PATPluspinc.
I am sorry but your wrong about using fmj for defense they are terrible. They have the
worst stopping power rate of any load in any caliber.
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You can not find ONE source to back that up. There is no scientific data/evidence to back that up, only gun magazine (let's sell bullets) logic. You miss the point that the lowly .22 LR kills more than all others combined for a start. Before you start blubbering about wound channels, etc., you have to take into account that 50% of all hollowpoints fail to expand (see IWBA among others for that one) and as a cop I had to attend autopsies and it is all but impossible to tell a FMJ wound from a expanded hollowpoint. In fact if you look at my web page you look at REAL wounds and decide for yourself. Exit wounds aren't very impressive either. To think that an expanding bullet will save your hide is pretty thin. The only thing that can do is pick up the speed of bleeding and little more. Damage to tissue such as muscles etc., doesn't do much either.
Speed and diameter play a much more impressive role in things. Veins, arteries and tissue can only stretch so far and if the speed is there (lighter is better for that) the tissue will tear/lacerate more than a slower bullet. If you look under a microscope at such tissue you can see bruises to the tissue from a RN design and that includes hollowpoints that don't or haven't opened yet. The slug glides past the tissue and the round nose pushes it out of the way as it moves.
Diameter does aid in bleeding as the veins and arteries can't stretch far enough or fast enough as the projectile moves along the tissue.
The most damaging projectile of all is the SWC. It punches a hole on the skin like on paper (blood comes out) and the sharp edges do slash as they move and cause a lot of bleeding and tissue damage. In such slugs you see a debris field ahead of the slug even if it doesn't expand. This explains the worth of the .38 Special SWC lead hollowpoint in +P loads. Seed and cutting edges. And if it does expand it does a good job.
The speed of the .22 LR makes it a nasty projectile because all along the trail you see the bleeding from start to finish. Penetration of most .22 LR slugs is pretty impressive as well.
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What you said about placing your
shots well is true but the same can be said about using a 22 short. How reasonable is
that.
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VERY reasonable. You admit the .22 short works and it does and is a favorite with assasins. It is MORE than adequate.
Ball ammo has failed to perform on the street. I know of several shooting in my
state where one department in particular uses ball ammo the last few people they have
shot had to be handcuffed and led away to medics and that was with 45 ball.
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Get me the dept and I'll get the reports. Bet the placement was poor. You can't blame the slug for that. Also NYPD used FMJ in their 9mm's for almost a decade and had NO complaint with then other than concerns for penetration, NOT performance. ANY hollowpoint you can come up with I can find more than a handfull of cases where they did not work. you failed to mention that part which is very important. Failures of all brands of hollowpoints are easy to find which makes us wonder about the bill of goods the gun magazines have sold us for so long. Please note there are no guarantees on any box of ammunition. Even they know better. Because you know where they put the responsibility for performance and it is not their ammunition regardless of silly gun magazine statistics without validation.
Imagine how pathetic 9mm ball is. If you can't use hollow points use glasers or magsafes fast hardball round. It is a full metal jacket round with no lead core just epoxy. It is extremely fast and should do ok and not penetrate too much due to the lightweight. That new expanding full metal jacket looks like good ammo. I am interested in testing some. It looks like clothing does not affect it at all.
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How will YOU test it? I think it is called murder. What background do you have to "test" any ammunition? Wet phone books, clay, and jello aren't very reliable nor realistic.
Even a goat or two won't cut it. We have more than enough shootings for real to examine.
I'll stick with the medical folks for my information. Also I don't think you'll find much agreement that the FMJ in any caliber is useless nor wimpy. We have to many bodies for that I'm afraid to tell us otherwise. Makes you wonder how small arms played a realistic part in a war based on your logic.
I had a partner that shot a thug in the chest in front of me six times with a .357 using hollowpoints. All good hits. He shot back at us 5 times, hit my partner once and we had to fight him into the ambulance. He was out in 6 weeks. Maybe we should have gotten our money back. Hate to be harsh, but the nonsense has to stop and we have to look at the reality. I notice you failed to address OUR responsibility to put any slug in the right place. NO bullet will save you. Sure, I carry hollowpoints, but only because I'm a total optimist. If I was given FMJ in ANY gun I wouldn't feel at a disadvantage.
Visit
www.plusp.com and look at some real photos. It isn't what any of us want to see or hear about. There's a lot of bad news there for shooters who think a bullet is a big deal.
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Specialists in the use and training of lethal force.
