The aftermath - realistic assessments of the situation please

Are you sure they're gun owners? False flags are far from unknown in this fight.

On the internet, I'm really a cowboy astronaut secret agent.
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Let me guess....you don't use Facebook....

It doesn't work that way.
Facebook "friends" are, by a huge, huge margin, people that you know pretty well - not a bunch of anonymous "handles".
 
What role do you think gun owners will play in passing this upcoming ban on semiautomatic rifles? On firearms forums I mostly see people opposed to a ban. However on other media, like Facebook, I see a lot of gun owners supporting a ban. (Coincidentally, they don't own ARs.)

I've always felt a divide and conquer strategy would be effective on this issue. If they can get hunters and CCWers to hand AR owners over, who will stand behind CCWers when Congress pushes a handgun ban? Who will stand behind hunters or benchrest shooters when they try to ban "sniper rifles"?
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I don't think that the divide and conquer strategy will be as easy for the anti's to use as it was in the past. The demographic of gun owners is quite different than it was in the years leading up to the '94 AWB. Back then, the majority of gun owners were hunters, target shooters, or other "sportsmen" that had little or no interest in "assault weapons". Likewise, handgun ownership was not as prevalent in part because many states did not allow concealed carry thus rendering the primary usefulness of a handgun a moot point.

In that sort of environment, it was much easier to characterize shooters who were interested in handguns or "assault weapons" as an extremist fringe group. Back then there were enough gun owners willing to throw others under the bus so long as their deer rifles and trap guns were promised to be left alone that the AWB was able to pass though with barely enough votes.

Today, things are very different. While hunting continues to decline, gun sales are at record highs and the NRA is registering 8,000 new members a day. Likewise, "assault weapons" are increasingly used for hunting and other sporting purposes with AR-15 derivatives being particularly popular. The big sellers in the gun industry have been handguns and "assault weapons" for several years. This is because the largest and fastest growing segment of gun owners are those interested in guns for self-defense and, while the anti's don't want to admit it, handguns and "assault weapons" are among the best types for self-defense.
 
Since we this title has realistic assessment, how about the Gov. Of NY floating the confiscation idea? How irresponsible is this? I cannot imagine what lawful gun owners in that state are thinking about that, but it comes as a shock to me as someone who studies history. This echoes back to pre-Revolutionary rifle confiscation of the British.
 
Hal said:
Let me guess....you don't use Facebook....

It doesn't work that way.
Facebook "friends" are, by a huge, huge margin, people that you know pretty well - not a bunch of anonymous "handles".
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Actually my experience with FB is the opposite. Many, if not most people simply "friend" anybody they can just so they have lots of "friends". I no longer use Facebook but when I did I had a couple hundred "friends", no small number of whom I had never met in person. Beyond that, work associates and people from school daze and such are very common. They're acquaintances, sure, but there's no reason to believe they share your worldview. In my experience, the "huge, huge margin", was exactly the other way. 5:1 were people you barely know.

Besides which, being an "actual gun owner" means less than nothing. Biden, Pelosi and Feinstein are "actual gun owners".
 
I will confess that I barely use Facebook out of concern for privacy issues. However, I'm with Brian on this. 90% of the "friend" requests are from people I've never heard of.
 
First of all I don't see confiscation becoming a reality.

Secondly how are they going to know what I own, and what I have sold, if there are no record-keeping regulations in my state for private sales?

Even if they track my purchases through dealers, how can they prove I haven't sold them in private sales transactions?

Sorry, no guns in this house. Sold 'em all.
 
AH. I hear you. I just thought it was irresponsible to even suggest. Confiscation of citizen's legally purchased possessions flies in the face of so many rights that it was a bit surprising - even for New York.
 
I use Facebook on a daily basis. Social media are a very powerful force in public opinion these days, and we should not overlook those outlets as a means to sway the "fence sitters." (We'll never get the hardcore antis to jump the fence, so attempting to do so is wasted energy, IMO.)

I kept my mouth shut for the first few days after the Sandy Hook shooting while I "took the pulse" of my FB friends, all of whom I know in real life. Then I composed a long post containing my thoughts on Sandy Hook, the 2A, and the RKBA. I had several requests to repost, and all I asked was that they "tag" me in it with something like "Thanks to Spats McGee" so that I could track my own post. This has allowed me to reach out and engage in several "conversations" about these matters. That was several days ago, and I have not been called a "whackjob" yet.
 
I grieve for the victims especially the kids. No one can imagine the grief, the feelings of loss and the anger that the parents must feel. The damage that this one sick psychopathic moron has caused is unfathomable.
As for us we simply are screwed.
 
WayneinFL said:
What role do you think gun owners will play in passing this upcoming ban on semiautomatic rifles? On firearms forums I mostly see people opposed to a ban. However on other media, like Facebook, I see a lot of gun owners supporting a ban. (Coincidentally, they don't own ARs.)
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There are, indeed, a lot of "casual" (for lack of a better term) gun owners who don't own an AR-style or AK-style firearm and who never will, who would be happy to throw the "military-style assault weapons" owners under the bus as long as they get to keep their shotguns, bolt-action hunting (and target) rifles, and mil-surp collectables. If that's what they think is going to happen this time, they're wrong.

The gun banners erred seriously in 1994. They zeroed in too closely on being too specific about what they were banning, and about what defined (for them) an "assault weapon." Flash hiders, bayonet lugs, and telescoping stocks were standard features of military weapons, hence they became "evil." Surprise, surprise ... companies who manufacture guns are in the business of manufacturing guns, so they simply shifted gears slightly and manufactured AR-15 "type" rifles in post-ban configuration: No flash hider, no bayonet lug, fixed stock, 10-round magazine. Done.

The gun grabbers went berserk. "FOUL!" they cried. "It still looks eeeeevvillll! They're taking advantage of a loophole in the law!"

No, dummies, they were NOT taking advantage of a "loophole" -- they were manufacturing firearms in complete, total, 100 percent compliance with the language of the law YOU enacted. Calling that taking advantage of a loophole is like a cop stopping a guy driving 64 miles an hour on a 65 MPH highway and accusing him of "taking advantage of a loophole" to avoid a speeding ticket by not speeding.

The problem today is, the critters in Washington know they screwed up with the 1994 AWB, and they are determined that they will not leave such "loopholes" the next time. Whatever they propose this time around, you can be assured that it will be far more draconian, and far wider in scope. They still do their best to confuse the public, but they know the difference between single shot, semi-automatic, and automatic. They're after ALL semi-automatic firearms this time, so the guys who think their Ruger Mini-14 or Mini-30, or SKS, or M1A will be safe had better reconsider whose side they are on.
 
As for us we simply are screwed.
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We are if folks sit on the fence and believe they are. If gun owners get involved, then we can stop new restrictions from happening.

As it is, we haven't seen any of the proposed legislation yet, so it's far too early to form any sort of conclusion.
 
We are if folks sit on the fence and believe they are. If gun owners get involved, then we can stop new restrictions from happening.
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As much as I'd love to agree, think of the million or so practicing doctors that felt the same way with ObamaCare.

Were the people directly affected by the act heard? Was their opinion or expertise counted when they disagreed with the second-handers who run our government? No.
 
As for us we simply are screwed.
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Having an attitude of being defeated at the opening bell of a 12 round fight will surely get us just that... defeated.

There is no sense in believing that our gun rights have been given to us by the government. This 'war' that pro 2nd Amendment people have been fighting for many years has seen many battles and between the anti-gun groups and many of today's politicians, there are going to be many more battles.

We can choose to lay down and let our rights be stripped or we can get involved and fight to retain them

No...we are NOT simply screwed.
 
We can choose to lay down and let our rights be stripped or we can get involved and fight to retain them
No...we are NOT simply screwed
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No we are not screwed (yet), so get off your butt and do something to help. Contribute to the NRA, write your congressmen and senators, but do something.
 
Simply, this is no time to give up. This is exactly the time to stand up. This what the founding fathers had in mind when they wrote the bill of rights.
 
December 23rd

The National Rifle Association made clear Sunday it will not budge on its opposition to any new gun laws, despite heated criticism of the organization's response to the Connecticut school massacre.
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"I know there's a media machine in this country that wants to blame guns every time something happens," he said, adding, "I know there's an anti-Second Amendment industry in this town."
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http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/22/politics/gun-debate/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
 
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