The continuing militarization of police

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Origionally posted by jimpeel :

Congratulations.

All you have shown is that the police have a history of corruption.

You'd have done better posting this post http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost....58&postcount=5

Of course this part would kinda screw up your premise
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Why didn't you post the rest of that post jim? Here, I'll do it for you...

Origionally posted by jimpeel :

I have spoken to a few of the older cops who have pulled the pin or taken early retirement because they don't like what they see coming in the bottom end of the force. They call them "cowboys" and I can't disagree. Gone are the days when the cops took you down and arrested you. These days they go to the gun as the first, not last, resort. "He's got a knife!" BLAM, BLAM, BLAM!

You are lucky to be alive with the way the cops act these days. If you had been in Denver, we likely would be reading a post here from your wife telling us that you had been shot and killed.
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Origionally posted by jimpeel :

So if I get pulled over by a cop for an infraction and I roll the window down one inch and push my driver's licence, proof of registration, and proof of insurance through the crack; and when he takes it roll the window up, turn my back to him and refuse further intercourse with him am I in violation of this ruling?

I say "No".

If, after he writes the violation and presents it for signature, I roll the window down three inches, sign the cite and shove it back through the window am I in violation of this ruling?

I say "No".

All I have done is assure myself of being cited for the violation; even if he were in the mood to issue a simple warning.

He may, however, be p---ed off at my attitude and use his power to further harm me by seeking violations other than those for which I was stopped. He may demand to give the vehicle a safety chack or to make me wait while a dog comes out to hit on my car; and rest assured that the dog will, indeed, hit on my car. The dog does what it is told to do by the handler and if he tells it to alert on my car it will do exactly as it is told.

I am under no obligation -- moral, legal, or social -- to communicate with him; not even so much as a grunt or a shake of the head. I am under no obligation whatsoever to even acknowledge his presence on this Earth as a human being. Once he writes the cite, and his PC is satisfied, I should be allowed to procede. Yeah. Right.

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1370875&postcount=50
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Tbo

And your point would be ---- WHAT????

I noticed that you were the threadparent of that thread entitled Police can demand ID, high court rules

I reiterate my rights under the Constitution and you take it as cop bashing?

I don't say what you would like to hear and you call it cop bashing?

I eliminate the ability for the cop to harm me beyond the PC and you call it cop bashing?

Why are you against a citizen exercising his Constitutional rights?

Why do you find an American citizen exercising his rights so depicable?

What is it about the truth that bothers you so much?

Why can't you differentiate between reality and a hypothetical?

Are you saying that a dog handler cannot order his dog to alert on a suspect vehicle? It has been proven to have been done.

Fully 92% of all currency in circulation is tainted with cocaine and the cops know it. Seizure and forfeiture laws have turned cops into bounty hunters. Why should I trust them?

Are you saying that a cop would never do as I have stated and administer a little "street justice"?

Are you one of those cops who do this to assert their power under color of authority? Your attitude on this board does not translate well to any other conclusion.

Am I the type of "civilian" you just drool about stopping? Are "my type" what makes your day?

Why don't we agree on this:

I am anti bad-cop and pro good-cop.

You are pro any-cop regardless of stripe.

Now run off and find another post of mine to hoist as proof of my cop hating ways.
 
Tbo

Why don't we just stop this tet-a-tet because you CAN"T piss me off; but if I piss you off I'm afraid you will just go to work and take it out on some poor schlub and I wouldn't want that.

Good Night.
 
In my post http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...6&postcount=74 directed at you, I stated:

TheeBadOne

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The word for the day is "hypothetical".

I did not say that this was my practice. It was a "What if" scenario.

Know the difference.

But I guess you didn't read that far or it didn't suit your needs.
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And my reply then, as now, was:

jimpeel I am disappointed in you. First a very short response "It was just a hypothetical situation". That doesn't change a thing as it's still indicative of a thought process.
Next, you shift focus and minimize your responsibility by bringing up another separate LEO beating incident as if to say "See! There"! (ie: Cops are bad, I told you so!). It reminds me of the defense developed in people as kids. When ever a kid gets called on his conduct/actions, instead of stepping up, they point their finger at someone/something else and say "See".
I think you could benefit from an objective self-inventory.

All the best
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To which you replied:
TheeBadOne

You can be as disappointed as you like. The response was objective and subjective.

You scolded me for being an LEO basher but when I point to someone who is literally bashing someone with a deadly instrument, deserving of my enmity, I am accused of some sort of drunken moral relativism.

I apologize for the "short response" but I try to reply with brevity where possible. When I get long winded, you'll know it.

Of course it was a "thought process"! These keystrokes are a thought process. Are we going to go down the road of the thought being as bad as the deed? It was a hypothetical; a typical "what if" situation. People use them all of the time; especially politicians and those who live in the land of What If.
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And I said:
jimpeel my point exactly. If someone were to write about "hanging all (insert racial slur) and how to go about it", they could do as you have and then say they were just "speaking hypothetically". It's still indicative of the thought process/values/etc behind it.

"You scolded me for being an LEO basher

I don't think I said anything like that, but perhaps you have started your personal inventory and feel a bit of "if the shoe fits...".
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So you drifted and starting throwing out accusations to which I replied:
"I know you are but what am I" is not going to advance, heal, or start the process of two groups finding common ground. (if one is interested in that).
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The point??????? :confused:
It's something I said a long time ago, and bears repeating now.
Jim, you are quite the happy fellow.

A perfect example of what really breeds the "US vs THEM" mentality. Keep up the good statesmanship. You are doing wonders for civilian/cop relations. I'm sure that you look at it one sided though and think, "Boy, was that Cop short with me!" and scurry to your Internet Boards to say what a JBT this/that Cop was. Look in the mirror, look at your personal attitude/bias. Are you really helping to improve things or just grinding your own axe? Wouldn't you rather be part of the good fight, part of a positive force?

All the best
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As I sit and read post after post in this discussion, a couple of things repeatedly occur to me:

1. When observing the attitudes and treatment form "civilians" toward LEO, no wonder the LEO community is so tight, at least (except for a few bad apples) they know they can trust other LEO.... Come to think of it, I only have a friend or two that AREN'T LEO.

2. Bad debate and bad science share the fact that it is easy to find evidence to support your opinion/view... good debaters and good scientists look to DISPROVE their own opinions to validate or eradicate them.

3. It would seem (to some) that life is so much better and more sensible if you can point a finger and say "It's their fault"

I could go on, but what is the point, it would seem that the majority have "dug in" on their point of view. A friend once told me... " ... every time I put on my uniform, I know that if I'm in trouble on the side of the road fighting with a perp that wants me dead, there are only two kinds of people that will help me, other cops and the righteous. I'm 53, and I don't know if I've ever met a righteous person." That saddened me beyond belief.
 
"You scolded me for being an LEO basher

I don't think I said anything like that, but perhaps you have started your personal inventory and feel a bit of "if the shoe fits...".
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Talk about selective posting! :eek:

What you said is here along with my response.:

In post http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1371576&postcount=111 I stated:
TheeBadOne

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Quote:
I don't think I said anything like that, but perhaps you have started your personal inventory and feel a bit of "if the shoe fits...".

No. What you said in YOUR POST was:

A perfect example of what really breeds the "US vs THEM" mentality. Keep up the good statesmanship. You are doing wonders for civilian/cop relations. I'm sure that you look at it one sided though and think, "Boy, was that Cop short with me!" and scurry to your Internet Boards to say what a JBT this/that Cop was.
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In case you have forgotten, JBT means "Jack-Booted Thug".

But perhaps it was just a "thought process", an "implication", a "suggestion"; or maybe it was an outright accusation. Call it what you will if it satisfies your need for obfuscation.

Perhaps some introspection is in order for you as well.
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I have NEVER used the term "JBT" on these or any other boards except to quote others, like you, who do or as an example.
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1370951&postcount=55
(Don't take the "we" out of context, please. Just thought I'd head you off)

If you search on "jbt's" you get 157 "hits" If you search on "jbt's" by "jimpeel" you get zero "hits".

But your denials of calling me a cop basher are now flaccid after THIS POST:
Long time no see. Too bad you haven't grown.
Still the same old thinly veiled LEO bashing...

...

Soooooo, in closing, either work on your admitted bias, grow, or just stop the thinly veiled LEO bashing
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You called me a cop basher and implied that I have always been one
Still the same old thinly veiled LEO bashing
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-- 'nuf said.
 
Wouldn't you rather be part of the good fight, part of a positive force?



Why don't we just stop this tet-a-tet because you CAN"T piss me off; but if I piss you off I'm afraid you will just go to work and take it out on some poor schlub and I wouldn't want that.
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