Time for a rethink? (drug war)

N

Northern Sod Breaker

New member
I've had an interest in politics for quite a few years now. In that that time not one person has ever said to me that in hind sight prohibition on alcohol worked as it was intended. But when the words are changed from alcohol to a controlled substance like Crack well then it's different somehow according to these same people.

I would like for dangerous drugs to be off the streets just as much as anyone. But wishing won't make it so. But I will say this. As someone who had a cousin killed in a drug deal. At what point does banning something result in more damage then allowing it to remain legal? And another question. How can we come to this forum and say firearms are neither good nor evil and people are, Yet at the same time we label a drug as evil. How are people exempt from the issue of drugs being good or evil. A person has to bear in mind that most drug are quite recent.

At what point do we conclude that people should be allowed to make their own choices independant from govt. influence even it it means their own demise.
 
Interesting day to post...

I agree that drug policy in America needs change, this war on drugs is a waste of taxpayer money. I totally agree with medical marijuana though, and truth of the matter is; the government likes to use propaganda from a few problematic people who abuse while ignoring the millions of others who use but function in society. Since when does a government have authority to dictate what we as individuals put into our bodies? Assuming we harm no one else, it should be no one's business what one consumes.


Epyon
 
I'm in my late fifties and very much remember the early sixties and seventies and the growing drug culture. My choice was I never partaked, but on the other hand I would not condemn those who do so long as it did not affect me.

As I've gotten older I've come to believe that the whole drug thing is beyond all control of any kind by anybody and I mean anybody. Prohibition did not work and it is not working for illicit drugs either and probably never will. If the government called a cease fire and started regulating and selling drugs overnight there would still be a black market for under priced and unregulated drugs so that is not the answer.

Frankly, I don't think there is a viable answer at this point. There are way too many people profiting from illicit drugs. The government profits by fighting it. Politicians benefit. Growers, importers, sellers and buyers benefit. Hell even lawyers and bankers benefit. Drugs are a big time part of the worlds economy as whole governments, standing armies and all the support apparatus benefits.

The point, well I don't know, I just don't know what we as humans can do about this now as the Jennie is out of the bottle and it ain't going back in.
 
Drug traffic is rampant. Here in New Mexico people are killed all the time about it. Polomos 35 miles south of here there has been 20 people killed in the last few months. The Mexican Police come running over the border and request asylum in fear of there lives. What a Hoot!


Richardson declared Medical Marijuana legal here. No one in the state government will touch it in fear of the Feds Prosecutions on the stuff.

Marijuana is classed as a Narcotic and by definition is not. If they would just tax the tar out of it like tobacco and sell it , most of the crap would stop.
 
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If the government called a cease fire and started regulating and selling drugs overnight there would still be a black market for under priced and unregulated drugs so that is not the answer.
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I don't think so, not in the way you think. The most abused drugs in this country (after caffeine, nicotine, and alcohol) are prescription drugs. How much bootlegging of cigarettes and alcohol is there? Sure, there is some, but the majority of that industry is gone.
 
The "War on Drugs" was never about drugs.

Nixon hated anti-Vietnam-war hippies, so he started the War on Drugs as a method to systematically persecute them. Subsequent presidents and congresses (esp Reagan) realized that the War on Drugs was a perfect distraction/excuse for the militarization of the police, the passage of draconian laws and policies, and the erosion of the rights and liberties of the American people. In this sense, the War on Drugs has been an incredible success.

The government is not interested in winning or ending the War on Drugs, because that would bring an end to the War on Drugs, and it still is useful to them. Though we haven't heard too much about the War on Drugs lately, ever since the government was presented with an even more powerful diversion and excuse, The Global War on Terror.
 
Endless wars keep sheep in line...

War on drugs, war on brown peo... er I mean terror, what will they think of next to take away rights systematically? If people would take off the partyline blinders they'd come to realize both sides of the aisle are corrupt and seek only to stay in power regardless of the American people. It's stupid that a person in possession of a little green leaf will get time in the slammer with no early release, most of whom are NON-VIOLENT offenders. Yet the rapists and murderers get a second chance to go back onto the streets and rape and kill again, really fair justice system if you ask me. :barf::barf::barf:


Epyon
 
That's a tough one. Excessive alcohol consumption is still a major cause of...bad things. Legal, controlled or not, still a risk.

Personally I only drink at home when I know driving won't be in the picture. And even then, just a glass.

No telling what would happen if MJ was made legal but controlled.
 
i do security in one of the low income housing projects in my city and drugs are a big problem as well as alcohol. i tell all the guys that work under me that we will never clean up the projects but we can make it somewhat a better living environment for the few good people who live there. the same goes for the war on drugs. the government will never be able to get rid of all the illegal drugs but they can do what they can to get as much of it off the streets as possible. doing something is better than doing nothing at all.
 
drugs

At what point do we conclude that people should be allowed to make their own choices independant from govt. influence even it it means their own demise.

I am all for people doing what they want as long as it only affects them but it just doesn't stop there.

Kill a innocent person in a car accident because you were high---I got a problem with that.
Run over a child in the street because your stoned--another problem.
There have even been cases of doctors and dentists harming people because they were using while giving care.
What if it is a family member of yours?? Would it be OK because heck, he was making his own choice.
It just doesn't stop with the user, it can and often times does affect people who come in contact with the user.

I will agree, the "war on drugs" is a joke---I believe that there is no war--to many rich people getting richer at the expense of decent hard working people who are caught in the middle.

Rich
 
Kill a innocent person in a car accident because you were high---I got a problem with that.
Run over a child in the street because your stoned--another problem.
There have even been cases of doctors and dentists harming people because they were using while giving care.
What if it is a family member of yours?? Would it be OK because heck, he was making his own choice.
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Uhhh, excuse me, but I am sure that everyone would think that doing these things would be a problem. But what does that have to do with legalization?
These things exist whether drugs are illegal or not. Using drugs under these circumstances would still be illegal (alcohol, anyone?)

There are problems that only exist because of the illegalization. Abandon prohibition and these problems would go away. The remaining problems can then be focused on. (Note:I've mentioned these in the past, do not want to derail the topic here.)
 
Let state-inspected drug factories exist, just like the Kentucky Bourbon factories. Smoke and inject responsibly, or go to jail. In such a future, criminality would go down at least 50% of today. At low cost, no more robberies and burglaries to pay for the stuff. Let people live and die the way they want to. Personally, I'm going to let my .357 magnum retire me when I'm too old and tired to wipe my own ***.
 
As a government program (or rather, series of programs), the "war on drugs" is failing. I think it would be better if the government legalized certain drugs (they could even profit from it). I don't think that certain drug use is any more detrimental than alcohol use. The government cannot control what people do to their bodies...it is simply not within their effective power. I don't think it is in their mandate either.

I'm for usage restrictions, rather than possession restrictions. You drive while high-->go to jail. You do any illegal stuff while under the influence-->go to jail. You get high and sit in your basement-->...so?

I do realize that even people who get high in private will often create negative effects among their friends/families. However, I don't think it is the government's job to take care of that. This respect is very similar to alcohol, IMO. I know people who abuse alcohol, and it is bad, but it is not the government's job to step in.
 
The "War on Drugs" is big business and many, many people profit from it. Do not expect such a profitable enterprise to go away.
 
drugs

I do realize that even people who get high in private will often create negative effects among their friends/families. However, I don't think it is the government's job to take care of that. This respect is very similar to alcohol, IMO. I know people who abuse alcohol, and it is bad, but it is not the government's job to step in.

Ha, don't kid yourself, the government has already stepped in.
Who do you think takes care of all the kids born to and neglected by the drug addict no where to be found poor excuses for parents??
WE DO ---through the government--ain't that nice??
The drain on us is tremendous and does anyone really think that it will get better by legalizing it??
Telling Johnny and Jane that they can start using at 18 legally is like throwing gas on the fire to put it out----makes no sense.
Hey, I got a crazy idea!! Make the freakin penalties so darn severe that only the truly insane will deal drugs----I don't think Turkey has our drug problem--wonder why?? Look at how they deal with drug dealing.
Sorry, no bleeding heart liberal here--no excuses--use drugs get killed,hooked,arrested,eat out of dumpsters--to bad--your choice---life is hard for most people.
Our society ( meaning all of us) already supports the drug habits of many people--we raise their children---many of whom grow up then to rape, rob, murder and harass us as their way of saying thank you for your help when I needed it as a child---PLEASE!!
I have family and friends that work in both the medical and social fields--the drain is tremendous and some think we should add more??
Quit using taxpayers money to support drug usage and I'll shut up!!
For anyone that thinks that robberies and such will decrease through legalization, are you serious?
Were do you think the addict that can't hold a job is going to get the money for his drugs??
Would you like to the government to FORCE employers to hire addicts??
Do you know how addictive some of the drugs out there today are??
Should the state have free drug clinics for the addicts--pass it out like candy to keep the rest of us safe??
What do you propose??

Dipper
 
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NSB,
I think that the Libertarians and Constitutionalists on this forum will agree, but not the social Conservatives. Their whole premise ( the government must protect you from your own stupidity) is not far removed from the Liberals.

Yeah the "war" on drugs is stupid.
 
Hey Dipper- a few points:

1 How successful has the war on drugs been? How hard is it to get drugs?

2 The rate of incarceration in this country is already the highest of any nation in the world, due mainly to the war on drugs. We incarcerate people at a rate 4 times higher than the world average. How is that reducing drug selling?

3 Turkey is a major consumer and producer of opium. Turkey is home to a large number of laboratories refining opium raw materials into heroin. As much as 75 per cent of heroin seized in Europe has been processed in or smuggled through Turkey. Their harsh penalties aren't working.

4 Whether you tell Johnny and Jane they can use at 18 or not, they are. You can buy almost any drug you desire in any city in America. Besides, the most abused drugs in the country are prescription drugs, not street drugs. Just ask the conservative hero, Rush Limbaugh.
 
Legalization would be society essentially saying that illegal drugs are OK. Since they are NOT OK, that would be the wrong message to send about appropriate conduct.
 
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