357 mag compare to the 40 and 45?

Most powerful is not necessarily the best. sometimes less powerful bullets are better stoppers because more powerful ones will blow straight through the target and waste much of their energy on objects behind.
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Well, except that a bullet's energy isn't what kills. Damage to internal organs is what kills. The bullet passing through those organs is what damages them, and the deeper a bullet penetrates, the more tissue and organs it's likely to damage

Also, if one uses the same bullet loaded to two different velocities, then one will have more "energy" to waste. If the faster bullet blows out the far side of a target, and "wastes" some of it's energy, then it's because it has more to waste.

The damage done by a bullet on it's way through a target has nothing to do with whether or not it has enough momentum to exit the target or not. It has far more to do with whether or not the bullet expands, and how much it expands on it's way through.


Anyway, the best round for personal defense is Federal 125 gr. JHP. This round is the gold standard of handgun stopping power. It's the round that earned the .357 its nickname "king of the streets." Use this round and you will live happily ever after.
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That's a pretty bold statement, considering that bullet technology has improved drastically since the days when the .357 was "king of the streets".

I like Federal ammo just fine, but I'd hesitate to call any cartridge, bullet, or combination "best".

Daryl
 
Damage to internal organs is what kills. The bullet passing through those organs is what damages them, and the deeper a bullet penetrates, the more tissue and organs it's likely to damage

Also, if one uses the same bullet loaded to two different velocities, then one will have more "energy" to waste. If the faster bullet blows out the far side of a target, and "wastes" some of it's energy, then it's because it has more to waste.
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Isn't it odd that in hunting, you want a bullet to expand fully and pass through the animal so it will bleed out faster (and have a better blood trail). But with a pistol we don't want the bullet to pass through. Not because "dumping all the energy" makes for a better stop, but because we don't want to harm anyone beyond the target. Obviously, a fully expanded bullet with sharp cutting edges passing fully through the BG will cause more damage and allow for faster bleeding and a quicker stop to hostilities ... at the cost of the bullet continuing on.
 
No one can argue ballistics---the .357 is king. It is also a proven top tier stopper. And just try deer hunting with a 9mm or .45 ACP (better yet--don't). :rolleyes:

However, the tactical advantage of having 15 or 18 or more proven stopper 9mm JHPs, which recoil less and are vastly easier on the ears, cannot be ignored for SD sitations.
 
im a 357 fan but I think you would be fine with any of them... I like the 357 because I like revolvers and have a good stack of ammo on hand.

there is no magical ammo, go with what you like and are willing to practice with.

Id trust a 380 over a 357 magnum if I had never shot a 357 and my only had gun experience was with the 380... does that make sense?
 
Bullit energy

Quote:
"Damage to internal organs is what kills. The bullet passing through those organs is what damages them, and the deeper a bullet penetrates, the more tissue and organs it's likely to damage

Also, if one uses the same bullet loaded to two different velocities, then one will have more "energy" to waste. If the faster bullet blows out the far side of a target, and "wastes" some of it's energy, then it's because it has more to waste."

I have to disagree with this statement. I've killed deer with heavy bullets that went through and light bullets that didn't. The most damage to the dear was a 140 grain 7mm mag at about 450 yards. A broad side shot. The bullet went through his heart and stopped in the far shoulder, dumping all of the energy rather than exiting. That far shoulder was pulverized. The bone was broken and the meat was just a massive bruise.
I'm a big fan of the .45 but a fast moving .357 mag that expands fully and doesn't exit is going to do a lot of damage.
 
Centerfire rifle cartridges and service pistol cartridges, as well as with their wounding mechanisms, are entirely different animals.
 
The 357mag is a little more stouter than the 40 and 45acp. I have a 357mag in a Ruger Security Six and a 1911 45acp (no 40) and like them both for their intended use. Im sure someone will chime in a say which one is better. I like them both.
 
Rifles and pistols are different animals

"Centerfire rifle cartridges and service pistol cartridges, as well as with their wounding mechanisms, are entirely different animals."

While there is certainly a difference in speed and energy the principle is dumping all of the energy inside the "target" is going to damage more tissue than a golf ball size hole that goes through the target. I'm not talking about a .25 auto as I don't think the same principle would apply to a much smaller round. The bullet needs enough speed and mass to damage tissue beyond the physical reach of the bullet. I think that this is what the .357 mag does better on man sized targets than other pistol/handgun rounds.
 
What is the most powerful 357 I can get and it that hollow point?
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One that you reload soooooooo hottttttttttttt that the bg and yourself get blown back off your feet in equal distance:eek:

The 357 round is taller, slimmer than the 40 which we could compare to a pleasantly plump female and to the 45 as a full figured female. I personally think the 357 is a handsome round so tall and slim.:rolleyes::eek:
 
Every time I happen across one of these threads I am amazed at just how completely clueless the average gun owner can be when it comes to understanding terminal ballistics.

Even a sophmore level, public school physics textbook would show you that most of what has been pontificated here is simply rubbish.
No matter how "scientific" you think your theory may be, no matter how "right" it sounds to you, junk science is still junk.
 
as i sit here one thing keeps coming into my head...

put down the algebra book, and pick up an anatomy book.

whats the end result of debating the calibers? to see whats better at stopping a bg? to kill a bg?

what is the end result of shooting a bg? to stop him? to kill him?

a .22 in the right place will do more than a .40/.45/.357 in the foot.
 
This weekend i went shooting with my father, who has a .40 and I have a .357. Its amazing how much more kick my .357 has even with a very similar grain round. They both would more than get the job done though. I think it comes down to what you were raised on and what you feel more comfortable with.
 
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This weekend i went shooting with my father, who has a .40 and I have a .357. Its amazing how much more kick my .357 has even with a very similar grain round.
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All other things being equal, automatic pistols generally have less recoil than revolvers. The action of a semiautomatic acts kind of like a shock absorber and soaks up a lot of the recoil.
 
Since training in the Marines I have an affection for the 1911 A1 .45 ACP, and know that a 230 gn. bullet from it, put in the right location, will stop most people promptly. Unless the bullet is put in the right place, whether BB gun or cannon, don't expect much. I am very fond of the .357 Magnum. Next to the 1911A1 it is the pistol I carry most, a 4" S&W 686. I am currently loading 125 gn Gold Dots to Super Vel velocities, and I am glad I am doing it in an L frame. These loads played hell with the K frame guns in the day. But, it has competition in the summer, that being a Springfield Armory XD-40SC. I am impressed with the XD, and with the .40 S&W cartridge. But, while it is small, light, easily concealable, and 10 shot with one in the pipe, it is not a .357 Magnum in anything but muzzle blast.;)

Lafe
 
If it takes 15 rounds to stop one bad guy or even two your doing a lot of missing. Depending on where you are that is NOT GOOD.

Forget about capacity and stopping power, focus should be on hitting the target and only the target.
 
Old words of Wisedom

I think these fit the bill quite nicely;

You can't miss fast enough to win a gunfight.
unknown

In ten years nobody will remember the details of caliber, stance, or tactics. They will only remember who lived.
unknown

Speed is fine but accuracy is final.
Bill Jordan

One hundred rounds do not constitute fire power. One hit constitutes fire power.
Major General Merritt Edson U.S.M.C.
 
Their performance in actual gunfights can't be compared. All of them produce satisfactory results most of the time and all of them fail occasionally. That's about the best we can do.
 
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2) It has been suggested (can't remember where to quote) that there were more experienced, practiced and "gun savvy" officers using the Magnums as an option, when a .38 or .38 +P may have been department issued

Whooa there! You're talking about an era when "qualification" meant standing there with hand in pocket slow firing for top score, and then putting brass in pocket before reloading. Wasn't uncommon for officers to go thru a career without using a gun.

Todays training is far more realistic and combat related and times have changed.


Sorry wrong. Depends on where you were trained I guess.

I was a cop back the too. I never got all silly for the 125 Grn 357. I used 145 silvertips. The 357 is an awesome cartridge and any hollowpoint works just fine. One shot stops is a myth, sometimes it happens sometimes it don't, unless its a 12 gauge slug.
 
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