Blankwaffe
New member
Alright Mister Wilson...you did it.
Weapon Shield Update fron Iraq
- Thread starter gcfennell
- Start date
1nm??? What happens when the 1000 times bigger asperities breaks off from wear with all of your 1nm diamonds attached to it? 1nm??? This is too rich. 1nm is about 10 times the size of an oil molecule.
Wear pads that are formed by ZDDP are 100 times thicker than that and extreme pressure films are measured in microns (micro meters) 1000x larger.
1nm?? DLC without a vapor chamber? Does your product turn the gun black? TOO funny.
And please don't try and tell me that these role along the surface like tiny ball bearings...:barf:
ETA: The DLC coating from Ion bond is about 5000X thicker than what you are saying here.
http://www.ionbond.com/pix/files/coatingDlc2.pdf
And a unit converter for anyone that wants to do the math for themselves:
http://www.digitaldutch.com/unitconverter/
ETA: After reading some of your posts, I see a lot of "50-400 strokes to seat the diamonds", "the more you use it the better it works", "nonstick surface". Sounds a LOT like a chlorinated extreme pressure additive. Does your product contain any chlorine, sulphur, phos?
Wear pads that are formed by ZDDP are 100 times thicker than that and extreme pressure films are measured in microns (micro meters) 1000x larger.
1nm?? DLC without a vapor chamber? Does your product turn the gun black? TOO funny.
And please don't try and tell me that these role along the surface like tiny ball bearings...:barf:
ETA: The DLC coating from Ion bond is about 5000X thicker than what you are saying here.
http://www.ionbond.com/pix/files/coatingDlc2.pdf
And a unit converter for anyone that wants to do the math for themselves:
http://www.digitaldutch.com/unitconverter/
ETA: After reading some of your posts, I see a lot of "50-400 strokes to seat the diamonds", "the more you use it the better it works", "nonstick surface". Sounds a LOT like a chlorinated extreme pressure additive. Does your product contain any chlorine, sulphur, phos?
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.1nm for an oil molecule - prove it, and Asperities 1000X larger breaking off??? exactly what are you trying to say?
<1nm??? What happens when the 1000 times bigger asperities breaks off from wear with all of your 1nm diamonds attached to it? 1nm??? This is too rich. 1nm is about 10 times the size of an oil molecule.
I said these are nanodiamonds, not solid films.
<Wear pads that are formed by ZDDP are 100 times thicker than that and extreme pressure films are measured in microns (micro meters) 1000x larger.
You cannot make DLC powder is a CVD chamber, so all the experts have told me. What is the point of acting out like a school boy when it is clear you do not understand what is written?
<1nm?? DLC without a vapor chamber? Does your product turn the gun black? TOO funny.
Like I said, they embed - why are you trying to start an argument over what I did not say?
<And please don't try and tell me that these role along the surface like tiny ball bearings...
DLC coatings are one thing, and so is building up two 6 micron layers of polymer on metal finishes, neither of which I do.
<ETA: The DLC coating from Ion bond is about 5000X thicker than what you are saying here.
http://www.ionbond.com/pix/files/coatingDlc2.pdf
Meaningless when you don't know what you are doing the math on
<And a unit converter for anyone that wants to do the math for themselves:
http://www.digitaldutch.com/unitconverter/
Like I said, my product has two ingredients, the same two ingredients it always had - synthetic oil and Novel NanoDiamond particles.
<ETA: After reading some of your posts, I see a lot of "50-400 strokes to seat the diamonds", "the more you use it the better it works", "nonstick surface". Sounds a LOT like a chlorinated extreme pressure additive. Does your product contain any chlorine, sulpur, phos?
Sulpur?? NO Polymers, Sulfur, Chlorine, Phosphorous, Lead, Tin, Kryptonite, pixie dust - just nanodiamond and oil.
It was nice chatting with you, but you are rude, arrogant, and make strange accusations that could have been avoided by simply reading. Bye.
<1nm??? What happens when the 1000 times bigger asperities breaks off from wear with all of your 1nm diamonds attached to it? 1nm??? This is too rich. 1nm is about 10 times the size of an oil molecule.
I said these are nanodiamonds, not solid films.
<Wear pads that are formed by ZDDP are 100 times thicker than that and extreme pressure films are measured in microns (micro meters) 1000x larger.
You cannot make DLC powder is a CVD chamber, so all the experts have told me. What is the point of acting out like a school boy when it is clear you do not understand what is written?
<1nm?? DLC without a vapor chamber? Does your product turn the gun black? TOO funny.
Like I said, they embed - why are you trying to start an argument over what I did not say?
<And please don't try and tell me that these role along the surface like tiny ball bearings...
DLC coatings are one thing, and so is building up two 6 micron layers of polymer on metal finishes, neither of which I do.
<ETA: The DLC coating from Ion bond is about 5000X thicker than what you are saying here.
http://www.ionbond.com/pix/files/coatingDlc2.pdf
Meaningless when you don't know what you are doing the math on
<And a unit converter for anyone that wants to do the math for themselves:
http://www.digitaldutch.com/unitconverter/
Like I said, my product has two ingredients, the same two ingredients it always had - synthetic oil and Novel NanoDiamond particles.
<ETA: After reading some of your posts, I see a lot of "50-400 strokes to seat the diamonds", "the more you use it the better it works", "nonstick surface". Sounds a LOT like a chlorinated extreme pressure additive. Does your product contain any chlorine, sulpur, phos?
Sulpur?? NO Polymers, Sulfur, Chlorine, Phosphorous, Lead, Tin, Kryptonite, pixie dust - just nanodiamond and oil.
It was nice chatting with you, but you are rude, arrogant, and make strange accusations that could have been avoided by simply reading. Bye.
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Blankwaffe
New member
Tempest,
I popped a smoke earlier...that LZ is hot bro.
I popped a smoke earlier...that LZ is hot bro.
I miss spoke, that is ~ approximately the size of an atom. I have seen oil molecules listed as anywhere from 20 to 60 Angstroms. If the latter is true, then your diamonds are 1/6 the size of an oil molecule. And that is supposed to help how?
What I am trying to say is that your nano-diamonds are too small to do anything. Even if they embed into the surface of the metal, they will do nothing to keep the asperities from contacting or breaking off which are at least 1000 times larger than your diamonds. These will do nothing to bolster the asperity or prevent wear. If they embed, there is no slip as with moly and there is no ablative/slip effect as with anti-wear and extreme pressure additives. There is also no asperity filling as can happen with moly and EP additives. There is no surface improvement so how can there be a reduction in friction?
Embed a million basket ball sized bearings into a 1000ft peak, and collide it with another peak inverted. How are the bearings supposed to help? Interlocked spheres on opposing planes do not slide well.
Further, if someone comes along and uses a lubricant with AW or EP chemistry (which you should), your diamonds will be buried far under the formed films and will do nothing.
The roller bearing theory has been reported in the past. I see now that you no longer make that claim, sorry. But now you do not know the mechanism by which the lubricity is obtained. Kinda' sketchy.
Direct quote by you: http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=284835&page=2&highlight=dlc
A layer 1nm of diamond is very different from a proper DLC coating.
Care to explain and enlighten your potential customers?
Yep, but when the BS meter is pegged...
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Too Small to do anything - Except in IRAQ
Mr. Arnold,
Just wanted you to know that I posted some info on M4carbine about the Nanolube you sent. It seemed to work pretty good, especially in the shop when I was repairing AK's. Some of the latches which were very stiff to move loosened up rather well and definitely better than the CLP. We also tested it on an AK, M249 SAW and a Bushmaster M4 style carbine. Results were pretty good with no malfunctions. Once I prurchase a larger bottle and get into circulation and check those results I will let you know what happens. Thanks.
v/r,
W. LARSON
ARMORER
FOB OLYMPIA, IRAQ
TRIPLE CANOPY
Mr. Arnold,
Just wanted you to know that I posted some info on M4carbine about the Nanolube you sent. It seemed to work pretty good, especially in the shop when I was repairing AK's. Some of the latches which were very stiff to move loosened up rather well and definitely better than the CLP. We also tested it on an AK, M249 SAW and a Bushmaster M4 style carbine. Results were pretty good with no malfunctions. Once I prurchase a larger bottle and get into circulation and check those results I will let you know what happens. Thanks.
v/r,
W. LARSON
ARMORER
FOB OLYMPIA, IRAQ
TRIPLE CANOPY
Triple Canopy post
Well I guess that this would be a good time to chime in about the Nanolube sample(s) I received. I used it on some AK's that had very stiff latches. I applied a few drops to the problem areas and it worked damn good. As a matter of fact I first tried CLP which didn't seem to help.
Next test was out on the range with an M249 SAW. Lube was applied to the rails and main contact points. Ambient temperature was about 99 degrees and was dusty outside. There were no malfunctions of any kind after approx. 1000 rds being expended.
One of our guys was running through an extended shoot course with his issue Bushmaster. I had him wipe down all other excess lube and then lube the inside with Nanolube. It was applied to the bolt and carrier and along the upper where the charging handle rides. A few hundred rounds were fired during this course and no malfunctions were observed. There was one malfunction that was attributed to the ammo only.
Final test I took an old (pre-1959) milled receiver AK47 that was a little rough. I cleaned it up and lubed it with Nanolube. The gun ran excellent. As a matter of fact it almost seemed to be cycling faster than normal (though I don't believe this is the case) and experienced no problems. I am probably going to buy a larger size bottle and use it more before I give a 100% endorsement.
Well I guess that this would be a good time to chime in about the Nanolube sample(s) I received. I used it on some AK's that had very stiff latches. I applied a few drops to the problem areas and it worked damn good. As a matter of fact I first tried CLP which didn't seem to help.
Next test was out on the range with an M249 SAW. Lube was applied to the rails and main contact points. Ambient temperature was about 99 degrees and was dusty outside. There were no malfunctions of any kind after approx. 1000 rds being expended.
One of our guys was running through an extended shoot course with his issue Bushmaster. I had him wipe down all other excess lube and then lube the inside with Nanolube. It was applied to the bolt and carrier and along the upper where the charging handle rides. A few hundred rounds were fired during this course and no malfunctions were observed. There was one malfunction that was attributed to the ammo only.
Final test I took an old (pre-1959) milled receiver AK47 that was a little rough. I cleaned it up and lubed it with Nanolube. The gun ran excellent. As a matter of fact it almost seemed to be cycling faster than normal (though I don't believe this is the case) and experienced no problems. I am probably going to buy a larger size bottle and use it more before I give a 100% endorsement.
There is nothing there showing how the product works, and there are plenty of chemisties that will provide the same results that do not cost $25 an ounce. Proven chemistries that build much thicker layers on the surface and are just as much attached.
I don't know if you are using these chemistries in your oil or not, but it would appear that an electron microscope is required to verify that these nano-diamonds are present in the oil. They certainly should not show up on any standard oil analysis. How very convenient.
Are my technical points wrong? You did not address them.
I don't know if you are using these chemistries in your oil or not, but it would appear that an electron microscope is required to verify that these nano-diamonds are present in the oil. They certainly should not show up on any standard oil analysis. How very convenient.
Are my technical points wrong? You did not address them.
Just leave it be Nano.
Try not to personalize it.
If he wants to debunk you, let him pay for the elec. microscope tests.
Then he, and you, will have proof.
Until then, I enjoy the sample you gave me.
Thank you.
For those that don't believe, and refuse to try it, thanks for helping to keep the price low.
Have a nice day.
Try not to personalize it.
If he wants to debunk you, let him pay for the elec. microscope tests.
Then he, and you, will have proof.
Until then, I enjoy the sample you gave me.
Thank you.
For those that don't believe, and refuse to try it, thanks for helping to keep the price low.
Have a nice day.
I got a free sample of Nanolube...
And it worked for me.
My 3.5 Lb trigger became 2 Lbs.
My Saiga's action is too smooth now. It cycles so fast, for the length of the 308Win cartridge brass, that it catches the brass with the bolt face and stove-pipes it, while feeding one fresh one in the breach.
I have the action on video and have verified, the action is working correctly.
It's just too fast for the long casing to get out of the way.
This was not seen until Nanolube was applied.
Sorry you were unable to receive a free sample.
So far, the results are that it does work.
There are those that have polished actions and were hoping it would help even more.
Well, I can understand its lack of results in those cases.
How 'smooth' can a 'smooth action' be made? Apparently, not enough for human fingers to tell the difference.
I have applied it only to firearms that have never seen a gunsmith.
None of mine have been polished or honed. And, to tell the truth, without a scale to measure the trigger, I wouldn't have thought there was any difference either. A 3.5Lb 'snap' of a trigger is just too hard for me to discern compared to a 2Lb 'snap'.
ATTT has many firearms he used it on, and saw fast results on some of them.
His old 45 pistol, with a nappy trigger, was the biggest difference.
Nano never said to not use any other lube.
He just stated that it helps reduce friction, and its symptoms it creates.
Edit...
OOPSIE, I didn't realize that this wasn't originally a Nano thread.
Blame 'Wilson'
...and 'Temp'. LOL
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2968594#post2968594
Now you guys have me wondering whether WS will be a good lube to apply over the Nanolube when its carrier evaporates.
And it worked for me.
My 3.5 Lb trigger became 2 Lbs.
My Saiga's action is too smooth now. It cycles so fast, for the length of the 308Win cartridge brass, that it catches the brass with the bolt face and stove-pipes it, while feeding one fresh one in the breach.
I have the action on video and have verified, the action is working correctly.
It's just too fast for the long casing to get out of the way.
This was not seen until Nanolube was applied.
Sorry you were unable to receive a free sample.
So far, the results are that it does work.
There are those that have polished actions and were hoping it would help even more.
Well, I can understand its lack of results in those cases.
How 'smooth' can a 'smooth action' be made? Apparently, not enough for human fingers to tell the difference.
I have applied it only to firearms that have never seen a gunsmith.
None of mine have been polished or honed. And, to tell the truth, without a scale to measure the trigger, I wouldn't have thought there was any difference either. A 3.5Lb 'snap' of a trigger is just too hard for me to discern compared to a 2Lb 'snap'.
ATTT has many firearms he used it on, and saw fast results on some of them.
His old 45 pistol, with a nappy trigger, was the biggest difference.
Nano never said to not use any other lube.
He just stated that it helps reduce friction, and its symptoms it creates.
Edit...
OOPSIE, I didn't realize that this wasn't originally a Nano thread.
Blame 'Wilson'
...and 'Temp'. LOL
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2968594#post2968594
Now you guys have me wondering whether WS will be a good lube to apply over the Nanolube when its carrier evaporates.
Jermtheory
New member
i used my free sample(NL) on my 92 and Griptilian...
dont see any difference from WS on the 92 (other than the WS seems to stay put better) and very little difference on the Griptilian.im not sure if the Griptilian had been lubed at all prior to the NL(if it had it was by Benchmade at the factory).
$25 an OZ??!!
does that come with any diamonds i can see?
dont see any difference from WS on the 92 (other than the WS seems to stay put better) and very little difference on the Griptilian.im not sure if the Griptilian had been lubed at all prior to the NL(if it had it was by Benchmade at the factory).
$25 an OZ??!!
does that come with any diamonds i can see?
Breakdaddy
New member
I was skeptical about this product, but instead of ripping into folks who post their anecdotal evidence about the product I just bought a small bottle and tried it out. My honest appraisal of the product is that it is a good product with excellent lubrication functionality but as a cleaner isn't quite up to Hoppes #9. It is, however, better than Breakfree at cleaning and less messy. All three of these products feature prominently in my cleaning kit. Weapon Shield also has been good at protecting my leatherman wave, which I lightly coat with the product once every couple of months or so.
I'm impressed enough with Weapon Shield I don't care to even try anything else as long as Weapon Shield's price doesn't double. I've not used anything else that could even compare. There are other super lubes out there I've not tried but they are also quite pricey in comparison.
A little goes a long, long way and I've still used approximately 13oz. over about a little over a year. I just called and ordered a 4oz. bottle because I think I'll prefer working with that size bottle. I also prefer the dropper top.
Probably in a couple months I'll order another 16oz. to refill the 4.
A little goes a long, long way and I've still used approximately 13oz. over about a little over a year. I just called and ordered a 4oz. bottle because I think I'll prefer working with that size bottle. I also prefer the dropper top.
Probably in a couple months I'll order another 16oz. to refill the 4.
Okay update on my sample of Weaponshiled. So far I like this stuff.
1. Cleaning seems to work as well as the former product I used (Break Free CLP). I do think solvents are superior at cleaning and do use them when there is an extreme tough job or to remove cosmoline or whatever from a new gun. Other than that I find the effectiveness of WS CLP (and BF CLP for that matter) to work well enough for cleaning.
2. Lubricating. I am not a machine and can only go by feel. WS CLP seems to lubricate just as well (maybe even better) than other lubes or CLPs I've used.
3. Protecting. Again, this is hard for me to gauge. I can say I do not have any corrosion after using this product. But, I never had any before either except for one gun that got a bit of slight surface rust in a couple spots while storred for many years in a cloth based gun case. Also, I have only really started to use this stuff.
What I know for sure is that I like that it is touted to be non toxic, and also doesn't have a strong smell. And what smell it does have is not obnoxious. BF CLP I believe is toxic, and although the liquid oil doesn't reek too badly, the aerosol BF CLP is for some reason NASTY! I would never let smell or non toxic features make me choose it over a more effective function, but the fact that it seems to function as well or better, the acceptable odor and non toxicity is a welcome feature for sure!
The only concern I have left to deal with before I place an order for full size bottles is how well it will function well into the sub zero tempeartures. Some of my guns get used when it is 20 below outside and need to work slick then too.
ANyone have any experience with sub zero temps with WS CLP?
1. Cleaning seems to work as well as the former product I used (Break Free CLP). I do think solvents are superior at cleaning and do use them when there is an extreme tough job or to remove cosmoline or whatever from a new gun. Other than that I find the effectiveness of WS CLP (and BF CLP for that matter) to work well enough for cleaning.
2. Lubricating. I am not a machine and can only go by feel. WS CLP seems to lubricate just as well (maybe even better) than other lubes or CLPs I've used.
3. Protecting. Again, this is hard for me to gauge. I can say I do not have any corrosion after using this product. But, I never had any before either except for one gun that got a bit of slight surface rust in a couple spots while storred for many years in a cloth based gun case. Also, I have only really started to use this stuff.
What I know for sure is that I like that it is touted to be non toxic, and also doesn't have a strong smell. And what smell it does have is not obnoxious. BF CLP I believe is toxic, and although the liquid oil doesn't reek too badly, the aerosol BF CLP is for some reason NASTY! I would never let smell or non toxic features make me choose it over a more effective function, but the fact that it seems to function as well or better, the acceptable odor and non toxicity is a welcome feature for sure!
The only concern I have left to deal with before I place an order for full size bottles is how well it will function well into the sub zero tempeartures. Some of my guns get used when it is 20 below outside and need to work slick then too.
ANyone have any experience with sub zero temps with WS CLP?
Thanks rgates. Did you mean you are afraid it doesn't work so good at sub zero temps (but does at around 15 and above), or did you mean you're afraid you have no specific knowledge of its function at sub zero temps but do know it works at 15 and above? I presume you meant the latter but I just want to be sure.
Anyone else? How about George the engineer? How does this stuff work in the COLD?
workinwifdakids
New member
1) If Militec-1 does not resist corrosion, what do you use after you treat the weapon with it?
2) Does Weapon Shield work as well as Militec-1?
2) Does Weapon Shield work as well as Militec-1?
I meant I have no knowledge of sub zero performance but I do know from my experiences it works as well at 15 as it does in hot temps. Based on what I've seen, I have to believe it would work well at 20 below. I'm just old enough that I won't be out there to find out.LOL
I'm impressed enough with it at everything above 15 that if I were to regularly hunt or whatever in subzero temps it would be worth at least the price of a 4oz. bottle to try it.
The 15 degree day was with several friends out for a day of shooting and we had that one day to shoot before one was leaving for Iraq. So it was all day at 15 degrees with a 20 mph wind or nothing. There were NO issues and everything functioned flawlessly. 10/22's, M-4, several pistols, an AK and several bolt actions, but I always felt the real test was with the semi-autos.
As far as corrosion protection, it's also the best I've seen.
As far as cleaning, my guns have never been as easy to clean.
Lube, triggers and actions feel lighter and smoother.
I'm impressed enough with it at everything above 15 that if I were to regularly hunt or whatever in subzero temps it would be worth at least the price of a 4oz. bottle to try it.
The 15 degree day was with several friends out for a day of shooting and we had that one day to shoot before one was leaving for Iraq. So it was all day at 15 degrees with a 20 mph wind or nothing. There were NO issues and everything functioned flawlessly. 10/22's, M-4, several pistols, an AK and several bolt actions, but I always felt the real test was with the semi-autos.
As far as corrosion protection, it's also the best I've seen.
As far as cleaning, my guns have never been as easy to clean.
Lube, triggers and actions feel lighter and smoother.