45 COLT: Please tell me what I am missing...

Versatile Cartridge

The 45 Colt has been around so long that everything under the sun has been tried with it.
I like to shoot mild "cowboy action"loads in my USFA SAA and my Uberti Schofield breaktop.
I have a Ruger Blackhawk that handles Georgia Arms "Deerstopper"rounds-260 gr JHP @1200 fps-a lot of felt recoil,but manageable.
Buffalo Bore and some other speciality companies make stuff that is really hot,mainly for something like the Ruger Alaskan or the Freedom Arms revolvers.
The Blackhawk itself can safely shoot almost any commercial loading,but it's a question of how much punishment you want to put your hand through.
I broke my shooting hand really badly years ago and it never got altogether right so I stay on the moderate side of things.
 
That new Gold Dot sounds like a good self-defense round. Now if only I had a good pistol to shoot it in.

<pencil scratching sound as note-to-self is made>

But which gun will it be? Perhaps the Beretta Stampede with the 3-inch barrel and the birds-head grip. Safe to carry 6, you see.......

Even the old original blackpowder load was 900fps with the 255gr bullet.
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A wee historical note here: The troops in the 1870's got to compare the .45 Colt to the .45 Schofield, which was a weaker round. They liked the Schofield round enough that the Army started making the .45 Colt round in a load that matched the (reduced) power level of the Schofield. I believe they called it the ".45 Gov't".

Bart Noir
 
I got a box of Buffalo Bore standard pressure .45 Colt that claims 1,000fps from a 255gr bullet which gives you 566 ft/lbs and a Tayler KO of 16.

That's enough to kill any man or beast that walks the earth.
 
your missing alot. what that interesting article does is what some in the scientific industry call "formulating a hypothesis and then going out and finding data that can be tweaked to proove the hypothesis"


however this is well known. 45 colt is still in our arsenal because it works. it may not ahve the velocity level of 44magnum, but velocity is not everything. its all based upon mass x velocity.

the thing is, i can buy 44 magnum ammo that generates 1300 foot pounds in a long barreled revolver. But the same armchair experts that tell me to ditch the 45 colt in favor of the 44 magnum tell me that "if you use a 44 magnum with anykind of 44 magnum ammo for self defense against your local home invader, youll go to jail simply because the jury will think you have ""dirty harry"" syndrome and are a dangerous vigalante".
 
We need to remember, first, that .45 Colt today encompasses both "Cowboy" ammo (loaded light, for safe use in old revolvers) and modern, full-power loads.
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I have to disagree with part of this statement. "cowboy" loads are NOT loaded light for safe use in old revolvers. Cowboy loads are loaded light for rapid recovery from recoil (saving time) when playing cowboy action shooting games.

ANY old blackpowder revolver in safe functional mechanical condition will be safe with the standard factory ammo, which is specifically loaded to BE SAFE in these guns, and has been since the factories switched from using black powder to smokeless.

There are basically three different power levels for .45 Colt in use today.

1) The original factory ammo that has been loaded since the introduction of the round, a 255gr bullet at black powder speeds and pressures (850-900fps, give or take depending on individual guns tolerances and barrel length),

2) Heavy loads delivering 1000fps and up (some factory, capable of use in Colt and similar guns, some factory and meant for guns stronger than the Colt, and handloads for Rugers and similar strong guns).

3) Cowboy action loads, lighter than normal standard loads, intended for playing games where speed is a factor, not power.

For me, since I don't play cowboy games, and I handload, cowboy ammo is useful only as a source of brass, and buying the empty brass is cheaper. Don't confuse "cowboy" ammo as anything other than what it is, target ammo best for a particular game, just as .38 SPL wadcutters are best for target shooting.

SO, in any fair comparison of a cartridge's potential, using data from target or other light loaded specialty ammo, and comparing it to "standard" loads from other rounds is neither fair, nor appropriate.
 
i have 3 uberti colt replicas in 45 lc and i love shooting them. i am a beginer reloader and so far have only reloaded for the 45 lc. to me nothing feels better in your hand or aims as naturally than a colt replica six gun or a 1911 and nothing is more fun to shoot than a 45 acp or a 45 lc. i could be happy if the only guns i had were 45 cowboy six guns and my 1911's in 45........oh and my 22's :)
 
According to one of the most objective ballistics authorities, Ballistics By The inch, 45 colt seems somewhat inferior to the 44 magnum and 45 ACP, because it is several hundred fps slower.
http://http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/45colt.html
And so, can you guys (and gals) please clear up for me why 45 LC is such a popular handgun round? What am I missing here?
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A few things. One is the underlying assumption that velocity is the sole measure of a cartridge's worth, leaving out worthwhile factors like accuracy.

The 45 Colt has been around long enough that there is a wide spread of loads. If you compare the softest 45 Colt load to a 45 ACP, then the ACP is faster. However, if you compare the hottest 45 Colt loads to 45 ACP, then the Colt loads are faster.

I once had identical N-frame Mountain Guns, one in 45 Colt and one in 44 Mag. Sure the Mag was more powerful with most loads, but a reasonable 45 Colt handload gave as much power as I could shoot accurately. I suppose with enough practice it might be possible to shoot the 44 Mag with the same level of accuracy, but I decided that if a 250 grain SWC at 900 fps wouldn't handle it, I'd use a rifle. I sold the Mag and kept the Colt.
 
I dunno about calling the .45 Colt "inferior".

I shoot a 300 grain bullet at around 1250 fps, and can push it harder if I want to. Actually, I'm planning on backing off to about 1000 fps, simply because I don't NEED 1250 fps for most uses.

The .45 Colt can be all the .45 ACP is and more. Ditto for comparing it to the .44 mag. It has it's advantages in bullet diameter and weight, and in the right gun can be pushed to impressive velocities.

Daryl
 
dunno... think my 45 Colt carry gun is cool :cool: I shoot the Buffalo Bore standard pressure rounds which have more energy than a 45 ACP, ( though likely close to the same out of my snubbie... )

older... but IMO definately not obsolite...

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And so, can you guys (and gals) please clear up for me why 45 LC is such a popular handgun round? What am I missing here?
Thank you much and stay safe!
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It is accurate when shot in mechanically correct firearms. If you have one with mismatched chamber throats and barrel diameters, it will never shoot well. My first 45 LC was a M25-5 that had .455 throats and all I had were 452 cast bullets. It did not shoot well. Leadly too. Gunwriters have reported second or third generation Colt SAA's with throats as large as 458" !. A current magazine article has Colt Frontiers at .455". Better but not great. The ruger 45 LC's I had were both .452" chamber mouths and shot very well with commercial cast and jacketed. In 1988 S&W changed their chamber diameters, current production S&W has .452 chamber mouths, and the two I own are very accurate.

To me the 45 LC hits hard on target without a huge muzzle blast or a lot of recoil. It definitely has more gas at 50 yards than a 230 RN out of a 45 ACP but does not beat me up like a 44 Mag.

So I like it.
 
.45 Colt is a good complement to the .45ACP if you're a reloader. It can handle hunting duties as well as the .44Mag, can be run for cowboy action, and can do it without having to stock a different bullet type as is necessary with the .44Mag.

My dad just tooled up to reload for his new .45 Colt. Since we both reload .45ACP and I cast for it, all we had to do was get dies and brass. Primers, bullets, and most powders are useful in both. We run the same cast bullets through both of them. The .45 Colt can reach decent velocity with the wide offerings of lighter 200-230gr bullets, and recoil is somewhat reduced vs the bigger traditional 255gr loads. A 200gr cast lead hollowpoint makes for impressive expansion out of either round.
 
I like .45lc, and I also like .44 mag. One of them being better than the other makes no difference to me. It's like saying the 45 ACP guys are dumb because .45 mag is better. Also the same saying the .40 is garbage because the 11mm is better. And .45 colt is still a pretty stout round. It's no S&W .500, but it's still a good round. Personally I'd love to get a revolver in .45lc and a long barrel derringer in .45lc. If I ever conceal carry, that'd be what I'd like to go with possibly one day.
 
My .45 Colts are LRNFP bullets which move out of my 5.5 inch barrel at 980+/- ft per sec.
This is a standard pressure load.

If I could get a 230g 45 ACP going that fast (safely) I would be a happy guy.

A lot of the loads are very low pressure cause some guy may stick it into a “turn of the century gun”.

Depending on the Handgun you can load much hotter rounds.

Snake
 
One of my favorite discussions!!!!!!!

First of all, understand that I own and love both the .45 and the .44. Both are capable cartridges that offer a wide range of performance, but the .45 beats out the .44 IN A RUGER BLACKHAWK OR SIMILAR GUN. This is because the .45 offers more case capacity and a larger surface area for pressure to work against. Force= Pressure X Area. Generally speaking, the .45 will do anything that the .44 can do, but with a shorter barrel or less pressure.

But, don't take my word for it. Check out these articles by John Linebaugh. Linebaugh has probably done more research on this particular topic than anyone else, and has been building high performance .45 Colts for thirty years or better.

http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/heavyweight_bullets.htm

http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/dissolving_the_myth.htm

This debate will probably ever end, but if you are on the .44 side of the fence and wish to disagree with what Mr. Linebaugh has to say, I would love to see what evidence you may have to support your views.

JW
 
After quite a bit of research into available retail .44 magnum and .45 colt rounds I have found that at the same bullet weight .44 magnum tends to top out at about 50-100 ft/lbs energy more than .45 colt.... With only one exception that I have seen so far, the 340 grain +P+ from Buffalo Bore that hits a ridiculous 1649 ft/lbs, over 350 ft/lbs more than the most powerful .45 colt I can find. However, that is not the sort of round you carry for anything other than hunting pretty big game.

So what does it really come down to? .45acp is right out. Doesn't even begin to compete with the heavy .45 colt stuff. .45 colt vs .44 magnum? You give up a little energy with the .45 colt, but you gain an extra .23 inches of bullet diameter. Sounds like a toss-up to me.

Then there is handloading.... Where you can get the same energy, or more, out of .45 colt + the larger diameter of the bullet. When you consider that .45 colt is probably a bit better, but it is still close enough to a toss up to make no odds.


One other interesting point about .44 magnum. Despite all his talk, Dirty Harry says in Magnum Force that he actually loads his big old Smith and Wesson 29 revolver with light .44 special loads. It looks like he has a big gun for the intimidation factor and to help control recoil so be can be more accurate.... And indeed he is the best shot on the police force probably in no small part due to using a light load in a heavy gun.
 
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