An 8mm Model 98 Mauser will do anything a 30-06 will do if hand loaded properly. 2,700 fps with premium 165 to 180 grain projectiles will preform excellent for you on a bear. Most commercial 8mm bullets are sold to fire in the pre 1912(?) barrels which are smaller than the WWII Mausers. The muzzel velocity for most commercial 8mm's are in the 2,200 to 2,350 fps area. Not fast enough for longer, accurate shots orgood expansion with many projectiles.
What would be the best milsurp bolt gun to take into grizzly or brown bear country
- Thread starter smleno1mkIII
- Start date
Gator_Weiss
New member
Get yourself a decent K98 loaded with 8MM JS rounds in a softpoint
Get yourself a decent K98 loaded with 8MM handloads that duplicate the JS loadings or beyond.
In your cartridge bag, throw in a few 8mm RNSP rounds if you intend to shoot at ranges under 150 yards. Only put one RNSP in the rifle - in the chamber - because they may not feed well from the magazine like the spire points.
Do not use factory loaded 8mm mauser rounds, unless you special order from those vendors that sell them in the JS range. Most of the factory loaded 8mm is loaded down for safety in pressures. It works well for white tail deer, but I sure as hell wouldnt snipe away at a brown bear with it. You would probably wound him and who knows what happens after that?
Though it is not reccommended, Elephants have been killed with 8mm Mauser loading a solid bullet and firing into the brain. Cape Buffalo, Rhino, Hippo, have all been taken repeatedly with the 8mm Mauser. Read your history on South African hunting. Often only .303 and 8mm Mauser were all that were available in the old days down there.
The 8mm Mauser case has plenty of room in it for heavy loading. Plenty of room for your powder charges in that bottle. Bullets weighing anything at or over 180 grains will work for the project. Personally, I would load something in the way of the 220grn JSP. Place your shots carefully, and take them only under conditions where you KNOW you are going to connect well. You will get your bear. Just do it at a moderate range under good shooting conditions.
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NOTES / CUT-N-PASTE - 8MM ORIGINAL LOADINGS FROM WW-2 (This was not written by me)
Then I learned two things. Number one was Norma currently loads the 8mm Mauser with a 196-grain bullet at 2,500 fps, and number two was such was pretty much what a "standard" WWII load should be. In the beginning duplicating such wasn't so easy. American ammunition makers feared their factory loads might be fired in the old .318" barrels of pre-1905 8mm Mausers instead of thereafter standard .323" barrels. Therefore they load this cartridge only to about 35,000 psi. Good condition Mauser 98 actions can easily accommodate 50,000 psi. I discussed this with powder and bullet company ballisticians and then carefully developed a good full-power 8mm load closely approximating WWII military ballistics. It consists of the 195-grain Hornady Spire Point bullet over 48 grains of Hodgdon Varget powder for an average velocity of 2,480 fps from this particular rifle. (By the way, that normal 8mm factory load clocks 2,393 fps.)
Handloads Rule
When that handload was fired from my VZ24 sniper rifle, groups now stayed under two MOA on paper targets at both 100 and 200 yards, and also the bullet's trajectory closely followed the settings of the old scope. For our mutual birthday every year, I spend a week with Clint Smith, shooting and having fun.
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ANOTHER CUT-N-PASTE THIS WAS NOT WRITTEN BY ME:
The 8x57JS (8mm Mauser) By Chuck Hawks
Here are some cartridge specifications of interest to 8x57JS reloaders: bullet diameter .323", maximum COL 3.228", maximum case length 2.244", SAAMI MAP 37,000 cup.
Bullets from 125 to 220 grains are available, but the most popular are those between 150-200 grains.
Medium burning rifle powders are generally the most successful in the 8x57, including VARGET, H335, H380, H414, H4350, IMR 4064, IMR 4350, W748, and VIHT N-150.
Bullet / Wgt / Dia. Powder Powder Weight MV Primer
Speer 200gr .323 IMR 4064 42.0 2198 CCI-200
Speer 200gr .323 IMR 4064 46.0 2434 CCI-200
Speer 170gr .323 IMR 4064 45.0 2509 CCI-200
Speer 170gr .323 IMR 4064 49.0 2723 CCI-200
Speer 150gr .323 IMR 4064 47.0 2695 CCI-200
Speer 150gr .323 IMR 4064 51.0 2915 CCI-200
Get yourself a decent K98 loaded with 8MM handloads that duplicate the JS loadings or beyond.
In your cartridge bag, throw in a few 8mm RNSP rounds if you intend to shoot at ranges under 150 yards. Only put one RNSP in the rifle - in the chamber - because they may not feed well from the magazine like the spire points.
Do not use factory loaded 8mm mauser rounds, unless you special order from those vendors that sell them in the JS range. Most of the factory loaded 8mm is loaded down for safety in pressures. It works well for white tail deer, but I sure as hell wouldnt snipe away at a brown bear with it. You would probably wound him and who knows what happens after that?
Though it is not reccommended, Elephants have been killed with 8mm Mauser loading a solid bullet and firing into the brain. Cape Buffalo, Rhino, Hippo, have all been taken repeatedly with the 8mm Mauser. Read your history on South African hunting. Often only .303 and 8mm Mauser were all that were available in the old days down there.
The 8mm Mauser case has plenty of room in it for heavy loading. Plenty of room for your powder charges in that bottle. Bullets weighing anything at or over 180 grains will work for the project. Personally, I would load something in the way of the 220grn JSP. Place your shots carefully, and take them only under conditions where you KNOW you are going to connect well. You will get your bear. Just do it at a moderate range under good shooting conditions.
***************************************************************************
NOTES / CUT-N-PASTE - 8MM ORIGINAL LOADINGS FROM WW-2 (This was not written by me)
Then I learned two things. Number one was Norma currently loads the 8mm Mauser with a 196-grain bullet at 2,500 fps, and number two was such was pretty much what a "standard" WWII load should be. In the beginning duplicating such wasn't so easy. American ammunition makers feared their factory loads might be fired in the old .318" barrels of pre-1905 8mm Mausers instead of thereafter standard .323" barrels. Therefore they load this cartridge only to about 35,000 psi. Good condition Mauser 98 actions can easily accommodate 50,000 psi. I discussed this with powder and bullet company ballisticians and then carefully developed a good full-power 8mm load closely approximating WWII military ballistics. It consists of the 195-grain Hornady Spire Point bullet over 48 grains of Hodgdon Varget powder for an average velocity of 2,480 fps from this particular rifle. (By the way, that normal 8mm factory load clocks 2,393 fps.)
Handloads Rule
When that handload was fired from my VZ24 sniper rifle, groups now stayed under two MOA on paper targets at both 100 and 200 yards, and also the bullet's trajectory closely followed the settings of the old scope. For our mutual birthday every year, I spend a week with Clint Smith, shooting and having fun.
************************************************************************
ANOTHER CUT-N-PASTE THIS WAS NOT WRITTEN BY ME:
The 8x57JS (8mm Mauser) By Chuck Hawks
Here are some cartridge specifications of interest to 8x57JS reloaders: bullet diameter .323", maximum COL 3.228", maximum case length 2.244", SAAMI MAP 37,000 cup.
Bullets from 125 to 220 grains are available, but the most popular are those between 150-200 grains.
Medium burning rifle powders are generally the most successful in the 8x57, including VARGET, H335, H380, H414, H4350, IMR 4064, IMR 4350, W748, and VIHT N-150.
Bullet / Wgt / Dia. Powder Powder Weight MV Primer
Speer 200gr .323 IMR 4064 42.0 2198 CCI-200
Speer 200gr .323 IMR 4064 46.0 2434 CCI-200
Speer 170gr .323 IMR 4064 45.0 2509 CCI-200
Speer 170gr .323 IMR 4064 49.0 2723 CCI-200
Speer 150gr .323 IMR 4064 47.0 2695 CCI-200
Speer 150gr .323 IMR 4064 51.0 2915 CCI-200
Last edited:
earlthegoat2
New member
I dont see why Garand rifle would not be a stellar choice. Oh wait, just reread original post.
I though it was just about rebarrelling to 30-06.
Why not an M14 then. 20 rounds of rip roaring 308. Maybe not so many of these Milsurps around.
I though it was just about rebarrelling to 30-06.
Why not an M14 then. 20 rounds of rip roaring 308. Maybe not so many of these Milsurps around.
earlthegoat2 said:
Because the thread specifies "bolt gun".
Out of stuff I actually have, I don't know which I'd pick. Something short and light, with as much sectional density as possible... My Steyr-Mannlicher only has military ball ammo at the moment. I do have some heavy bullet loads in 7x57 lying about, and the Venezuelan FN carbine is a handy little piece...
