Trouble with .223 reloads

OdinsRightHand said:
Well quick update, I got the trimmer in and started trimming to 1.750. Still getting the hang of it. I have about 10 out of the 35 rounds that don't fit and all the other ones are extremely hard to pull back out of the chamber. Any ideas on this? Why will most fit and some won't? Why the almost stuck in chamber issue? Any help would be appreciated.
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Yes, see post #11.

Also if some chamber and some do not, check the headstamps. Some brass is harder than others and may not size down and stay down like the others.

Also in the mix is "times fired". Every time a case gets fired and sized, it gets harder and harder (work hardening). If some of your cases are "work hardened" and others not, they will size differently, it's called "spring back".
 
A case gauge, used after the round is loaded, will tell you if the crimp expanded the shoulder.
Too hard of a roll/taper crimp will expand the shoulder and stick the round in the chamber before it seats on the Datum point.
Again, a case gauge is a very quick way to insure your rounds work.
.
*IF* you find the shoulder buckles before you get the crimp you want,
Try a Lee factory crimp type die.
Normal taper/roll crimp dies push DOWN on the top of the brass mouth,
Factory crimp dies push in from the side, stopping the shoulder buckle.
.
If the case is jamming farther down, just a little bit above the bottom/web in the case, small base dies usually stop that.
The last bit of the case is unsupported in an AR chamber, it swells quite a bit down low.
Small base dies push the bottom of the case walls back in farther down the brass.
ARs are notorious for swelling the bottom of the case when fired, small base sizing dies fix that issue, and return the case back to as close to SAAMI specification as possible without a full on roller resizer.
 
Do you set your seater die to contact the shellholder? Revisit the last part of post 16.

This is probably the most often rediscovered problem loading 5.56/.223 there is and your symptoms match perfectly.
 
Normally, I would agree, but not with AR rifles.
AR rifles have unsupported (air gap) between case & chamber allowing the case to swell mostly uncontrolled.
This pretty much requires a 'Small Base' die set to push that case back in where it belongs.
This swelling is why most brass fired in an AR is 'Short' when resized.
(Trimming not nessary)
.
Instead of jamming the shell holder into the die, putting undue stress on the press frame/ram,
Try a 'Feeler' gauge under the brass, between brass & shell holder.
This will hike your brass a few thousands into the die without jamming the ram into the die/frame.
There is supposed to be an air gap, no matter how small, between die and shell holder when working...
.
Again, I have to urge a case gauge to see exactly what's going on here,
See if the case shoulder is being pushed back far enough to provide head space.
The gauge will also give you a good idea if the case walls are being pushed back in far enough to meet minimum SAAMI specifications,
And will tell you if the shoulder is being pushed out (expanded) when crimping finished cartridges.
 
To beat the dead horse, get a case guage.

Ive found alot of once fired cases will have nicks in the brass on the rim, some bad enough to chuck, some minor enough I just use a jewelers file to knock off the offending bump. That alone eliminates ~%75 of any case issue I have. This of course is found when using the case gauge.
 
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Something worth noting is there can be several dimensions oversize which will prevent a case from chambering. Case gauges made by companies such as Forrester and L.E. Wilson can be a useful tool but like any tool we need to know what the gauge actually measures. Gauges like this while not taking a quantitative measurement (no real numbers) do serve as a good Go/NoGo type gauge. Again, keeping in mind which features the gauge looks at. For example from our friends at L.E. Wilson:

Note: Does not measure body diameters. This gage is intended to be used with fired cases to determine a basis for full length sizing and trimming.
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This is where if someone is going to invest in a case gauge something worth consideration is Slot Gauges or Non-Slotted by Sheridan Engineering. When many bench rest and serious target shooters have a barrel chamber cut and barrel installed they will have the smith make them a custom gauge using the same reamer the new chamber was just cut with. This way they have a gauge which is a mirror image of their chamber. While not practical for the average shooter the Sheridan Case Gauges take case diameter into consideration. Just something to think about.

Ron
 
Jeephammer,

My comment to the OP had nothing to do with sizing. It had nothing to do with small base dies.
I suggest you carefully re-read post #16,the last few lines.

It was all about (NOT) setting the SEATER die down on the shellholder,due to crimp/shoulder collapse.

Shoulder collapse is often root cause of loaded rounds not chambering and getting stuck.
I am a believer in bushing case gages,but as reloadron correcty pointed out,most of them are about measuring lengths.The diameters must be clearance to gage lengths.

OP,I understand deciphering all of this and all of the side trips may be difficult and confusing.

Just try this one thing.Take your calipers and measure the case dia at the shoulder.Then measure about 3/16 back from the shoulder.If the shoulder dia is bigger,look real close at the shoulder.See that swelling? That's your problem,per my theory,anyway.How does that happen?

Folks who "know what they are doing" don't read instructions on setting up the dies.Your seating die is set to contact the shellholder.That is usually wrong.

You are applying the maximum crimp the die is capable of,and it has no place to go.
You are crushing the shoulders back with the force.That causes the shoulder to increase in diameter.It then locks up in the taper of the chamber.

Before you waste your time and money on small base dies,just back your seater die one rotation off the shellholder and see if problem solved.
 
HiBC, I will honestly look into all the advice. However, upon closer inspection, I swapped bolts with the wife's AR and the rounds chamber much easier. There is a slight height difference between the two, mine is taller. A case gauge will be hunted for asap

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Headspace is certainly a factor to be verified.
I once bought an AR bbl from a a highly regarded supplier of competition grade AR barrels.I bought it with a matched bolt.The short version,this outfit uses a very modest amount of torque into the bbl ext,backed up by Loctite.They have found better accuracy that way.Except,the wrong grade of Loctite found its way into production.Tightening my barrel nut unscrewed the barrel from the extension.
They said "Send it back" Great friendly customer service.I sent the bolt,too.

New barrel arrived without a bolt.I admit,I was inclined to assemble and go with it.But I believe in checking headspace,and that's not a place to get sloppy.

Took the bbl to my local smith with 3 bolts I had.The bbl failed "NoGo " with all 3 bolts.

And,yes,they said "Send it back",and sent me another barrel/bolt.

And maybe,just maybe,you have a tight headspace rifle AND you are collapsing cases. :-)

Good luck!!
 
So quick recap. A go/no go gage and a chamber measuring tool is the next step as well as measuring the case behind the shoulder? So much information into a novices head. I am so thankful to you all!!!

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Just go ahead and order a Redding Body Die (pretty cheap) and use it on a few of your sticky rounds. If your problem is the slightly collapsed and rounded case shoulder, and I think it is, the body die will fix it. It fixed my problem cases. It's an inexpensive and easy fix.
 
Get a case gauge as stated.

Make sure you are not over lubing. To much lube could change the angle at the shoulder of the round. God Bless
 
Bigger at the shoulder? If it is bigger at the shoulder,problem identified.

To illustrate what is happening,try a piece of brass in your seating die with no bullet.Does it crimp? Lightbulb comes on.

OK,Loosen the 7/8-14 lock ring on your seater die.Back the die out 3 turns,away from the shellholder.Put a piece of sized,trimmed brass in the shellholder.Raise the ram.Tutn the die body down tillyou feel it contact the case neck.Note,it is not contacting the shellholder.

Now,back the die body up out of the press "Some".If 1/8 turn makes you happy,great.I suggest finding a washer ot a feeler gage to be able to repeat this setting .Tighten the lock ring.Its not bad to slightly load the die with a flat shimon the shelholder.Some say that helps center the die for more coaxial ammo

Now,reset seating depth.

One problem solved.
 
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Well, back to my original suggestion. Get a Micrometer and calipers and measure your non-chambering cases versus factory rounds. The toughest chambering problem I ever had to solve was that new Lapua brass, with a bullet seated, was too thick at the neck to chamber in my new rifle barrel. The barrel had a tight match chamber that the gunsmith had provided and that I had not asked for. Factory rounds chambered, so I measured the reloaded rounds about very way you can measure, and I finally found the problem. You, like I did, have something that is out of spec.

It's time to measure.
 
http://www.hornady.com/store/Lock-N-Load-Headspace-Kit-With-Body-1-Each/

The Hornady headspace tool can be handy in a time like this. I also use a Dillon case gage as the so called "go , no-go" check.

OP, sorry if I missed it, did you state what type of reloading press, dies, and what brass (source? maker? once fired? etc) you are using in the reloads? For me a good quality competition sizing die, set up properly, gets the reloads to chamber in all my rifles.
 
Sometimes military brass leaves a "High spot" where the primer was crimped in. It would have to be a pretty tight chamber to affect locking up.
 
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