Stopping Power
- Thread starter Tabdog
- Start date
Look again.
It's a Season 2 image and he's firing the Bren Ten. If it was a S&W, where's the slide-mounted safety? 
IIRC, this pic was taken from the "Sonny-goes-to-see-his-therapist" scene (i.e., a work-out on the Dade County Police Range) in the episode called "One Way Ticket."
True, in Season 3 he did switch to the .45acp S&W 645 (the BT being defunct at that point). He used the 645 until about the last season, at which point the new 3rd Generation 4506s were being released, so he switched to that pistol.
If it had been up to me, Det. Crocket would have carried a 10mm S&W 1006 (w/ fixed night sights and a hard-chromed slide) through the entire run of the show.
But then, the 1006s weren't released until after the show was heading to reruns (circa 1989-90), ... and I'm not Michael Mann.
cubesmoothie
New member
fact is most have never seen someone get shot. The whole argument for "You need a 357, .40, 10mm, or a .45 to stop someone" is stupid. Especially with handguns. In WW2, people were getting shot 5-10 times with big deer rifles and still shooting back. The trick to stopping someone with a handgun is for the bullets to hit certain portions of their insides that physicly will force their body and mind to stop working, in other words you'll have to kill them. There's a fear factor, and people do surrender in the face of a gun barrel, but that isnt real stopping power in a phyisical sense.
You're not better armed with a .45 or a .22. That's not how it works. You can hit someone in the chest once with a .22, once with a .45, and depending which bullet goes where, the .22 can be a more solid strike to stop the threat. It could be a difference of one inch in the placement of both shots.
You're not better armed with a .45 or a .22. That's not how it works. You can hit someone in the chest once with a .22, once with a .45, and depending which bullet goes where, the .22 can be a more solid strike to stop the threat. It could be a difference of one inch in the placement of both shots.
45ACPShooter
New member
^^I think I understand what your point is but at the same time a .45 caliber 230 gr round striking someone's torso is going to tear a larger hole than a .22 caliber 40 gr round. A larger round is going to have a slightly higher chance of striking something important and if nothing else it will cause a bigger hole which will bleed out faster. A .22 caliber round to the heart will kill someone the same as a .45 to the heart but the .45 gives you more margin for accuracy. Also a heavier round is going to be less likely deflected by bones.
I think its good to be prepared and always have a gun. All handgun calibers are underpowered and I think its best to carry a gun that can be shot well. I carry a ruger LCP and have learned to shoot it well. Stopping power is a whole different issue for civilians. We should try to avoid trouble just like the rest of the unarmed civilians. It is simply not our place but trouble finds us so it is better to have a concealed weapon that can always be with you. Police are a different story, they put themselfs in troubles way so I would carry a larger caliber. I seem to stick with the 9mm because I like to shoot and the ammo is cheaper but with a high quality hollowpoint is more than sufficient.
Its crazy though how the smaller cartriges were always smaller in europe. I think the italian army used a .380 at one time.
Its crazy though how the smaller cartriges were always smaller in europe. I think the italian army used a .380 at one time.
45ACPShooter
New member
I don't understand where this belief is coming from. No handguns aren't as powerful as a rifle or a shotgun but long arms aren't as powerful as a .50 caliber machine gun. Does that make those long arms underpowered as well? Of course not, each type of firearm serves a purpose. Plenty of people have been stopped quickly and efficiently with a handgun and in the end shot placement trumps all. Then there's been plenty of people in wars who have been shot by rifles and survived or continued fighting before finally succumbing to their injuries. That doesn't mean that rifles are underpowered it just shows how important shot placement is and the reality of how people operate sometimes.
The effectiveness and lethality of handguns shouldn't be underestimated. Honestly I think it's kind of foolish to be carrying around a firearm if you don't have any faith in it stopping a threat. You shouldn't overestimate its effectiveness and be cocky but at the same time you should feel confident that you'll be able to save your life if it comes down to it. If you have such little faith in your weapon why bother carrying it around and for that matter are you sure you're going to actually use it when the time comes that you need it if you don't even expect it to work properly? Know the limitations of your weapon and plan for the worse but be confident that you'll be any to defend yourself with it if it comes down to it.
The whole argument for "You need a 357, .40, 10mm, or a .45 to stop someone" is stupid. Especially with handguns. In WW2, people were getting shot 5-10 times with big deer rifles and still shooting back
5-10 times?? I dont think so. Yes shot 5 times in the arm or leg but not hits to the COM/ Chest. So many people just dont have a clue what 5 shots to the chest would do with a WW2 Battle rifle. Its lights out!
5-10 times?? I dont think so. Yes shot 5 times in the arm or leg but not hits to the COM/ Chest. So many people just dont have a clue what 5 shots to the chest would do with a WW2 Battle rifle. Its lights out!
Webley, buddy, you really need to do some research. Your memory's not correct.
The S&W 1076 didn't come into existence until after Miami Vice was heading into reruns.
The Standard Model Bren Ten was a 5" two-tone, blue slide/stainless frame pistol, but Micheal Mann had the slides of the two BTs used for the series hard-chromed so the gun would show up better during low-light or night shooting.
You can Google for this stuff and read up on it yourself.
Trust me: the pic shows a Bren Ten. The S&W 3rd Gen pistols, like the 4506, didn't come on line until the last season of the show, and the Smith 10XX-series models after that. Crocket's 2nd Gen S&W 645, which he used after the BT, had a slide-mounted safety/decock lever.
Nakanokalronin
New member
Don't get involved with and just walk away from a "stopping power" discussion. Discussions about shot placement and practice are ok though.
Over the years I've carried everything from a .22 to a .44 mag for SD. I would read articles, listen to stories, read these forums, and worry if I had the right gun, the right caliber, the right ammo, enough reloads, practiced enought etc.... Then one day I read where violence accounts for about 1% of deaths in the USA each year while worry related deaths was about 30x that number. So, I quit worrying and stuck my old .38 airweight loaded with Federal Nyclads in my pocket and haven't thought about it since. Works for me.
Nakanokalronin
New member
However violence is not just about death. Home invasion, rape, just beaten to a pulp, disfigurement, robbery, death threats, Etc....
All this could be done by 1 criminal or a gang of criminals.
All this could be done by 1 criminal or a gang of criminals.