Tracking Point $22,000.00 rifle you cant miss with!

spacecoast said:
Some may find it a bit disconcerting that it may not actually fire when the trigger is squeezed, but waits until the gun is back "on track". I think it would take some getting used to.
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It really doesn't take much to get used to. Pull and hold the trigger down while you're off target and then guide the reticle back to the tag. The biggest problem I had was the trigger was so danged heavy I though the thing was on safety for several seconds :o
 
. The bullet follows the lazer so the wind has little effect.
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Have they repealed the laws of physics while I wasn't looking? Or is the sniper "curving" the bullet into the target like they did in the bad movie?

perhaps I am just misunderstanding things. It seems to me to just be a fancy complex sighting system, and not one that can exert ANY control on the bullet in flight.

A bullet cannot "follow" a laser. A bullet does not see a laser. And a bullet does not steer inflight.

Things that do that are not bullets. They are guided missiles.
 
They are using conventional rounds. How would that round go about following the laser?

I honestly LOVE what they have done though, wish I could afford it.

They DO have a 25mm shoulder fired weapon with range set explosive rounds, seen that on future weapons, so probably far more functional these days. To get the round to track the beam would require far more hardware than we can put in a .223 or 7.62 round.
 
Fellows all it does is simply release the hammer at the perfect time when the reticle is perfectly placed where it was "tagged" the bullet leaves the muzzle at hopefully the perfect moment.
 
It's usefulness is clearly limited by the inability to account for variations in windspeed, and direction at any points downrange.

This is a BIG deal at longer ranges if there are significant differences as the shooter cannot "hold off" to compensate.

Seems like regardless of the technological advances, there's still no way to account for an experienced wind call.
 
Have they repealed the laws of physics while I wasn't looking? Or is the sniper "curving" the bullet into the target like they did in the bad movie?

perhaps I am just misunderstanding things. It seems to me to just be a fancy complex sighting system, and not one that can exert ANY control on the bullet in flight.

A bullet cannot "follow" a laser. A bullet does not see a laser. And a bullet does not steer inflight.

Things that do that are not bullets. They are guided missiles.
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Perhaps it's so expensive beacause it doesn't actually fire bullets but .338cal TOW missiles.
 
Perhaps it's so expensive beacause it doesn't actually fire bullets but .338cal TOW missiles
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Maybe. But I don't think they would be TOW missiles, TOWs are wire guided. :D

Even with our most advanced technology, there is a point at which we simply cannot, at this time (or in the near future) produce the miniature missiles needed for a "bullet" to be able to "steer".

Also there is the sheer physical constraint, that anything capable of being steered cannot travel as fast as a bullet. Guided missiles, no matter the size get their striking power from an explosive (a shaped charge warhead for anti-tank use, a simple explosive with fragmentation for anti-aircraft, generally).

With an explosive warhead, a high impact speed (kinetic energy) is not needed for penetration. A bullet relies entirely on kinetic energy for that.

Many things seen in Hollywood scifi have become possible, over the years. The laser sight on the .45 in the original Terminator was Hollywood magic, at the time the film was made. At that time, laser sights did exist, but were about the size of a carton of cigarettes, not small enough to mount on a handgun. Today, we have lasers small enough to mount inside a handgun!

In the movie Runaway, Gene Simmons had a pistol that fired a small missile, about the size of a .50BMG cartridge. It did steer (to a point). The gun took a thermal scan of the target before firing, and the "bullet" would steer and track in on the individual targeted (everyone's thermal image being unique, according to the script writers). They at least played fair enough with physics that the "bullets" could not make sharp turns, and were slow enough that if you timed it right, could be dodged.

We aren't there yet, and I doubt we will be for quite some time.

The prototype rifle & grenade launcher that fires the 20mm programmable grenades is a neat concept, but still has serious issues that need to be resolved before it could be a practical weapons system. The last I heard, the two biggest issues were the weight of the weapon (23+ pounds in prototype, the goal being 18 or less) and particularly the cost of the ammo.

A grenade that you can program to detonate at a specific point would be a useful thing, BUT, the last I heard the rounds were projected to cost in the neighborhood of $20,000 EACH!

While Uncle Sam doesn't mind spending $1 million on a cruise missile, $20K for each grenade x number of infantrymen x number of grenades fired per engagement is too much, even for us. Even if the price came down to half that, its still too much. There are cheaper and just as effective (if not more so) ways to kill the enemy.
 
Thanks for the link. Interesting information.

The bullet is 4 inches long. Looked to be at least .5 in dia.

I wonder if that is because it can't be made smaller at this time, or if the steering is less efficient (effective?) with a smaller projectile (smaller fins, vs speed making turns more difficult).

I won't say its going to make it impossible to miss, but if it works like advertised, it surely is going to lower the skill level needed to get long range hits.

Any mention of what each round is going to cost?

Also, based on the sheer size of the bullet in the video, I think the ATF will have something to say about ordinary citizens (or at least the well heeled ones) being able to legally own them.
 
Maybe. But I don't think they would be TOW missiles, TOWs are wire guided.

Even with our most advanced technology, there is a point at which we simply cannot, at this time (or in the near future) produce the miniature missiles needed for a "bullet" to be able to "steer".

Also there is the sheer physical constraint, that anything capable of being steered cannot travel as fast as a bullet. Guided missiles, no matter the size get their striking power from an explosive (a shaped charge warhead for anti-tank use, a simple explosive with fragmentation for anti-aircraft, generally).

With an explosive warhead, a high impact speed (kinetic energy) is not needed for penetration. A bullet relies entirely on kinetic energy for that.

Many things seen in Hollywood scifi have become possible, over the years. The laser sight on the .45 in the original Terminator was Hollywood magic, at the time the film was made. At that time, laser sights did exist, but were about the size of a carton of cigarettes, not small enough to mount on a handgun. Today, we have lasers small enough to mount inside a handgun!

In the movie Runaway, Gene Simmons had a pistol that fired a small missile, about the size of a .50BMG cartridge. It did steer (to a point). The gun took a thermal scan of the target before firing, and the "bullet" would steer and track in on the individual targeted (everyone's thermal image being unique, according to the script writers). They at least played fair enough with physics that the "bullets" could not make sharp turns, and were slow enough that if you timed it right, could be dodged.

We aren't there yet, and I doubt we will be for quite some time.

The prototype rifle & grenade launcher that fires the 20mm programmable grenades is a neat concept, but still has serious issues that need to be resolved before it could be a practical weapons system. The last I heard, the two biggest issues were the weight of the weapon (23+ pounds in prototype, the goal being 18 or less) and particularly the cost of the ammo.

A grenade that you can program to detonate at a specific point would be a useful thing, BUT, the last I heard the rounds were projected to cost in the neighborhood of $20,000 EACH!

While Uncle Sam doesn't mind spending $1 million on a cruise missile, $20K for each grenade x number of infantrymen x number of grenades fired per engagement is too much, even for us. Even if the price came down to half that, its still too much. There are cheaper and just as effective (if not more so) ways to kill the enemy.
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I did mean a TOW missile as I thought wire guided bullets from a rifle sounded ridiculous.

I don't doubt the technology is there to do some of these things, but it gets to a point where it just isn't practical.
Look at all the "amazing" technology in our smart phones, about 50% of it is really just a gimmick, and no one really needs, or even wants to use on a day to day basis.
And there is only so many ways one can connect to Facebook.

The thing I least like about this rifle is it doesn't do anything that soldiers/shooters don't already do, at a much lower cost, much lighter rifle, and much less electronics to go wrong.
It's also very very likely this technology will never be in the hands of ever soldier on the battle field as the current operating procedures doesn't require every shot to be an aimed kill shot, and even if they changed, there are many many more easier cheaper ways of doing so than giving every soldier one of these rifles.
 
I've heart allot of number on cost. $100-$2000 a bullet. The $100 is once mass production begins. That's way cheaper that a smart bomb or missile even at $1000 a pop. This round is for shooting something that just has to die. If you could save just one of our sons or daughters lives a thousand bucks is cheap. The next step is lockon after lanch like a javelin missile. Soon fighter pilots will not have to point their aircraft to use their guns, just turn their head and tap the trigger. The laser targeting system does the rest. Just like lockon after launch missile do today.

Soon if you can see it, you can kill it.

Murphy's law of combat...if your enemy is in range so are you. This may not be so true anymore.

Boomer
 
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Boomer, Apache helicopter pilots already only have to turn their heads and tap the trigger. They don't have guided munitions, but the advanced targeting and firing system takes care of most variables well enough ;)
 
The lock on after lanch will let you lock a target, fire and then keep moving. Once you've locked the target you don't have to keep your sight in the target because the laser targeting system is doing it for you.

I take several seconds for a bullet to travel long distances. Imagine firing a bullet that guides it self to the target. That way you can fire several shots at one or more targets before the first shot even hits.


Modern self propelled artillery can fire 5 shots at differant trajectories and have all five rounds hit the same target with in 1 second of each other. How about firing full auto and having every round hit at 1000 yards.

The mighty archer. Multiple round simultaneous impact

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPzPuK0TK80&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Boomer
 
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The lock on after lanch will let you lock a target, fire and then keep moving. Once you've locked the target you don't have to keep your sight in the target because the laser targeting system is doing it for you.

I take several seconds for a bullet to travel long distances. Imagine firing a bullet that guides it self to the target. That way you can fire several shots at one or more targets before the first shot even hits.


Modern self propelled artillery can fire 5 shots at differant trajectories and have all five rounds hit the same target with in 1 second of each other. How about firing full auto and having every round hit at 1000 yards.

The mighty archer. Multiple round simultaneous impact

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPzPu...e_gdata_player

Boomer
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That Archer is pretty cool, but from my understanding, Israeli mobile artillery units (specifically Darkon aka Dragon) have been doing this for many years using regular self-propelled onefivefive's and quick math through targeting computers. To good effect in Lebanon/Cast Lead in 06 and 08.

The TrackingPoint is damn amazing, seems to me like a $20somethingthousanddollar Kentucky Windage machine. Artillery targeting computers, yes, OK, with a 44kg M107 projectile, but with a ~200gr bullet? Cant imagine it being able to factor wind in, although it is probably really useful for humidity and baro pressure readings as well as eliminating the need for a bullet drop chart. Pretty cool overall, but I'd just buy a 6k rifle and take 16k worth of long-range shooting courses. I can't imagine that it shoots 22k worth of "good."

EDIT: Does anybody also think that a champion 1000m shooter would actually be hindered by this system? That is, when the task is putting shots within inches of each other as opposed to at an obvious 24 inch plate?
 
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Yes, as it sits the cheytech can do cold bore shots at 2000 yards, but you still need to know what you're doing. But what if joe schmo could do that the first time he ever fired a gun :eek:

Boomer
 
I'll wait for the laser guided round, the opposite of Trackingpoint, where the gun is inexpensive off the shelf, wind is not as much of an issue, but bullets are a lot more. You can buy a lot of bullets for $15-20K difference.
 
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