Suffolk County NY handgun License holders

V

ViperJon

New member
Anyone have their license renewed lately?
Interesting development.
I just went through the renewal rigamorole and noticed something that has relevance to us "sportsman" license holders. ("Sportsman" handguns licenses mean full carry to and from a range only, the only license you can get without having a life threatening grave need for a full carry etc).

New handbook is given out when you renew, and they make you sign a document that you received it. But what is most interesting is the wording DELETION found in the new handbook versus the 2002 handbook.

In 2002, in regard to a restricted "sportsman" license:
(Note) For the purpose of target shooting and hunting, the Police commissioner has authorized licensees to meet for the purpose of car pooling and to stop for non-alcoholic refreshments on the way to and from their
shooting destination. You are authorized to do this only during the period upon leaving your residence and arriving at your shooting destination or during the return trip. This would appear to somewhat loosen the restrictive nature of the license to a slight extent.

In the new circa 2006 handbook. this additional phrase has been deleted out completely.

Thoughts?
 
This is based only on what you wrote but no, it looks to tighten it. The non-criminal restrictions put in place by the SCPD allowed you to carry to and from the range.

If they remove the following:

For the purpose of target shooting and hunting, the Police commissioner has authorized licensees to meet for the purpose of car pooling and to stop for non-alcoholic refreshments on the way to and from their
shooting destination. You are authorized to do this only during the period upon leaving your residence and arriving at your shooting destination or during the return trip.
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They have an open door to revoke a permit for stopping to eat on the way to or from the range. They have removed the ability to meet up and grab lunch with your shooting buddies. This would be a step backwards.
 
Agreed.

When I received the new handbook, it was the first thing I went to look for.
Pretty tough to enforce that one however, I can not imagine them pulling someones license for stopping on the way home for a cup of coffee, after having it allowable for many years.

BUT, they are smart. You have to sign a document on renewal that you received the NEW handbook, and therefore you agree to abide by it. So they have you there.

So what if you don't have to renew for the next few years? A new updated handbook is not sent to you, you only get it on renewal. So you only have the previous to go by. What a joke.
 
I want to know this, why the persecution of Suffolk County pistol permit holders? I know of one shooting with a permit holder in recent years, the moron at the Mason's initiation who shot someone in the head with an "Unloaded" gun.

Have permit holders been shooting up TGI Fridays? Have they been brandishing? No they haven't because if they were you KNOW News12 and Newsday would plaster it everywhere. So why go through the trouble of revising a manual?
 
I want to know this, why the persecution of Suffolk County pistol permit holders?
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Simply stated, because they can. They have for years and they probably will for a long time.
 
Yes they can but they are also some of the laziest people in the SCPD. They have a job sitting on their butts at HQ working banker's hours in plain clothes. The overwhelming majority of people they deal with are the most law abiding ones in the county! The only exceptions would be the handful of DUI convicted permit holders they take guns away from and the few who apply and are turned down (and usually know they would be). It takes months just to get them to move a piece of paper across the office so who there had the energy to actually revise the manual?
 
I have emailed several people in the know (higher ups with NYSRPA and others) about the issue of the restrictions the SCPD places on our licenses. I asked if there was any movement to get them removed, or if any organization is involved in pursuing this. I would like to get involved in that. The answer I got is that basically nothing can be done. Here is the exact reply:

"The short answer is yes we are trying to get the state law changed to disallow all handgun licensing agents throughout the state to stop imposing restrictions on handgun licenses. Unfortunately the NYS Court of Appeals has ruled that individual issuing agents may impose restrictions on licenses as an extension to their already existing authority"

So they have dinners, NRA meetings etc but the fact is that unless the Suffolk County legislature forces them to remove the restrictions, they are there forever. And that is just not going to happen in the forseeable (democratic/liberal) future.

So in fact, with the removal of the text in the handbook as detailed above, we are moving backwards.
 
but the fact is that unless the Suffolk County legislature forces them to remove the restrictions, they are there forever. And that is just not going to happen in the forseeable (democratic/liberal) future.
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They did and the SCPD ignored it.

http://www.editechconsulting.com/Traveller.html
Prior to 1996 Suffolk County exceeded New York State handgun permit standards by imposing restrictions or conditions on licenses to the detriment of firearms licensees, making Suffolk County gun laws among the most restrictive in the Nation. In 1996 legislators George O. Guldi, Martin W. Haley, Joseph Caracappa and Joseph Rizzo introduced a bill that was passed, which modified the law so that licensing would ostensibly be uniform throughout the state of New York. The new law, Resolution 678 section 17-2 B reads "...the department will not impose any restrictions, limitations, or requirements on licenses or licensees other than those restrictions, limitations or requirements set forth in section 400.00 of the NEW YORK PENAL LAW. However, the then Suffolk County Police Commissioner, Robert Creighton, declined to amend the restrictions/ It must be noted however that section 400 the New York State Penal Code also states that "The licensing officer may, in his discretion, add restrictions to the license, limiting the places where the handgun may be kept or carried." Commissioner Creighton subsequently resigned.
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The problem is the SCPD is NOT accountable to anyone. I can complain to the SCPD and if I don't like it I can complain to my legislator, who the SCPD ignores.
 
It must be noted however that section 400 the New York State Penal Code also states that "The licensing officer may, in his discretion, add restrictions to the license, limiting the places where the handgun may be kept or carried."
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And therein lies the problem. This has been legally challenged as stated above. Court ruled in licensing departments favor. End game.
 
What makes that particularly nauseating is that the restrictions are applied in the vast majority of the state by... judges. Long Island is different in this. So we basically had some justices who decided that they have the power to restrict however they please, and with no standard, across the state. Even in the same county one judge may assign restrictions another may not. In Suffolk you need to leap through impossible hoops in the Western towns to get a full SCPD approved carry permit actually documenting the multiple attempts made on your life. In the eastern towns it comes down to who you know as the SCPD doesn't control permits there.

There is no uniform treatment under the law. Move from one county to another and you are subject to completely different rules, even inside the same county.

When a case went to a bunch of judges did anyone ever expect them to say they didn't have the power to do as they pleased?
 
So, you NY ers What are you gonna do except Whine..????

Move or Vote out the Anti Gun'rs.....
Me, I moved, Best thing I ever did....

I know some upstate NY Gun owners , hunters,.
They still vote DEM....
They say that the State will never take THERE guns, and keep right on voting
DEM.. Hey, it's there state, not my problem anymore....
 
So, you NY ers What are you gonna do except Whine..????
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This is a forum, a place where people discuss things. I see it as an intellectually stimulating conversation concerning a pre-existing problem. Perhaps some change will result from these conversations, maybe not. However, it is still a conversation.

Not whining.

I know some upstate NY Gun owners , hunters,.
They still vote DEM....
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BTW, yes I am from NY, and no, I am not a Dem, nor have I ever voted for one.
 
my whole household.. 6 registered voters altogether, we all vote republican. doesnt do a damn bit of good with the city and most of the island voting dem
 
Even more disturbing is the apathy and acceptance by all of the pistol license holders of our current situation. It's like they are just happy that the police "allow" them to own a gun.

According to Suffolk Country records:
Total Active Pistol Licenses 29,289
That's a lot of people, the vast majority of which are restricted. No one seems to care.
 
According to Suffolk Country records:
Total Active Pistol Licenses 29,289
That's a lot of people, the vast majority of which are restricted. No one seems to care.
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Actually most of them don't even know any better. You have the SCPD handbook telling you you can almost never take a handgun with you on vacation when in reality you can get a CCW for the vast majority of states you might visit. Most people with permits here don't even realize the restrictions are an administration function and not criminal. They don't realize that permits for CCW are readily available in the rest of the nation.
 
What can we really do. I vote Republican. The SCPD makes the rules for us regarding carry. You see how we're treated by some of the officers in the PLB in Yaphank. They sneak little things like we can't stop for refreshments into the rulebook.

They give me crap everytime I sell a gun to someone out of state and I don't use an FFL who is going to rip me off to ship it. They just say you didn't do anything wrong, but they still give me crap. It's all a power trip to them. I don't even see half of them carrying there.

Most of the SCPD that I know personally don't mind us having carry permits. It just the people at the top. Until someone can get through to the SCPD Commissioner we're stuck with what they give us.
 
I agree with you Prolanman but it is obvious that here in Suffolk nobody gives a **** or there would have been some sort of backlash about the handbook revision. As Musk said, I'll bet 99% of the license holders have never read the handbook, and certainly never picked up on the recent editing. When I recently renewed and was handed a new handbook (and have to sign for it), I knew there had to be a reason. It's like they will do anything to get you to trip up and be denied or revoked.
 
Here is my real beef with Long Island, outside of the way it is handled in Eastern Suffolk.

Across the state (NYC not included) the issuing authority is either the Sheriff or a judge. In every case it is an ELECTED OFFICIAL. They may be wielding power over the citizens in an imbalanced manner with arbitrary decisions based on person opinion but they are in the end at least directly accountable to the electorate.

Now I give you the SCPD

http://www.co.suffolk.ny.us/police/orgCommissioner.htm
Office of the Police Commissioner

The Police Commissioner has jurisdiction and control over government, administration, disposition and discipline of the Police Department and its members. The Police Commissioner ensures that the services provided to the community by the Department meet the highest standards of excellence.

Police Commissioner – Commissioner Richard Dormer holds a Master of Business Administration degree from the New York Institute of Technology, and has attended the FBI National Academy and the Kennedy School of Government. His first assignment as a Suffolk County Police Officer in 1963 was in the Fourth Precinct in Smithtown. He moved up the ranks, commanding a wide spectrum of commands in the three divisions. He retired in 1993 at the rank of Chief. He managed a private security company and taught police related subjects at a local college until January, 2004 when he was nominated by the County Executive and confirmed by the Legislature as the eleventh Police Commissioner of the Suffolk County Police Department
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http://www.co.suffolk.ny.us/police/orgDepCommissioner.htm

The Office of the Deputy Police Commissioner

The Deputy Commissioner acts for and assists the Commissioner. In this capacity, the Deputy Police Commissioner acts as liaison officer for the Police Commissioner in matters relating to the public and criminal justice system, and meets with individuals, groups, associations, organizations and commissions on behalf of the Police Commissioner. The Deputy Police Commissioner has oversight responsibility of the Medical Evaluation Bureau, Internal Affairs Bureau, and the Pistol Licensing Bureau.

Deputy Police Commissioner – Deputy Commissioner Roger Shannon holds a Bachelor of Science degree from the New York Institute of Technology and joined the Suffolk County Police Department in 1964. During his career he moved up the ranks and has been the Commanding Officer of the Pistol Licensing Bureau, Community Services Bureau, and the Internal Affairs Section. He retired in 1993 at the rank of Assistant Chief. In January, 2004, he was appointed to the position of Deputy Police Commissioner of the Suffolk County Police Department.
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The further you remove the accountability of gov't from the people the more the people become treated like serf and servants. I don't care that the legislature confirmed this hack. That is their way of passing the buck. The system was set up so that the person issuing permits was accountable directly to the electorate, that is not the case in Suffolk County. Even when the legislature of Suffolk County told the SCPD how to issue permits through legislation the SCPD said piss off and did as they pleased.
 
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