could use a little more friendly words Wild but I agree +1,000,000.

Firemax: Ron Paul is too isolationist and not imperialistic enough for my tastes. He has some good points and much of what he says appeals to me but he is too isolationist and not imperialistic enough for me.

You know, my fantasy President is George Washington. Not a man of many words but a man of action. Ron Paul just doesn't fit that model for me.

But I don't dislike the man. He appears sincere and decent.
 
PT111
Ron Paul wants to do away with that and require your parents to be citizens before you are a citizen.
Should I go on?

With respect, that position seem inline with democrats, not conservatives. Maybe you already know that. Ron Paul's position is the same exact position of most other countries in the world. If you live in Mexico, are an American and have a child, that child is NOT a Mexican citizen. So, what is the problem with Ron Paul wanting a position that most of our neighbors also have in regard to birthright citizenship?

In regard to waiters, and waitresses... again, you are yet another person spreading disinformation about Ron Paul. Clearly, you have not read Ron Paul's position on that... instead, you have probably "heard" about it. No problem, I will take a moment of my time to tell you the correct information.

Waiters and waitresses are paid a base wage. The rest of their income is made from tips. Formerly, waiters and waitresses had to keep track of their tips and report it as income. Now, being the all seeing all powerful government, and being distrustful of the citizens which it rules over, the gov't came up with a new plan. Instead of allowing the waiter/waitress to report their own income, the government decided it will "estimate" what each waiter/waitress made in tip income and they will be required to pay taxes on that estimate.

Ron Paul believes the government should not be in the business of forcing us to pay income taxes on money it cannot prove exists. What if the government "guesses" we made more than we did as a waiter/waitress. According to the law.... oh well. Tough luck.

How would you like it if the government decided to estimate your income because it didn't trust you to do it? That would be wrong, yes? It is wrong in every single case, including with waiters and waitresses. IMO, only a democrat would argue otherwise. But hey, that is just MO.
 
pt111,
I don't believe that a person should be exempt from income taxes just because the work as a waiter like Ron Paul proposes.
Waiters/Waitresses would be taxed, but only on their wages, not their tips, as it used to be. Now they are even taxed on what the IRS assumes their tips were. This is wrong. Also, for you to state that they would pay NO taxes is also wrong.


Since the founding of the country those born here are considered ctizens.
Can you provide some support for this statement? And was this applied to those born of parents here illegally?
 
Rdak
Firemax: Ron Paul is too isolationist and not imperialistic enough for my tastes. He has some good points and much of what he says appeals to me but he is too isolationist and not imperialistic enough for me.

I am always willing to accept criticism of my beliefs when done in a civil manner as you have just done. While I disagree that he is an isolationist, I understand your position. As for being an isolationist, Ron Paul is nothing of the sort. His policy would call for a strong national defense as a deterent. Rather, Ron Paul is a non-interventionist. He would not commit US troops to police the world for Germany, Britain, South Korea, Iraq or any other nation.

I think that is the policy that turns people off from Ron Paul. However, when you look at the shape we are in because of years of policing the world, then his policy makes a lot of sense. Will America be safer once she has been bankrupted by these adventurous foreign policy decisions? I submit that America will not be safer. Is there a time when we should commit troops to battle? Absolutely, but never, ever as the aggressor nation as we have done in Iraq.

You know, the US has a debt of approx 9 trillion dollars. That's

$9,000,000,000,000.00.

Currently, America has about $1 trillion in circulation. We don't even have enough wealth to pay off our debt, yet we are continuing with a foreign policy that some estimate is costing us a $1 trillion per year. How long will this mirage of wealth last before it crumbles to the ground? Can you, as a private citizen, keep borrowing money to fund a lavish life style without having the ability to pay it back? Of course not. We should not believe that our government can magically figure this out. As a country, we must live within our means or we will be buried by the horrors that come with poor fiscal management.

You know, my fantasy President is George Washington. Not a man of many words but a man of action.
A good man indeed. Though, George wasn't a president who would commit our troops to foreign wars. It was George Washington who issued the Proclamation of Neutrality in 1793. He believed that we should not entangle ourselves in foreign affairs of other countries. Thus, I believe that Ron Paul has at least some things in common with President Washington.

But I don't dislike the man. He appears sincere and decent.
I agree that Ron Paul does seem kind and decent and sincere. My wife, who is much less political than me, also likes those qualities about him. I think, at the very least, those who believe they do not like Ron Paul, should read his book and learn where he stands on important issues. They may not agree with everything he believes, but many of his positions are right on track with the founding father's beliefs.

You know, I don't agree with Ron Paul on every position. However, I do believe wholeheartedly that he is the most conservative of all of the candidates from either party this election cycle. I don't regret supporting him for a moment. I will continue to support him as he continues to carry the message of liberty for the American people.
 
A choice between two parties is no choice at all. Dissolving those parties and electing individuals would cure a lot of our ills. As for Barr's "late" entry, we're still 6 months from the election! I wish all of them would start this late. I'd still get burned out by November, but at least we'd be spared the idiocy for a few more months. As of now I have to figure out what's going on with Barr. I would have voted for McCain in the last election, and I may do so this year.
 
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