Uberti quality

Keith wrote about Colts being carried with 5 rounds from way back. He said the old timers he knew carried them with 5. He mentioned a couple guys he knew of that had carried 6, and had stirrups fall on the hammer spur when saddling a horse, sending a bullet through their leg. The heavy stirrup sheared the hammer notch (safety notch) and fired the gun. It's by no means something cooked up in the 50's.

I persanally know of a guy that carried an old model Ruger single six fully loaded, and managed to have something hit the hammer when out doing fence work. He ended up losing the leg.
 
Yup. The first mass consumers of SA revolvers were the comboys and trail hands. A great many of them learned all about carrying a round under the hammer the hard way. A lot of cowboys would roll up their paper money and keep it in the empty chamber.
 
Fun fact: Wyatt Earp, early on in his career as a lawman, would load his revolver with six rounds. He was leaning back in his chair in a saloon one day when his gun slipped out of the holster and nearly put an extra hole in him.

That's how he learned.
 
A lot of cowboys would roll up their paper money and keep it in the empty chamber.
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Where did you hear that? Can you imagine what a dollar bill would look like if you rolled it up, put it in a chamber of a revolver, and fired off one or five black powder cartridges (no smokeless in the old west) from the same gun? With all the flame and smoke, there wouldn't be much left.:rolleyes:
As for the load five debate, in 1882, Pat Garrett (shot Billy the Kid in 1881) published a book (The Authentic Life of Billy the Kid) that was a romanticised account of the life and death of the kid. In the last chapter, Garrett wrote about venturing in to see the Kid's body on the floor. He said, "We examined his pistol-a self cocker( double action, colt thunderer), calibre .41. It had five cartridges and one shell in the chambers, the hammer resting on the shell, but this proves nothing, as many carry their revolvers in this way for safety; besides this shell looked as though it had been shot some time before" So at least in 1882, Garrett knew "many" that carried five rounds in their guns, but not everyone did.
Now, I own over a dozen Uberti guns, both rifles and revolvers and I love them all. Great guns.
 
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Using an empty shell in one chamber under the hammer would make particularly good sense with the Thunderer as it was a fairly fragile gun and that practice would reduce the risk of outright dry-firing it when he ran out.

If that's what he was doing, I would be willing to bet that was why.
 
I dont think it was a good idea to put money in a chamber, and am not sure it could even be done, I think I tried it years ago after hearing the story, it isnt easy to get a bill in (or out of) a chamber, and,... it would be very difficult to get the 6th round in if it was needed. I dont buy the story it ever happened, and certainly wasn't common if anyone did it.

I cant see any practical reason to do it, and it certainly has serious disadvantages. Many cartridge belts were money belts, but the bill in the chamber, I can't get behind.
 
I think I read somewhere years ago that the "dollar bill in the cylinder" legend started a long time ago when someone found an old "cowboy" revolver in an old house or at a flea market with money in one of the chambers. So it had to be a universal practice of the old cowboys, right? I have heard that the reason for this (supposed) practice was to pay for their funeral if they died in a gunfight. I actually saw a fellow on T.V. years ago debunk this myth. He put a piece of paper in the cylinder of a Colt SAA, loaded five BP rounds into the remaining chambers and emptied the gun. The paper was charred, covered in BP residue and smoldering when he finished. Cowboys didn't make a lot of money, so I think they would've been smarter than that. This is just another old west legend like Billy the Kid killed 21 men (one for every year of his life) or Wyatt Earp carried a Colt with a really long barrel, or that Bill Hickok was so fast that when Jack McCall shot him in the back of the head, Hickok drew both of his navy Colts before falling to the floor. Ya gotta love this BS. Least ways that's how I see it.;)
 
Legend and myth are more entertaining usually than fact. That is why I don't watch "reality" tv. I do, however, watch the news.
 
Back to Ubertis:

No single action that lacks a transfer bar should be carried six-up. We have one individual on these forums who insists loud and long that this critical safety practice isn't necessary.

If I was a moderator I would have tossed him out about the second time he made this claim, after warning him the first time.

As to Uberti quality: both Uberti and Pietta updated their factories in the 2000-2001 era. The guns produced after that are generally pretty good. The two semi-consistent complaints I've heard concern oversize chambers, esp. in 45LC but others as well. Throats are sometimes oversize as well. This doesn't do good things for accuracy and it can also shorten the life of brass used in reloading, a necessity for most folks with some of these calibers (such as the 45LC!).

I believe current production Rugers are better guns, esp. the mid-frames from 2004 forward and the large-frames from 2007 forward. The latter can be IDed with the barrel "lawyer's warning label" - if it's under-barrel on the large-frames it's the right newer type. Chambers on these guns tend to be uniform, smooth and tight exactly as you want. The only possible gotcha (and again, for some reason mostly in 45LC) is that the throats will tend to be tight but $40 and a trip to cylindersmith.com fixes that. The Ruger action parts are tough as nails even on the mid-frames - the pawl, hammer, cylinder bolt, springs, trigger and other internal bits are all the spec (and usually swappable!) as the larger-frame 44Magnum-class parts. My mid-frame New Vaquero in 357 is wearing a SuperBlackhawk hammer and has since I installed it in 2005 with no problems at all.

Now. That said, if you want a traditional type action instead of a Ruger, the best Uberti you can get is one made to the "El Patron" finish level and then tuned by a respectable stateside gunsmith. And there's two easy ways to get that: Cimarron sells the "Evil Roy" which is an El Patron variant that they tune up stateside, and Longhunter Shooting Supply is a gunsmith and gun dealer who buys Taylor's Smokewagons and Running Irons (both Ubertis at the El Patron finish level) and tunes them up before shipping them out:

http://longhunt.com/

He's also now selling some other slightly lesser Ubertis that ship under the Cimmaron brand name if you want to save some money or want the Thunderer-type grip frame, and he pre-tunes Rugers as well. I assume he'd tune up one of the Cimmarons if asked - his prices on those are for guns as Cimarron ships them I think? He doesn't sell the Evil Roy but I believe his pre-tuned Taylor's are going to be very similar to a Roy and a better value overall.

I would also guess he can get most anything else in the Ruger lineup and pre-tune that, esp. if it's an SA :). He mostly caters to the SASS crowd so there's no listings for Blackhawks and the like. Buying guns pre-tuned by him means not only is the gun improved but he sends any real "birth defect cases" back to Ruger before you ever see them, and esp. considering there's no extra shipping costs he's one of the best deals in gunsmithing available.
 
As to the effectiveness of the Uberti's safety, I bought an early Cattleman .44 Magnum, about 1975, then imported by Iver Johnson. I placed an empty primed cartridge under the hammer and placed the hammer in the half-cock position. I used a billet of oak to attempt to fire the round by striking the hammer, without sucess. While I don't advocate the loading of six rounds in the Uberti, nor the Ruger, I found the Uberti safety to be no less reliable than Ruger's. It's just as effective as the Colt Positive safety or the hammer block of older Smith & Wessons. It DOES require placing the hammer at the safety notch, but other than that, I found it just as safe. And it is less liable to break than a transfer bar.

Bob Wright
 
No single action that lacks a transfer bar should be carried six-up. We have one individual on these forums who insists loud and long that this critical safety practice isn't necessary.

If I was a moderator I would have tossed him out about the second time he made this claim, after warning him the first time.
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With all due respect, what right would you have to "toss" someone because he has a different opinion about something? If you don't agree, don't do as he does. But he has the right to do as he sees fit, and it's nobody's business but his. He doesn't demand other people carry six in a SA revolver, it's just his personal preference. To each his own.
 
I had thought that the "newer" safeties on the Ubertis was in answer to Fed.god import regulations. So I was given to understand, could be gun"shop talk". IF indeed the .gov regulation is factual, the safety would be tested and "pass" or "fail", or so one would think. In agreement with what someone else said, Rugers are good guns (minus the big target sights) but the outline of the Ubertis and its hammer-mounted firing pin look a whole lot better than the Ruger. Still, having the hammer over an empty is something I am going to be doing in future on all SA revolvers.
That being said.. recently a 1935-vintage pre-Model 10 M&P flew out of a shoulder holster as I was picking said pistol and holster up to put it on. The Smith dropped to the cement floor and landed directly on the hammer spur with the barrel pointed directly at left-center mass- my chest- It hit hard enuff to scuff the metal in a couple places. :eek: Thanks no doubt to the S&W internal block, the revolver did NOT fire. Carelessness on my part for not removing the weapon prior to mounting up the leather, and my fault for not checking the retention strap, which was unsnapped. Been handling small arms for near 50 years and havent done anything that stupid and dangerous since high school.
 
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First, I'm not a moderator so I have no right to toss anybody.

IF I was, my policy would be that repeatedly offering advice that is known to be unsafe after being warned not to should be grounds to be tossed out. No different than offering reloading data known to be explosively bad.
 
IF I was, my policy would be that repeatedly offering advice that is known to be unsafe after being warned not to should be grounds to be tossed out. No different than offering reloading data known to be explosively bad
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He does not advise anyone to do what he does. He simply points out that he does it. Can you point to one post where "he" actually tells someone to carry six rounds in a SAA like "he" does? Not everybody, 120 years ago or now, carried/carries only five rounds in a SAA. Sorry, but that is a fact. I too have carried a SAA with six rounds a few times, in the vary manner (firing pin between cartridge rims) that "he" does. It was done in the "old west" too. It's actually a pretty secure way to do it if you're going to do it. The firing pin would have to shear off in order for the cylinder to turn. I carry five because it's hard to break old habits. If you don't think it's safe to carry six, don't. Pretty simple. But to wish to "toss" someone because you disagree with them, well that says a lot about your character. Since I have admitted to the sinful (in your eyes) act of carrying a fully loaded SAA revolver, does this mean I should be "tossed" too?:rolleyes:
 
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Since I have admitted to the sinful (in your eyes) act of carrying a fully loaded SAA revolver, does this mean I should be "tossed" too?
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I certainly wouldn't. What you do (be it right or wrong, good or bad) is your business. And, if what you do is right or wrong or good or bad (in someone else's eyes)-so long as you're not advocating somebody doing something that is patently unsafe-is your business. I think most of us are grown up enough to make these kinds of decisions for ourselves.
 
I certainly wouldn't. What you do (be it right or wrong, good or bad) is your business. And, if what you do is right or wrong or good or bad (in someone else's eyes)-so long as you're not advocating somebody doing something that is patently unsafe-is your business. I think most of us are grown up enough to make these kinds of decisions for ourselves.
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This is the point I wanted to make. While I have done it a few times, I prefer the hammer on an empty chamber as a pretty foolproof safety measure. I do not advocate that others do it, nor does the forum member that Mr. March apparently has a problem with. I do however, think the attitude of "do as I do or else" is a bit arrogant. Not everyone was raised the same.
 
He does not advise anyone to do what he does. He simply points out that he does it.
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Oh no, in the past he has in fact advocated six-up in a Colt SAA.

I'm boarding an airplane in five hours, must sleep...but I have some long layovers and I'll find the posts.
 
Oh no, in the past he has in fact advocated six-up in a Colt SAA.
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Either way, who cares? As was stated in the post above mine, "I think most of us are grown up enough to make these kinds of decisions for ourselves". Even if "he" pounds his fist on his desk, foams at the mouth and demands EVERYONE load six rounds into his SAA, it still won't make someone do it if that person has any will of their own. It's called personal responsibility. You worry too much about what other people do.
 
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