The FBI has NOT committed to 9mm
- Thread starter KyJim
- Start date
.40S&W is the only handgun caliber at the local BigBox that they have so much of that it needs it's own bargain bin ...... been that way right through the "drought" ...... can't get .22lr, 9's are spotty at times ..... but there's been a mountain of every flavor of .40Short you can imagine, and often priced less than the comparable 9's ..... I might buy one if everybody starts dumping theirs, just for the temporary ammo glut.......
I think people find it interesting as its finally a long time overdue recognition (or sorts) that there is no magic bullet.
I am skeptical of the superior performance of the HST. If it improve 9mm, then it can (or new designs caliber specific ) will improve other calibers and you are back to the subjective aspect. i.e. once you have sufficient penetration nothing short of an exploding round(20mm minimum size last I knew) does much else (yes 50 cal poke a bigger hole but does not expand)
Keep on shooting what you like and keep arguing over which is better of course. Half the list would stop if not for that and we can't have that.
My take is I am comfortable with my choice, I don't think others are wrong with theirs but I also think its now (and has been for some time) totally subjective and no longer performer related.
Darn, that's right, we can still argue gun choice!
And that you for the following, it was well done! Of course I would do a one time contribution and pay the FBI $25 to give up their glocks! Poor guys and gals, they at least deserved a decent DA/SA gun!.
I am skeptical of the superior performance of the HST. If it improve 9mm, then it can (or new designs caliber specific ) will improve other calibers and you are back to the subjective aspect. i.e. once you have sufficient penetration nothing short of an exploding round(20mm minimum size last I knew) does much else (yes 50 cal poke a bigger hole but does not expand)
Keep on shooting what you like and keep arguing over which is better of course. Half the list would stop if not for that and we can't have that.
My take is I am comfortable with my choice, I don't think others are wrong with theirs but I also think its now (and has been for some time) totally subjective and no longer performer related.
Darn, that's right, we can still argue gun choice!
And that you for the following, it was well done! Of course I would do a one time contribution and pay the FBI $25 to give up their glocks! Poor guys and gals, they at least deserved a decent DA/SA gun!.
Knightsofnee
New member
J. Edgar Hoover wouldn't be caught dead in a Vera Wang outfit.
I agree, I have made up my mind on what to carry or not carry. I do enjoy reading the results of publically funded ballistic tests, and that does have an influence on my purchase of self defense ammunition, but not caliber or pistol.
The FBI all could wear Indian Headdresses for all I care, I am not going to put one on because the FBI is wearing them. I know one FBI agent, nice guy, but he is not a snake eating Special Ops Kill, Kill, Kill type. He is a paper pusher: goes out and talks to people, reads reports, writes reports. I have not asked him his opinion, but I suspect he does not want some heavy hunk of metal that will pull his pants down and hook on the armrests of conference room chairs.
I may buy a lottery ticket. When the gov starts making as much sense as that FBI memo I feel like the stars are in a weird place.
If I am reading it correctly, and again I am not sure I am since I still do not expect any gov agency to make this much sense... They are saying that SINCE LEO's miss 70-80% of the shots that they take AND since many 9mm loads meet good criteria for terminal ballistic performance AND since many can shoot the 9mm better esp. in a dynamic setting THEN for them and perhaps others 9mm is a good choice.
It's an argument based not just on "thoery" of size / wound channel etc but also the realities of human performance in training and real life use of force.
Put another way a 9mm hole in the bad guy beats a 40 / 45 or whatever miss.
What an awesome pile of sense they make.
That being said what does it matter to anyone? I do not think one can argue that the other calibers might not have an added benefits for those that CAN deliver them effectively under stress and one has to balance mag capacity and caliber.
When FBI HRT and regional swat dumps their 45's and goes to a 9mm glock or novack BHp as they had previously then myself and others will really take notice. Overall I do not see this moving the mark very much at all in terms of what American law enforcement carries. Agencies with staff pushing to move from 9mm may have just had some of the wind striped from their sails.
If I am reading it correctly, and again I am not sure I am since I still do not expect any gov agency to make this much sense... They are saying that SINCE LEO's miss 70-80% of the shots that they take AND since many 9mm loads meet good criteria for terminal ballistic performance AND since many can shoot the 9mm better esp. in a dynamic setting THEN for them and perhaps others 9mm is a good choice.
It's an argument based not just on "thoery" of size / wound channel etc but also the realities of human performance in training and real life use of force.
Put another way a 9mm hole in the bad guy beats a 40 / 45 or whatever miss.
What an awesome pile of sense they make.
That being said what does it matter to anyone? I do not think one can argue that the other calibers might not have an added benefits for those that CAN deliver them effectively under stress and one has to balance mag capacity and caliber.
When FBI HRT and regional swat dumps their 45's and goes to a 9mm glock or novack BHp as they had previously then myself and others will really take notice. Overall I do not see this moving the mark very much at all in terms of what American law enforcement carries. Agencies with staff pushing to move from 9mm may have just had some of the wind striped from their sails.