7.62 x 39 Russian 200 yard accuracy Siaga AK

J

Jim567

New member
I was at the range today looking forward to a fun day with my Ruger bolt action 16" barrel American Ranch and my Saiga AK variant, also 16". Was going to shoot 200 yards only.
I was shooting Hornady SST that I have gotten 3/4" groups in the Ruger at 100 yards and 2" at 200 yards. That rifle amazes me.
The Saiga AK with the same ammo gets 4-5" at best at 100 yards.
When I fired the Saiga at 200, it was off the paper!
I had 3 targets stacked - 3 feet plus total, it was not elevation.
Deflection would have had to spread over a foot to be off paper.
What in the world!
I rechecked zero at 100 yards - fine, usual 4-5".
I have never experienced a rifle being so "disappointing". All rounds,6, off paper somewhere. One or two maybe but all!
Not even minute of man at 200 yards.
Even if the groups went 10", twice the 100 yard results they would be on paper somewhere.
UGH.
 
You are comparing a U.S. built econo American bolt gun to a "it goes bang and holds up "mil spec" Soviet / (insert communist nation here) semi auto bullet hose. Unfortunately for you what you have is a bullet hose that passes proof.
 
It is what is is.
It’s NOT the round it’s the rifle.
What shocked me is that it is passable at 100 yards for what it is,but goes to hell in a hand basket at 200.
It shoots a centered group of 5 inches at 100 yards, 9 rounds.
200 yards I wasn’t hitting a 12 x 12 target, Not one round on paper.
All my other rifles barely open up an inch from 100 to 200.
 
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with a 5in group at 100yds, should be a 10in group at 200yds.

could be a bullet stability issue. could be other issues. you had a good target height, but could have been off to the side.
 
Really Shadowman.
That’s certainly what I would expect.
The same Hornady bullets in my Ruger are grouping two inches.
 
Every gun is its own thing. have you tried any other ammo in the saiga? similar results?

If it were me I would be trying to adjust loads to see if I could tighten things up. Tweak powder up and down a little. tinker with bullet seating depth. maybe try another bullet.
 
Speculation

Those rounds went somewhere. Repeat your range session, with a larger, clean target backer. I'm betting you've got a larger, say volleyball size group, left or right. I'm also betting that the Ruger is scoped and the AK has OEM irons. A side bet is the irons are not perfectly zeroed at 100 and or the front sight tower is canted.

AK iron sights are extremely demanding and will not leave much room for error at 200 yards. A canted front sight tower could shift your group markedly at that distance as well. A torso size target should be within the rifles capability at that distance.
 
I have tried a lot of ammo in the Saiga. The hornady by far is the best.
I have a lot of experience with this rifle at 100 yards and it’s always consistent 4 to 5 inch groups.
I have a three power scope on it.
Bama ranger I shoot it with a red dot and a three power scope and open sites.
You’re right open sites are tough!!!
The next range trip I’m just gonna put backing paper on the entire target.
My guess is gonna be high right.
Way high right,ugh.
I just cannot believe that that rifle will go from 5 inches to not even hitting A 12 x 12 target with even one round.
 
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I owned two of these, rifles I gave one to my son.
It shot about a half inch to three-quarter inch better at 100 yards.
My venture to 200 yards with it was a shocker.
 
If your running an optic, and things all of a sudden start shooting poorly, my suspicion would be, something came loose. Check all the screws!
 
I suspect the Ruger ammo is loaded with .308 bullets, the same as its rifles bore diameter. The ak is probably .313, kinda stable at 100 yards, whirling dervishes by 200,
 
Is your red dot perfectly centered over the AK? Lots of side mounts aren't adjustable and if you're optic is not centered, then it will only be centered at the original zeroing distance. At 50 yards, is the group center shifted right/left as compared to where they're on at 100 yards?

As previously mentioned, a bullet stability issue could be a factor too. Are those factory loaded SST 7.62x39, which should be .310 or were they hand loaded and possibly .308 diameter? What weight, 123gr?

Saiga rifles are well made. They're not bullet hoses, despite what the internet says.
 
The Hornady out shoots the Wolf by about 1/2" AT 100 yards constantly. Factory loaded Hornady.
I have not used the red dot at 200 yards. When I did the groups were OK at 100. Almost as good as the 3 power scope.
The scope is solid no issues.
I have gotten 3 round 3.5" groups at 100 yards with the Saiga. The group I originally posted was a 9 shot group at 5".
Its the wild off the paper at 200 yards that has me scratching my head.
Basically it goes from ( three round groups ) 3.5" at 100 - to no hits on a 12" x 12" target at 200.00.
To get precise 115 yards not 100. Things are going straight to hell in 85 yards.
Again note at 115 yards the Hornady always outshoots the Wolf. Per the above suggestion I will bring Wolf when I return to 200 yards.

Thanks for the input Guys.
 
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https://share.icloud.com/photos/05dzM9gLCv2IlrJ9GsERHcVpA

Same Hornady ammo in my Ruger bolt action 16 inch barrel.
Most of the time it’ll be a three-quarter inch group but this one was my last group. still smiling.
The 7.62 x 39 Russian can be an accurate round obviously.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/02b7j_8-ZzHMWuknjlb40_v6A

“ Econo built American rifle“.

This rifle makes me smile every time I shoot it. It’s the most inexpensive rival I own.
It’s the rifle in my collection that has shot with no fuss and no muss right out of the box well.
I’m always shocked and how it groups with a 16 inch barrel no glass betting or tweaking
 
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Checking back to my saved targets with iron sights I’m getting about 5 inches three round group with the Saiga, 115 yards.
67 year old eyes.
 
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