What's wrong with my ammo?

[madmag]

Azredhawk44 had a good answer.

Heavier ammo will experience less set-back since there is more surface friction inside the case.

Can't agree with that. Not my experience. I have had same issues with 230g.

In fact, that just does not make sense. Surface friction has Little to do to with the weight, it has to do with the total case contact area.

Bottom line, if you have a weak crimp coupled with a pistol like the 1911 that applies higher pressure to the round when chambering then you can have set-back problems....no matter the bullet weight!

 

[brickeyee]

Reloads or factory loads?
If they are factory how many times have they been chambered?

If they are reloads, over belling cases can reduce the case tension.

While the taper crimp can still remove the bell, it cannot restore the lost tension since it cannot size the brass smaller.

Try belling only enough to get the bullet started into the case (about 1/32 of an inch).

If the problem persists you can polish the expander down slightly, or change to a Hornady M-die designed for lead bullets.

 

[NoleMan]

Good thing you caught that. That round is scary looking. You shoot that and a potential Kaboom could happen.

 

[madmag]

Good thing you caught that.

Yes.

Did you ever wonder about some of the incidents that have blown shell casings. Normally everyone blames hand loads or factory over loading, but maybe some are due to severe set-back?

 

[TheMayor]

No, I definitely won't be shooting that round. It's not a reload. I'll chamber a little more carefully since I do load and unload frequently. I don't have the problem with my pistols with polished feed ramps.

 

[madmag]

I don't have the problem with my pistols with polished feed ramps.

I can chamber rounds eith my P90 (polished feed ramp) with no set-back problem. But If I do the same with my 1911 then I can have problems. Lesson learned.

 

[Sport45]

You can save that round if you have an inertia bullet puller. Just tap it back out to where it's suppose to be and then check neck tension by pressing the bullet against the side of your bench.

 

[NavyLT]

You can save that round if you have an inertia bullet puller. Just tap it back out to where it's suppose to be and then check neck tension by pressing the bullet against the side of your bench.

And if you know someone who reloads, they can run it up into a die and reapply the crimp. Or you can get a press and a set of dies and start yourself. You'll practice a LOT more if you start reloading!

 

[brickeyee]

And if you know someone who reloads, they can run it up into a die and reapply the crimp.

You cannot restore adequate case tension by just crimping again.

 

[Sevens]

Most any reputable ammo producer will give you some sort of freebie or reimbursement if you contact them and send the product or pics and lot numbers to them.

This is REALLY dangerous territory for handgun ammo. It's possible, I wouldn't say it's common, but with the very high price of PREMIUM ammo, it shouldn't be accepted and should be addressed.

To "fix" them at the load bench properly, you'd have to pull the bullets, resize the brass, flare it a touch, then re-seat and crimp. You might be able to "fix" them with a Lee FCD die.

In any case, what's most important, IMO, is that you don't attempt to shoot them, you contact Federal/ATK asap, with all the lot numbers of all the same ammo that you bought and keep a sharp eye on all of your carry ammo all the time.

At the risk of stepping on toes (I think it's worth it), I do truly believe that if you had the same situation with .40 S&W in a Glock, you'd have a good chance of seeing some shrapnel.

 

[madmag]

I do truly believe that if you had the same situation with .40 S&W in a Glock, you'd have a good chance of seeing some shrapnel.

Good point.

I suspect some of the case failings we have seen photos of are due to over-pressure from severe set-back rounds. No evidence after the round has fired, so we are normally left with re-load mistakes, or factory load mistakes. No one brings up that it could have had the proper charge but was set-back causing over-pressure.

 

[Hook686]

September 2, 2009, 01:36 PM #25
TheMayor
Junior Member


Join Date: April 29, 2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 6 No, I definitely won't be shooting that round. It's not a reload. I'll chamber a little more carefully since I do load and unload frequently. I don't have the problem with my pistols with polished feed ramps.

With an autoloading pistol, how does one 'Chamber a little more carefully' ? This question is from a revolver shooter, as I really am not comfortable with autoloaders simply because of the auto process being concealed.

 

[madmag]

With an autoloading pistol, how does one 'Chamber a little more carefully' ?

You can "ride" the slide. That is keep your hand on the slide and let it down gently. The down side is it may not chamber completely and require a little help with the hand. Also, once in firing mode then no more gentle chambering. It just slams home like normal.

 

[cliff987]

How much setback is possible, without causing concern using .40 as an example?

 

[Dragon55]

cliff987
I reload .40 and with all the stuff I've read no setback beyond the spec for the particular bullet and powder charge is the way to go. The .40 even at spec has way more pressure than most other handgun rounds. I've pulled a lot of bullets until I learned how to seat and crimp correctly.

 

[NWPilgrim]

There is no acceptable setback. You have to assume (for safety) that factory ammo is loaded to max pressures already. The 9mm and .40 don;t have excess room and are high pressure rounds. The .45 has extra room but is designed to be lower pressure.

Any setback will raise pressure, often times dramatically. Most cases of kabooms in police departments is traced back (as best as can be determined) by setback for the same reason as told by The Mayor: repeated chambering and unload cycles of the same top round in the mag due to on/off duty.

If you are not a reloader and notice setback, I would just trash the round (the USAF ought to have the means for this in the armory). If you are a reloader then you already should know how to recover the round as noted above: disassemble, and reload as primed brass.

Rotating your top mag round is a good idea. I would be careful not to ride the slide too softly though. You want it to be fully seated in the chamber and the extractor properly engaged. Personally I would release the slide as normal to ensure reliable firing and extraction and rely on the rotation of rounds for preventing setback.

Even with rotation the rounds still need tto be disposed of eventually. You could experiment with one round and cycle it until you can measure any setback to determine the number of times it can be used. Reduce that by 1/2 to be safe and then multiply by number of rounds in your carry mag. After that many days of carry all the rounds in the mag should be disposed of and loaded with fresh ammo. I suspect you could go a couple of months rotating rounds in one mag before there was any danger of setback.

 

[tipoc]

On crimping the .45 acp, only a light crimp to no crimp is needed. Over crimping can lead you to headspace problems. Because the case seats on the mouth over crimping can shorten the length of the case. Which can result in misfires and hangfires and this is why most ammo for semis is so lightly crimped. This includes factory ammo.

The down side of this is that it decreases the number of times you can rechamber any particular round in a semi. This is particularly the case in Browning type tilting barrels with the .45 round. In these guns the round has a particularly bumpy ride. The round is smacked into the feed ramp, bumps across the chamber mouth, then smacks the roof of the chamber and finally is driven forward to seat on the case mouth. In some guns the trip has fewer bumps.

This isn't a "problem" it's just the way it is. Rotate your carry ammo and keep an eye on it. limit dporring the slide on any one round to 2-3 times.

tipoc

 

[bignz]

DON"T SHOOT THAT. Lower case capacity will result in higher pressures and potentially bad exploding (either case, case and side of gun, case, side of gun and hand, case...) things.

I'd send your picture to Federal and see what they say about replacement...

 

[gyvel]

I think the fact that it's Federal says it all. Doesn't Federal supply ammo to the U.S. government? And doesn't the U.S. government buy from the lowest bidder?

 

[Sgt127]

You can minimize the chances of bullet setback by riding the slide and being really watchful of your ammo...Good for you for catching that. Honestly, if I were in your position, constantly loading and unloading, I would carry a revolver....