Which caliber for my girlfriend
- Thread starter JTReloader
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Mike Irwin
Staff
"Case in point, a few years back the late gun writer Finn Aagaard told of how his father armed with only one rifle, I'm thinking an original 95 Mauser in 7x57 for all his shooting chores. The only load he used was the 175/175 gr. round nosed bullet at roughly 2300 FPS. He used the rifle not only for stock protection but shot game from the small antelopes to the Cape Buffalo with that rifle. (not me) His father once took one two cattle killing lions with one shot each with that 7x57 and that slow moving 175 gr. bullet."
That article, or a very similar article, ran in American Rifleman back in the 1990s when I was on staff. I often edited Finn's articles for Rifleman.
It's something of lost knowledge in our magnum era that those older cartridges using long for their caliber at relatively sedate speed bullets were HIGHLY regarded for just about all kinds of hunting.
I've often though that I'd like to rechamber a Remington or Winchester for one of the most underappreciated of the old timers, the 6.5x50 Arisaka.
I have a funny feeling that it's capable of a lot more than anyone ever was willing to give it credit for.
That article, or a very similar article, ran in American Rifleman back in the 1990s when I was on staff. I often edited Finn's articles for Rifleman.
It's something of lost knowledge in our magnum era that those older cartridges using long for their caliber at relatively sedate speed bullets were HIGHLY regarded for just about all kinds of hunting.
I've often though that I'd like to rechamber a Remington or Winchester for one of the most underappreciated of the old timers, the 6.5x50 Arisaka.
I have a funny feeling that it's capable of a lot more than anyone ever was willing to give it credit for.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Mike Irwin said:
That was before "magnum" rifle cartridges. The name "Magnum" is to other rifle cartridges what kryptonite is to Superman. Sure, back in the day they were capable... but that was before Magnum cartridges saturated the shooting sports world with Magnumite radiation. Now only Magnum cartridges are capable.
Back in 70s my wife got stitches from my Win 70fw pre 64 in 308. It is a kicker
for sure with 150gr loads or bigger. I have shot 700BDLs in 308 that didn't kick
enough to complain about. My advice is to stay away from feather weights. And
get her a gun that fits. If it's a joy to carry, it will be a devil to shoot. You can't
have both.
for sure with 150gr loads or bigger. I have shot 700BDLs in 308 that didn't kick
enough to complain about. My advice is to stay away from feather weights. And
get her a gun that fits. If it's a joy to carry, it will be a devil to shoot. You can't
have both.
Ammo is easy to get for any of the 6.5 these days, probably CM tops.
You can get a fairly heavy Savage 10T Varmint Cabella only (and maybe Dicks etc) in that caliber at a reasonable cost.
I don't think its a hard combo, I think its downright easy.
Nothing against a 7mm 08 but that is not as common.
You can buy the Savage and if she does not like the stock Boyds has a whole range of them. The Laminates are no different that any composite as they are as stable as plastic of glass.
You could go with an Axis for lower cost and do the same test.
You can get a fairly heavy Savage 10T Varmint Cabella only (and maybe Dicks etc) in that caliber at a reasonable cost.
I don't think its a hard combo, I think its downright easy.
Nothing against a 7mm 08 but that is not as common.
You can buy the Savage and if she does not like the stock Boyds has a whole range of them. The Laminates are no different that any composite as they are as stable as plastic of glass.
You could go with an Axis for lower cost and do the same test.
Mike Irwin
Staff
"That was before "magnum" rifle cartridges. The name "Magnum" is to other rifle cartridges what kryptonite is to Superman. Sure, back in the day they were capable... but that was before Magnum cartridges saturated the shooting sports world with Magnumite radiation. Now only Magnum cartridges are capable."
Magnums have been with us, really, pretty much since the first days of the metallic cartridge smokeless powder era.
Early on, they were known as Express cartridges. Then the first "magnum" came out, the .375 H&H.
What all of those cartridges had in common, though, was that they were targeted at the dangerous game (particularly Africa) markets.
Small bore magnum cartridges for the general purpose market didn't really start appearing on the market until the 1950s, so it's really a relatively recent concept.
Magnums have been with us, really, pretty much since the first days of the metallic cartridge smokeless powder era.
Early on, they were known as Express cartridges. Then the first "magnum" came out, the .375 H&H.
What all of those cartridges had in common, though, was that they were targeted at the dangerous game (particularly Africa) markets.
Small bore magnum cartridges for the general purpose market didn't really start appearing on the market until the 1950s, so it's really a relatively recent concept.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Back when I worked on staff at American Rifleman magazine I wrote an article about the Bank of Boulder's Weatherby promotion.
A few months later I got a VERY hostile letter from a guy who got himself one of the mid-range Weatherby mags... .300, IIRC, and got a serious scoping.
He was screaming about how dangerous the rifle/scope combination was, blah blah blah. He included some pictures of the rifle with the scope on it (looked completely normal), pictures of his injuries (did NOT look normal, guy really got bashed), and, best of all, a picture of him setting up to fire the shot (taken by a friend).
I looked at all of the stuff, passed it around the office to get confirmation of my thoughts, and then wrote him back...
Basically a very short and sweet letter --- "Stop creeping up on the scope, dumbass..."
The picture his friend took? You couldn't have gotten a dollar bill between his forehead and the rear of the scope he was creeping up on it so badly.
A few months later I got a VERY hostile letter from a guy who got himself one of the mid-range Weatherby mags... .300, IIRC, and got a serious scoping.
He was screaming about how dangerous the rifle/scope combination was, blah blah blah. He included some pictures of the rifle with the scope on it (looked completely normal), pictures of his injuries (did NOT look normal, guy really got bashed), and, best of all, a picture of him setting up to fire the shot (taken by a friend).
I looked at all of the stuff, passed it around the office to get confirmation of my thoughts, and then wrote him back...
Basically a very short and sweet letter --- "Stop creeping up on the scope, dumbass..."
The picture his friend took? You couldn't have gotten a dollar bill between his forehead and the rear of the scope he was creeping up on it so badly.
Don't over think this, one of the 6.5's is your answer. If someone already owns a 6.5X55, 260, or any other 6.5 and they handload they are good. If buying new there isn't any reason to choose anything other than the Creedmoor. Especially if buying off the shelf ammo.
The 7-08 is a fine cartridge, but recoil and performance wise you're splitting some mighty fine hairs to be able to show any improvement over 308. If 308 recoil is a problem no shooter will ever notice the difference with a 7-08.
The 6.5 CM and 260 have recoil closer to 243 than 308 and no game animal will ever notice the difference when hit with a 6.5, 7-08, or 308 out to 500 yards. But beyond 500 the 6.5 pulls away. And all 3 of them have proven to be effective elk killers out to 500 yards.
The 7-08 is a fine cartridge, but recoil and performance wise you're splitting some mighty fine hairs to be able to show any improvement over 308. If 308 recoil is a problem no shooter will ever notice the difference with a 7-08.
The 6.5 CM and 260 have recoil closer to 243 than 308 and no game animal will ever notice the difference when hit with a 6.5, 7-08, or 308 out to 500 yards. But beyond 500 the 6.5 pulls away. And all 3 of them have proven to be effective elk killers out to 500 yards.
^^ Hahaha! ^^
Mike, I would bet his scope was not adjusted properly, and maybe not enough eye relief either.
I was at the range last week, and witnessed a guy setting up to shoot a rifle from a bench. He stuffed a full size pillow between the but and his shoulder before he shot. I don't know what caliber, as I never talked to him, but what ever it was, it was apparently too much for him.
Mike, I would bet his scope was not adjusted properly, and maybe not enough eye relief either.
I was at the range last week, and witnessed a guy setting up to shoot a rifle from a bench. He stuffed a full size pillow between the but and his shoulder before he shot. I don't know what caliber, as I never talked to him, but what ever it was, it was apparently too much for him.
Mike Irwin
Staff
"Mike, I would bet his scope was not adjusted properly, and maybe not enough eye relief either."
From the photos he provided, the scope was right where it should have been on that rifle, which our on-staff gunsmith confirmed when he looked at the photos.
I also compared the mounting with the Weatherby we had in the arms locker (which had been given to NRA by the Bank of Boulder) and again, the scope on his rifle was mounted properly.
What WASN'T mounted properly, though, was him, on the gun. In the picture that he sent along with his letter he looked like Quasimodo he was so hunched over on the stock.
His getting scope face was, in our estimation, 100% his fault.
From the photos he provided, the scope was right where it should have been on that rifle, which our on-staff gunsmith confirmed when he looked at the photos.
I also compared the mounting with the Weatherby we had in the arms locker (which had been given to NRA by the Bank of Boulder) and again, the scope on his rifle was mounted properly.
What WASN'T mounted properly, though, was him, on the gun. In the picture that he sent along with his letter he looked like Quasimodo he was so hunched over on the stock.
His getting scope face was, in our estimation, 100% his fault.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Well, at that time he really could have benefited from some stitches and an ice pack. 
But yeah, my guess is that he wasn't familiar with hard kicking scoped rifles. What you can get away with on a .308 you'll never get away with in a .300 Wby.
But yeah, my guess is that he wasn't familiar with hard kicking scoped rifles. What you can get away with on a .308 you'll never get away with in a .300 Wby.
Friend just killed this cow elk last week with his 6.5 Swede, 140 grain Nosler Partition. Shot was at an extreme up-hill angle at something over 300 yards. One shot brought her down The hit was low in the chest.
The rifle is a customized Carl Gustav I made for him a while back. Converted to cock on opening, new barrel, bolt handle and trigger with the stock made to fit him. The old fashioned patch-box is a "catch-all" and contains a combo tool and cleaning rod.
IMG_0154 by Steve Zihn, on Flickr
The rifle is a customized Carl Gustav I made for him a while back. Converted to cock on opening, new barrel, bolt handle and trigger with the stock made to fit him. The old fashioned patch-box is a "catch-all" and contains a combo tool and cleaning rod.
IMG_0154 by Steve Zihn, on Flickr
