444 vs 450 vs 45-70

U

Ultra12

New member
i would like to add a big caliber gun to my collection and always wanted a lever action. since NYC has Nazi laws all I am allowed is 5 shot mag. So Marlin is the only one i found that satisfies all 3. now i know very little about 40 cal so who better to ask than members of this forum. I know 45-70 is the most versatile of the 3 but i do see 444 a bit cheaper (when it comes to rifles on gunbroker). Perhaps you guys can help me out. I will be looking to get a 22' inch barrel. Not sure about 18.5 one as i am not looking for a bush gun since i do hunt in NY and most shots are between 60-150 yards. so ballistics are important to me. thanks guys
 
450 Marlin is loaded to hot 45-70 levels, most commercially loaded 45-70 is loaded down to accomodate the old guns like the Trapdoors and such. 444 Marlin is a 44-caliber cartridge based on a rimmed standard head size cartridge, with ballistics surpassing those milder 45-70 loads mentioned above. Any of the 3 will cleanly take a deer out to well beyond 200 yds and then some, their shortcomongs are trajectory and recoil.
 
I would choose the 45/70 . easier to find ammo ,more ammo selection .
From light loads to heavy loads ,it will take anything in North America.
The 444 is a good round but most .429 cal bullets are made for the 44mag .
 
450 Marlin comes close (within 200 fps) to 458 Win Mag at least in muzzle velocity, but don't shoot it if you have any loose fillings. 45-70 is versatile in that there are a great number of loads for it. 444 Marlin is a poor attempt to get 45-70 performance in someything with "Marlin" attached to it. For deer, you will be way overgunned with any of the three of them. If you want to go larger bore try the .35 Rem. The Marlin 1896 also comes in that caliber. It's a much better choice for deer and black bear and wont hurt you when you shoot it. You could also try an older gun in 358 Win.
 
Many years ago I bought a Marlin 444 w/ a 24" barrel. The only round available at that time was the 240 gr and accuracy was terrible. I found that the Hornady 265gr was very accurate with IMR 4198 powder. If I had a choice today it would have to be the 45-70 as you can find the ammo almost anywhere and I am sure it is very accurate also. My 2cents.....

Lemmon
 
My 450 Marlin has heavy recoil & is hard on parts had it 3 years been to the repair shop 3 times FTF OR CYCLE not what u want in the bear woods My money would go on the 45-70 just MO.MY 450 has less than 70 rounds fired.
 
.45-70 essentially same power potential, a lot of history, and more choices - more gun choices and more ammunition choices from low power 405 grain Remingtons to Buffalo Bore or Garrett Cartridges.
 
I like the 444 but I own several 45-70s in both lever and falling block actions. As noted above, it can do anything the 444 or 450 can do, while being more versatile.

If you buy the Marlin 45-70, budget for the Wild West Trigger Happy Kit. It makes an enormous difference. You'll probably also want their Bear Proof Ejector.
 
close?

450 Marlin = 350 grain bullet at 2100 fps.
458 Win. = 350 grain bullet at 2500 fps. (and 500 grain bullets at 2100fps.)
The Marlin is a powerful round but ....close? About as close as the 45/70.

45/70 Gov't = 350 grain bullet at 2100 fps - but not for all actions.

Pete
 
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I would choose the 45/70 . easier to find ammo ,more ammo selection .
Click to expand...

+1. You can find 45-70 Gov't most any place and there is a much bigger selection of ammo. As mentioned, if you have a modern gun like the Ruger No. 1 you can shoot everything from mild to African big game hot. The 45-70 can do virtually any thing you want it to do.
 
45-70.

The rifle may cost a bit more, but ammo is easier to find and it is more versatile. The 444 ain't bad. If I already had one I wouldn't trade it for a 45-70. The 45-70 is much easier to find than 450 Marlin ammo and can be loaded to about the same levels if you want the hot loads. Standard level 45-70 loads are just fine for most uses.
 
I prefer the .444, but mine are out of a Winchester(will handle quite a bit more pressure). Have a Marlin 1895 in 450, a 1886 in 45-70 (actually about nine in various actions in the 45-70). But when it comes to hunting, the .444 will do all the .45-70/450 will do, depending how you load it...and in an emergency pinch, I can use .44 Mag from my side arm out of it.
 
The .45-70 is so versatile, it seems hard to beat unless you have strong reason for another. As in, you have access to a bunch of ammo, or already have the rifle, etc.
 
"
ok....but which one to choose
How about some info so we can make an intelligent recommendation?

Do you hunt? What game? How long range? Do you reload? "


i do hunt in NY and would like to try bear ( the reason for this gun) range is usually 60-150 yards( mentioned before in previous post) and no i do not reload
 
As a designated bear gun, the 450 Marlin is a good choice. You want the power in that case. And 450 Marlin is as easy to find as the ++P 45-70 ammo.
 
Depending on your pricepoint, WildAlaska makes variants of the Marlin Guide Gun in .457 Magnum, which is a very hot load. The rifles will also shoot regular .45-70 loads. So, if you want big power, plus .45-70 versatility, you might want to check wildwestguns.com.
 
Deer & Black Bear are handily killed every year with the good old 30-30, out to 150 yards. So, it would stand to reason that a 444, a 450 M, or a 45-70 Gov. would all three do the job and then some. If you can find a 444 for the better price, go for it.
 
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