What is it?

R

robs9

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My brother in law gave me this rifle. Has No markings on it that I can find. It's obviously a bolt action. Internal magazine fed, no rear sight and seems to be a smooth bore. Has some kind of flash hider or muzzle brake or choke not sure what it is on the end of the barrel. Can anyone tell me what this thing is and what caliber it is?
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Do some measuring, that will help a lot.

My guess, right now, is that it is a bolt action SHOTGUN, most likely .410 caliber.

The design of the bolt shroud and the triggerguard is pure Mossberg, and the gun is likely one of the budget grade "no name" guns made for sale at dept and hardware stores.

Made in the US, before 1968, no markings or serial number was required by law. I have a tube fed .410 the only marking on it are "2 1/2 a & 3" shells".

A friend of mine had a 16ga Mossberg bolt action, it had the same bolt shroud and triggerguard with the finger "grooves". All the ones I've seen have been detachable mags, (12 & 16ga) so an internal mag is a bit of an oddity but it might have been the usual for that model .410.

Hope this helps.

Measure the bore I'm betting its a .410.
 
Thank for your answers. This may be a silly question. I have some 410 rounds that I have left over from a Taurus Judge. Can I use them in this gun?. Or is the projectiles not good for this gun?

And what was this gun designed for? A bolt action shotgun? And NO markings on it at all? How did anybody get parts for it?

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muzzle thing

That "thing" on the muzzle is an adjustable choke, likely Mossbergs version of the PolyChoke, of that era. Choke is a term used to describe the amount of constriction at the muzzle of a shotgun that will determine how dense a shot cloud the gun should discharge. The device should rotate on threads about its own axis, and function much in the way (well sort of) a nozzle works on a hose.
Given your guns age, I'd lube the area well before I tried to turn anything.

My family had one of those exact same guns, purchased at a hardware store, but as I recall, our gun was marked Mossberg.

Beware, the adjustable choke shot off our gun, never to be found.
 
intended use and shells

Bolt action shotguns were economy, price point guns essentially for small game hunting, rabbits and squirrels. Since your gun is a .410, it is pretty much a squirrel/rabbit gun. The larger gauges could be loaded with shotgun slugs and used for deer, as I'm sure many were. As a rule, they were little more expensive than a single shot, but offered some advantage as a slow repeater. They were no where near the price of double barrels and pumps intended for the same market.

As I noted in my first post, the adjustable choke on the gun we had shot off. For that reason, I would be reluctant to shoot .410 slugs through the choke system on your gun. I'd think the lead slug might accelerate wear and tear on same. Otherwise, .410 shotshells should be good to go, providing the gun is sound.
 
I have some 410 rounds that I have left over from a Taurus Judge. Can I use them in this gun?. Or is the projectiles not good for this gun?
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The projectiles should not be a problem. What may be the problem is the length of the shell. Modern .410 shells are either 2.5" or 3". Modern guns are just about all chambered for the longer shell (and so will shoot either) but older guns may only be chambered for the older, shorter shell.

IF the gun doesn't say, get it checked by a gunsmith before use.

The issue is while the longer shell MAY chamber in the shorter chambered gun, there is no "room" in the barrel for the longer shell to open up so when fired it creates a higher than normal pressure, and that could be too much for the gun to take.

I believe the only thing locking that gun shut is the root of the bolt handle locking into a small notch in the receiver, and while this is enough for safety with the low pressure of firing a normal shotgun round, it is questionable how well it will stand up to a serious overpressure situation, and if it lets go completely, the bolt will come straight back with deadly force.

Get the gun checked by a competent gunsmith before you think of firing it!


cannot tell if the adjustable choke is intact, or not, I'm not familiar with what they put on the .410, but it doesn't look like the ones I've seen on 16s and 12s. If it is still intact, I'd recommend opening it to its max if firing slugs. (or any copper coated multi part loads)

Moving to Shotgun forum..
 
I don't much about shotgun chokes (basically nothing) But in the picture you can see straight into the barrel. There does seem to be threads on the choke. So I quess you can turn it. But what does that do?

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Robs, think of choke the same way as you do about a nozzle on a garden hose. By adjusting the nozzle, you make the water spray wide or tight. A choke does something similar (although not as drastic a difference as with water). A totally smooth bore with no restriction would have the widest shot dispersion. Increasing the restriction of the end of the bore tends to reduce the amount of dispersion of the shot (at least until you reach a certain point at which the shot bounces against itself and starts to scatter again).
 
Doyle said:
Robs, think of choke the same way as you do about a nozzle on a garden hose. By adjusting the nozzle, you make the water spray wide or tight. A choke does something similar (although not as drastic a difference as with water). A totally smooth bore with no restriction would have the widest shot dispersion. Increasing the restriction of the end of the bore tends to reduce the amount of dispersion of the shot (at least until you reach a certain point at which the shot bounces against itself and starts to scatter again).
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I do understand that. I quess what I don't understand is the fact that if the choke just screws on and you move it up and down on the barrel. Your just making the barrel a little bit longer or shorter. Right? I have heard of different chokes for the same gun for different purposes. So how does the choke work on this gun.

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The choke doesn't move up and down the barrel. It is in one spot, at the muzzle end of the barrel. "Choke" is the end part of the barrel where the barrel "narrows down" (reduces inside diameter) a little bit, to make the shot pattern stay "tighter".

Originally this was done by boring the choke section slightly smaller than the rest of the barrel, making it an integral part of the barrel, and fixed.

Some time much later, some bright fellow figured out that you could attach a choke tube to the end of the barrel, and tubes with different amounts of choke could be screwed on, depending on which was wanted (Poly-choke was one brand). A variant of this was the single tube adjustable choke used by Mossberg, where the single tube acted like a collet bushing, where you could squeeze it down (for tight choke - full choke) or adjust it more open, all the way to cylinder bore (no choke)

While this did work, it added weight and bulk to the end of the barrel, and not everyone wanted that.

Some time later, some bright fellow figured out how to make the choke tube fit inside the muzzle end of the barrel, and still be removable to change tubes when desired, adding essentially nothing to the end of the barrel (on the outside) so the gun's handling was unchanged.

This is the system in popular use today, multiple choke tubes fitted to screw into the barrel, one for each desired choke constriction.

This allows one barrel to perform all functions simply by changing the choke tube.
 
So it sounds like there were more then one choke available for this gun. And I only have one. I have not looked at the choke to see if it had any numbers in it

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the length that you move the choke in or out is so minute', its not important. what is important is what twisting the outer body does, it squeezes the inside in the choke device making the bore larger or smaller (inside). if you were to take the device off, youd see what looks like peddles. those peddles do the choke work.
 
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Any small change in the total overall length of the barrel (outside) is insignificant. That change doesn't matter.

Think of it kind of like putting a drill bit in your drill, you turn the collar on the outside and the jaws open or close. This is what the adjustable choke does, you turn the collar on the outside (which does move the collar a tiny bit up/down) but what it does on the inside is close or open the choke tube slightly (a few thousandths of an inch) changing the amount of choke the shot passes through.
 
Thanks, I'm going to try and make this gun look nice and maybe shoot it. It was free so I don't have anything to loose. I'll have to bring it to a smith to make sure it's safe to fire.

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I have what you have. they are fun to shoot. that adj choke will clog over time. you must keep it clean and well oiled or itll be hard to twist.
and...the green and red colors of the safe and fire indicators are industry backwards. you have to look close at the actual letter in them.
 
stuckinthe60s said:
I have what you have. they are fun to shoot. that adj choke will clog over time. you must keep it clean and well oiled or itll be hard to twist.

and...the green and red colors of the safe and fire indicators are industry backwards. you have to look close at the actual letter in them.
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What ammo size/brand do you shoot? How do you unload it if you don't want to fire them all? Oh and how many can you load?

Sorry for all the questions.

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