Best 9mm ammo for defense
- Thread starter N.Farley
- Start date
THIEF! THIEF!
I always credit gun writer & highly noted use of force trainer: Massad Ayoob, www.massadayoobgroup.com , with the term: Jello Junkie.
Ayoob also says; "morgue monster" or a gun owner/armed professional who uses court records/ME reports/crime scene data for selecting a sidearm round or caliber.
There is much credit to be given to real world stats/documented use, but as in the Critical Duty line or rounds like the HST or T-Series/Ranger T, R&Ds offer a lot.
ClydeFrog
I always credit gun writer & highly noted use of force trainer: Massad Ayoob, www.massadayoobgroup.com , with the term: Jello Junkie.
Ayoob also says; "morgue monster" or a gun owner/armed professional who uses court records/ME reports/crime scene data for selecting a sidearm round or caliber.
There is much credit to be given to real world stats/documented use, but as in the Critical Duty line or rounds like the HST or T-Series/Ranger T, R&Ds offer a lot.
ClydeFrog
When you plan to use +P+, consider the gun.
There is not any upper limit on the pressures generated by a +P+, since it is not a SAAMI regulated design. So how much of a magnum load do you have? You don't know and neither do I.
Your particular pistol may be quickly worn out by that unknown high-pressure cartridge. And you don't know until something breaks. And that could be very bad if it breaks just as you need it for a real-deal self-defense two way bullet exchange.
Considering the 9mm pistols I have, I will only shoot the +P+ (any brand or load) in the S&W 5906 or the Ruger 9mm Speed Six. They both have lots of steel and are rugged.
As for any other 9mm pistol, I like the 124 grain in +P, or maybe even just standard pressure for the smallest lightest ones. I'm a happy new owner of a Kahr CW9 and am still finding the upper limit of what I want to shoot in it.
Bart Noir
There is not any upper limit on the pressures generated by a +P+, since it is not a SAAMI regulated design. So how much of a magnum load do you have? You don't know and neither do I.
Your particular pistol may be quickly worn out by that unknown high-pressure cartridge. And you don't know until something breaks. And that could be very bad if it breaks just as you need it for a real-deal self-defense two way bullet exchange.
Considering the 9mm pistols I have, I will only shoot the +P+ (any brand or load) in the S&W 5906 or the Ruger 9mm Speed Six. They both have lots of steel and are rugged.
As for any other 9mm pistol, I like the 124 grain in +P, or maybe even just standard pressure for the smallest lightest ones. I'm a happy new owner of a Kahr CW9 and am still finding the upper limit of what I want to shoot in it.
Bart Noir
Walklightly
Moderator
op
No response? Not even a quick one?
Buy the most expensive ones with the biggest claims, I guarantee your golden!
Who really does know? GQA
No response? Not even a quick one?
Buy the most expensive ones with the biggest claims, I guarantee your golden!
Who really does know? GQA
Yes for a number of reasons:
1) Some guns are not rated to even handle +P - like the Rohrbaugh R9
2) Some guns are not sprung to handle certain recoil characteristics, not new advice here but make sure you test the ammo out before entrusting your life to it. While you're being atacked is the worst time to find out that you turned your gun into a 1-shot derringer by your choice of ammo.
I have a friend who loads his full-size nine with Glaser Safety slugs. I'm sure he read somewhere that they're awesome. They're also pretty expensive to test fire, even a few of them to see if they reliably cycle your semi. He also has a box of Black Talons, so I just gave him some friendly advice that he might want to load up with the Black Talons instead.
Not only because I beleive that the Black Talons is a more effective round, but mainly because neither one of us knows if the pistol will even cycle through a whole magazine of Glasers.
buck460XVR
New member
Ahhhhhh, the quest for the magic bullet continues.
I suggest using the ammo that is the most reliable and most accurate outta YOUR gun. Since this varies between guns, what works well for someone else might be crap in yours. Most commercially available SD/HD ammo will have similar terminal performance when placed in COM.
Sent from the throne in my bathroom using my wife's laptop...........
Black Talons...
To my knowledge, Winchester ended full production of the "Black Talon" line in the late 1990s. Bad PR & media hype forced Winchester to convert Black Talon rounds into the Ranger-T/T series handgun ammunition.
No one can buy Black Talon in the US for years, unless you know of factory rounds about 12-15 years old.
Clyde
To my knowledge, Winchester ended full production of the "Black Talon" line in the late 1990s. Bad PR & media hype forced Winchester to convert Black Talon rounds into the Ranger-T/T series handgun ammunition.
No one can buy Black Talon in the US for years, unless you know of factory rounds about 12-15 years old.
Clyde
BleedinPurple
New member
has anyone tried any of the underwood ammo gold dots...
if they are indeed gold dot bullets and loaded how they claim they are right priced for quality hd ammo.
any experience?
if they are indeed gold dot bullets and loaded how they claim they are right priced for quality hd ammo.
any experience?
Also consider the ammo. I'm perfectly comfortable shooting certain +P+ loadings like Winchester Ranger 127gr T-Series, Federal 115gr Hi-Shok, and Hirtenberger 100gr JSP in a modern, full-sized handgun because I know that all of those loadings were designed specifically for handguns. I would not, however, shoot other +P+ ammo like Hirtenberger 124gr FMJ in any handgun because I know that particular ammo was designed for submachine guns only.
Actually, in the case of my preferred 9mm +P+ loading, I do know because Winchester tells me. Its max. average pressure is 42,000 CUP which is approximately (there is no exact conversion of CUP to PSI) 46,000 PSI which, in turn, is approximately 30% over maximum standard pressure and approximately 19% over maximum +P pressure.
http://winchesterle.com/Lists%2FCatalogAmmo%2FAttachments%2F13%2FRA9TA.pdf
It is worthy of note, however, that I only shoot this ammunition in very limited amounts in a full-sized handgun of fairly recent manufacture (CZ-75B which was purchased new in 2004) and that a Wolff extra power recoil spring has been installed (16lbs vs. 14lbs factory).
Good advice as who wants to unecessarily wear out any gun nowadays with the dollar not buying what it used to.
Personally with my Kel-Tec P11 they recommend 'limited' use of +P rated ammo. Thus, I find something that I know will reliably feed by firing several expensive boxes absent a failure (right now my PD Round of choice is Hornady's Critical Duty not to be confused with their Critical Defense as the weights and general technology of the two differ). Once I have found that PD ammo of which I stake my life on, I no longer fire any further amount of +P ammo with the exception of a few rounds here and there throughout the course of the year.
-Cheers
Mikey Idaho
New member
Hornady Critical Defense or occasionally TAP in my firearms of every type.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2
Coltman 77
New member
Great post.
MikeNice81
New member
I am going to pull a couple of quotes from the thread. They are all from different people.
A lot of people love this round. If you go check out the Winchester LEO site, the 124gr+p actually out performs it in their test. Might be worth a look to save wear and tear on your game.
Why not?
I've told the story before of my friend. His significant other's ex pulled in to the drive way, hopped out, stood behind the door of his truck, and opened fire. My friend had to fire through the door to defend his life.
If I'm hunkered down with my family in the master bedroom, and a guy is trying to kick his way in, what should I do? I vote shoot through the door.
****
I have three criteria these days.
1. Cycles and works fine in the gun
2. I am accurate with the round
3. Meets FBI standards
A lot of people love this round. If you go check out the Winchester LEO site, the 124gr+p actually out performs it in their test. Might be worth a look to save wear and tear on your game.
Why not?
I've told the story before of my friend. His significant other's ex pulled in to the drive way, hopped out, stood behind the door of his truck, and opened fire. My friend had to fire through the door to defend his life.
If I'm hunkered down with my family in the master bedroom, and a guy is trying to kick his way in, what should I do? I vote shoot through the door.
****
I have three criteria these days.
1. Cycles and works fine in the gun
2. I am accurate with the round
3. Meets FBI standards
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Walklightly
Moderator
MikeNice81
I more like my .38spl +P for my carry, in a light snub, or sometimes a SP101 3" .357mag loaded with good old Rem 125g SJHPs for HD. If I think I needed more power in .357, I'd get my Buffalo Bore 125g hp rated at 1700fps/802lbs, or more like 1300-1500/468-624lbs out of my 3" barrel.
I see your point and agree, but for me the most powerful 9mm is a 9.1mm=.357mag.
TBS, let me get back on topic. For HD, I also have a CZ75B 9mm. I load it to shoot the first 7-8 shots GDHP 124g +Ps, the next 7-8 shots are FMJ of the NATO fashion, mostly Fiocchi standard, +Ps, or +P+ what ever is closest to me when loading my mag.
If those aren't enough, well, say hello to the most powerful handgun in the World, and I just blow there head off. And the ammo loaded is not M29 rated! Say good night gracie!
I more like my .38spl +P for my carry, in a light snub, or sometimes a SP101 3" .357mag loaded with good old Rem 125g SJHPs for HD. If I think I needed more power in .357, I'd get my Buffalo Bore 125g hp rated at 1700fps/802lbs, or more like 1300-1500/468-624lbs out of my 3" barrel.
I see your point and agree, but for me the most powerful 9mm is a 9.1mm=.357mag.
TBS, let me get back on topic. For HD, I also have a CZ75B 9mm. I load it to shoot the first 7-8 shots GDHP 124g +Ps, the next 7-8 shots are FMJ of the NATO fashion, mostly Fiocchi standard, +Ps, or +P+ what ever is closest to me when loading my mag.
If those aren't enough, well, say hello to the most powerful handgun in the World, and I just blow there head off. And the ammo loaded is not M29 rated!
Say good night gracie!Barrel Length
Is it safe to say in general that the specs/performance of the PD ammo mentioned in this thread are based on service-size guns instead of the compact models that most carry for CCW? I know, for instance, that the Critical Duty ammunition which I really like is 'not' recommended for compact guns which kind of defeats its purpose for me...
.
-Cheers
Is it safe to say in general that the specs/performance of the PD ammo mentioned in this thread are based on service-size guns instead of the compact models that most carry for CCW? I know, for instance, that the Critical Duty ammunition which I really like is 'not' recommended for compact guns which kind of defeats its purpose for me...
.-Cheers