Taught my son a lesson in awareness & safety yesterday
- Thread starter threegun
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David Armstrong
Moderator
The question is not whether there is an issue about owning something, the issue is how that something is displayed/used and how that fits into one's overall lifestyle and security. Would you go to Nuevo Laredo and pull out a stack of $100 bills to buy a belt? Part of the "awareness" that is talked about so much is understanding what messages are being sent to the public and understanding the dangers. Like was mentioned above, taking an expensive sports car for a drive in the country is very different than leaving it parked overnight in the bad part of town.
Stay out in the country then. If you find yourself in the city for whatever reason leave once you realize the mistake.
I realize that my chain, wedding band, heck even my children's chains are attractants for bad guys. Things as simple as your clothing are attractants for bad guys. You can either dress like a bum and wear no gold or you can remain vigilant and make good decisions. I choose to remain vigilant and stay on the better side of town.
JoeBlackSpade
New member
Just busting your balls, threegun.
Sometimes you have a plan, and the unexpected happens.
In some cities (take Orlando, for example) you can be driving through a neighborhood with multi-million dollar homes, and then get on I-4, take the wrong exit, and within 2 miles, you can be driving through a trash neighborhood, faster than you can say "Oops, wrong turn". One minute you're looking at well trimmed shrubs, and parked Mercedes cars, the next minute you're being waved at by toothless hoochie mamas in bike-shorts and halter tops, and dodging Mr. baggy-pants-dreadlocks guy with a brown paper bag in his hand at 10:45 in the morning.
Sometimes you have a plan, and the unexpected happens.
In some cities (take Orlando, for example) you can be driving through a neighborhood with multi-million dollar homes, and then get on I-4, take the wrong exit, and within 2 miles, you can be driving through a trash neighborhood, faster than you can say "Oops, wrong turn". One minute you're looking at well trimmed shrubs, and parked Mercedes cars, the next minute you're being waved at by toothless hoochie mamas in bike-shorts and halter tops, and dodging Mr. baggy-pants-dreadlocks guy with a brown paper bag in his hand at 10:45 in the morning.
JoeBlack, I agree. In this case I knew the area in general was low income I just got turned around a bit. I thought I was a few miles from the real bad areas. I know Tampa pretty well and the areas to avoid. The rest is pretty much hit or miss with violence. I live in a pretty decent area of Tampa still less than 3 miles from my home a U.S. Marine veteran (fought in Afghanistan and Iraq & was going for his third tour) was robbed and killed......for of all things.......his chain
. A Chicago disciples gang member wanted his chain and the Marine resisted. The chain was not even taken. The bad guy told police why he did it in custody. So this side or that side of town doesn't mean safe and not safe it just reduces or increases the frequency of crime.
. A Chicago disciples gang member wanted his chain and the Marine resisted. The chain was not even taken. The bad guy told police why he did it in custody. So this side or that side of town doesn't mean safe and not safe it just reduces or increases the frequency of crime.
. I pity the fools neck LOL.David Armstrong
Moderator
I somehow fail to see how that relates to anything that was said.
So the question becomes why attract bad guys if you don’t really need to?
I find it strange that you would think those concepts are all mutually exclusive. One can dress quite nicely without looking like a bum. Similarly, one can dress like a bum and still wear a lot of gold. One can make good decisions no matter how they dress or what kind of bling they sport. And remaining vigilant is not a factor of how you dress.
So, why DON'T you take off the necklace and the Rolex when going fishing? is there a REASON for not taking it off? (or for putting it on in the AM, in the FIRST place, when going fishing?)
Or do you wear them to bed too? (I bet your wife LOVES having to shave her head so you don't pull her hair out with all that nice flex-weave metal...)
there is a time and place for everything, and fishing and bling really AREN'T related...
Or do you wear them to bed too? (I bet your wife LOVES having to shave her head so you don't pull her hair out with all that nice flex-weave metal...)
there is a time and place for everything, and fishing and bling really AREN'T related...
Ed Lawrence
Inactive
If you really wanted to teach your son a lesson in awareness and safety, you would have left as soon as you realized that you were not in the safeset location.
You would also teach him that it is not wise to go into questionable areas wearing thousands of dollars worht of jewlery.
Like David said in his example about being seen in questionable areas with a huge wad of bills.
You would also teach him that it is not wise to go into questionable areas wearing thousands of dollars worht of jewlery.
Like David said in his example about being seen in questionable areas with a huge wad of bills.
Like I said stay out of questionable areas. If you find yourself in a questionable area leave ASAP bills or no bills. Many things are attractants for the criminal including your attire. Dress in a business suit and you will attract a bad guy before that old tank top w/ dungarees.
Ain't perfect. Try like heck to be safe but ain't perfect.
Done. Taught (both boys) that people will rob you for a pair of expensive sneakers much less a pocket full of cash. Since I don't remove the chain or wedding band my approach is to stay out of the hood. I made a mistake and corrected it when it dawned on me.
BTW, Please send me a list of appropriate locations and times to wear my chain and wedding band
.Hemicuda, Don't own a Rolex......yet. I don't like to wear watches. Rolex's are big and heavy. I have pondered the thought of getting one but Gold is too high right now. I'll wait until that presidential comes in for 6 thousand or so. I need to wear a watch just annoys the heck out of my wrist.
Never take it off. Its a big cuban link chain so it doesn't catch hair.
I know I know.........I'm still waiting for you guys to give me a certified list of appropriate times and locations to wear my "bling" LOL. Really though I don't even think about the chain since it stays on all the time. Sometimes I will put it inside my shirt as I would have done in this instance if not for my tank top.
Never take it off. Its a big cuban link chain so it doesn't catch hair.
I know I know.........I'm still waiting for you guys to give me a certified list of appropriate times and locations to wear my "bling" LOL. Really though I don't even think about the chain since it stays on all the time. Sometimes I will put it inside my shirt as I would have done in this instance if not for my tank top.
David,
Don't know? In your life pick something you do that attracts bad guys or increases your danger level unnecessarily and ask yourself the same question. I do understand your point though. I believe that I posted I would have hidden my chain in my shirt if not for the tank I was wearing.
I just prefer to stay in good areas to begin with. Thinking that you are safe by leaving your gold at home is not smart. I don't know Nuevo Lurado but if is a bad area I'll just stay out in the first place.
People like to criticize yet they are the first one walking out of a bar at 1am. Everybody does something that may increase their odds of being targeted. My chink is the chain whats yours?
Don't know? In your life pick something you do that attracts bad guys or increases your danger level unnecessarily and ask yourself the same question. I do understand your point though. I believe that I posted I would have hidden my chain in my shirt if not for the tank I was wearing.
I just prefer to stay in good areas to begin with. Thinking that you are safe by leaving your gold at home is not smart. I don't know Nuevo Lurado but if is a bad area I'll just stay out in the first place.
People like to criticize yet they are the first one walking out of a bar at 1am. Everybody does something that may increase their odds of being targeted. My chink is the chain whats yours?
David Armstrong
Moderator
The key is “unnecessarily.” To the best of my knowledge I do not do anything to unnecessarily increase my danger level or attract bad guys. Sometimes it is necessary to do that, but I make an effort to reduce the chances. To me, that is the point of this discussion. I’ve got the nice gold neck chain (Russian gold, BTW) and matching bracelet. I’ve got the Rolex watch. I’ve got the real $5 gold eagle cufflinks. But they usually sit in the safe instead of being worn every day. I don’t feel the need to impress anybody in my usual daily activities and dress, and thus I reduce my attractiveness as a target for hostile activities.
Well, if I go to the bar (rarely) I tend to leave early and I have a 2-drink limit. And if I do anything that unnecessarily increases my odds of being targeted I’m not aware of it. If I were aware of it I would change it.
David, Believe it or not we agree. I assume the added risk. I try to hide it on those very rare occassions that I am in a bad area.
Let me ask though do you wear a wedding ring? What kind of car do you drive? How do you dress? Do you stay out into the wee hours of the night for fun?
BTW, Going to the bar increases your odds all by itself.
I tournament bass fish and find myself up and out of the house many times at 3am. That increases my chances. The chain increases my chances. Aside that I am a family man, no bars or partying of any kind. I promise that my trips into the hood with or without my chain are very rare the last being accidental.
When do you wear your Rolex and other jewelry? Why have it and not use it?
Let me ask though do you wear a wedding ring? What kind of car do you drive? How do you dress? Do you stay out into the wee hours of the night for fun?
BTW, Going to the bar increases your odds all by itself.
I tournament bass fish and find myself up and out of the house many times at 3am. That increases my chances. The chain increases my chances. Aside that I am a family man, no bars or partying of any kind. I promise that my trips into the hood with or without my chain are very rare the last being accidental.
When do you wear your Rolex and other jewelry? Why have it and not use it?
David Armstrong
Moderator
I'm not sure we do. I would not add the risk unless necessary. There is absolutely no gain, and lots of potential cost.
In order: Not ordinarily. /Depends on what is going on, but usually it is an older Ford ranger pickup; Long trips or more formal events usually get the new Crown Victoria; Fun and game weekend runs through the countryside belong to the Jag convertible. /I dress conservatively, usually chinos or jeans and a polo shirt. /No, I stay out when necessary, but not for fun.
True, but it can increase them minimally when done correctly. Good part of town, better class bar and patrons, etc.
OK, tournament fishing REQUIRES the early up and at them process. It is necessary. The chain is not necessary. In fact, it could be argued that the chain increases your chances of not being able to fish. That is my position. I'm not saying never do anything, never enjoy things. I'm suggesting, as are all these other folks, that attracting bad guys when you don't need to is not a good policy.
I wear it when appropriate and reasonable safe to do so. It is no different than having money in the bank. I take some out when I need it. I don't take it all out and then walk around with it all the time.
David, We agree in that Jewelry in general attracts the bad guy.
If you go back and read my posts I rarely go into bad areas. When I do find myself in this situation I leave asap. So my chain is worn in safe areas almost exclusively and hidden on most of those rare occassions that put me in a bad area.
Appropriate by your standards may be different than mine or others. Reasonably safe to me means the good side of town. What does it mean to you?
You guys get stuck on the idea of wearing an expensive piece of jewelry fishing as not being appropriate. Says who the "when to wear jewelry" police? How is what I do any different than when you decide to wear yours. We both wear our gold in reasonably safe environments. I just stay in reasonably safe areas. The fishing trip with my son was a mistake which I corrected pretty quickly.
If you go back and read my posts I rarely go into bad areas. When I do find myself in this situation I leave asap. So my chain is worn in safe areas almost exclusively and hidden on most of those rare occassions that put me in a bad area.
Appropriate by your standards may be different than mine or others. Reasonably safe to me means the good side of town. What does it mean to you?
You guys get stuck on the idea of wearing an expensive piece of jewelry fishing as not being appropriate. Says who the "when to wear jewelry" police? How is what I do any different than when you decide to wear yours. We both wear our gold in reasonably safe environments. I just stay in reasonably safe areas. The fishing trip with my son was a mistake which I corrected pretty quickly.
David Armstrong
Moderator
You seem to be missing the point that I and others are trying to make. By your own admission you realize the chain attracts bad guys. Therefore why wear it around bad guys, period? That is the point---it is not particularly smart to do things that you know will make your life more dangerous without any reason. By your own admission this place was so bad you put your son on lookout detail to watch for bad guys, but then you hung around for another 30 minutes. You left expensive chains visible on both you and your son instead of putting them out of sight. This does not strike me as a particularly good response. If you think hanging around in an area that you have identified as problematic, wearing bad guy attractant, with an 11 year old child in tow is a good thing, go for it, but I'm going to call it as not such a good idea.
But "appropriate and reasonably safe" which was the whole concept, not just a piece of it, should not differ that much from person to person.
I can't speak for everyone, but I think what us guys are stuck on is the idea that you would do something to attract the bad guys when it is not necessary. Personally I don't find a $3000 piece of jewelry to be all that expensive, but I still fail to see how wearing it fishing does anything other than give an additional thing to worry about.
I'm not aware of any such police, and even if so nobody is saying when and when not to wear jewelry. We are pointing out that doing stupid things increases the likelihood of a bad result, whether it be wearing jewelry, parking cars, flashing money, or anything else.
Perhaps the biggest difference is that I actually decide when to do it, while you say you do it all the time no matter what. You might want to read up on a little thing called "the stealth existence" by noted instructor John Farnam.
threegun, great work.
P.S. reply to this thread on a different matter here:
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=257301
Didn't want to hijack
P.S. reply to this thread on a different matter here:
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=257301
Didn't want to hijack
David,
By your own admission you own and occassionally wear expensive jewelry, watch, etc. You also understand that it attracts bad guys so why even own it? When you wear it bad guys will be attracted to you right?
To answer your question again I don't go to areas that hold high concentrations of bad guys. The fishing trip was a fluke.
You are right I should have left sooner. I have told my son on many occasions to tell me if anyone was approaching us (even nice areas)as I try to stay in condition yellow. With the responsibility of watching rods and baiting hooks I need the help. I hung around because folks were minding their business and paying us no mind until that first guy. My son was having fun fishing. I allowed it to over ride my better judgement for awhile.
When is wearing jewelry and Rolex watches necessary David? The fact is it isn't ever necessary yet on occasion even you do it.....why? Why would you do something to attract bad guys? Then why would you scold another when you yourself occassionally attract bad guys with jewelry?
You decide when to wear the Rolex and I simply make it a point not to go into the ghetto. Lets not forget that if I notice unsavory people even in the good side of town I put the chain in my shirt (if it is out). Deciding when to wear your Rolex doesn't make it invisible to the bad guy.....(no stealth rolex's yet). When you do decide to wear it just remember that you think it is stupid to do so.
BTW I do appreciate you looking out for my / our well being. Thanks.
By your own admission you own and occassionally wear expensive jewelry, watch, etc. You also understand that it attracts bad guys so why even own it? When you wear it bad guys will be attracted to you right?
To answer your question again I don't go to areas that hold high concentrations of bad guys. The fishing trip was a fluke.
You are right I should have left sooner. I have told my son on many occasions to tell me if anyone was approaching us (even nice areas)as I try to stay in condition yellow. With the responsibility of watching rods and baiting hooks I need the help. I hung around because folks were minding their business and paying us no mind until that first guy. My son was having fun fishing. I allowed it to over ride my better judgement for awhile.
When is wearing jewelry and Rolex watches necessary David? The fact is it isn't ever necessary yet on occasion even you do it.....why? Why would you do something to attract bad guys? Then why would you scold another when you yourself occassionally attract bad guys with jewelry?
You decide when to wear the Rolex and I simply make it a point not to go into the ghetto. Lets not forget that if I notice unsavory people even in the good side of town I put the chain in my shirt (if it is out). Deciding when to wear your Rolex doesn't make it invisible to the bad guy.....(no stealth rolex's yet). When you do decide to wear it just remember that you think it is stupid to do so.
BTW I do appreciate you looking out for my / our well being. Thanks.