Willie Lowman
New member
This isn't a tickling contest.
If it won't do much to dry wall what makes you think it will do much to a person intent on causing harm to you and yours.
Bird shot for birds, buckshot for bad guys.
Someone pryed open my back door I grabbed my 20 gauge
- Thread starter AirborneMosinFan
- Start date
This isn't a tickling contest.
If it won't do much to dry wall what makes you think it will do much to a person intent on causing harm to you and yours.
Bird shot for birds, buckshot for bad guys.
Yeah, I confess I grab a pistol when I hear a BITN (bump in the night).
I actually just bought this single-shot 20 ga. (.22 Mag/20 ga. O/U actually) and am looking forward to trying the assorted 2-3/4" and 3" bucksot loads I've seen. I expect 1,200 fps 3" #2 Buckshot and 2-3/4" #6 birdshot will be the ultimate items on the menu for this gun's dinner. I would still not feel undergunned with 2-3/4" #4 Buckshot in this.
I actually just bought this single-shot 20 ga. (.22 Mag/20 ga. O/U actually) and am looking forward to trying the assorted 2-3/4" and 3" bucksot loads I've seen. I expect 1,200 fps 3" #2 Buckshot and 2-3/4" #6 birdshot will be the ultimate items on the menu for this gun's dinner. I would still not feel undergunned with 2-3/4" #4 Buckshot in this.
Attachments
AirborneMosinFan
New member
22 mag
Is that a duel barrel?
Is that a duel barrel?
Peter M. Eick
New member
I have a 12 gauge 870 with buckshot then slug and back to buckshot etc. It is around for just those "bumps in the night".
I figure the sound of racking it closed out to take a lot of fight out of an intruder but if not then well "the castle law" kicks in big time.
I figure the sound of racking it closed out to take a lot of fight out of an intruder but if not then well "the castle law" kicks in big time.
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Rampant_Colt
New member
this week's buckshot -vs- birdshot thread
A 20-gauge stoked with #3 buckshot is a most excellent choice for home-defense. With birdshot no..
A 20-gauge stoked with #3 buckshot is a most excellent choice for home-defense. With birdshot no..
How hard does that 2 gauge kick?! Let us know how the racking sound of the shotgun, and keeping track of what shell is next in the chamber when you're in fear for your life and the adrenaline is pumping works out for you in your next life-and-death scenario..
If he is a combat vet or a druggie high on something that sound could trigger an adverse reaction and you won't hear a gun being racked, just a gun going off and a muzzle blast pointed in your direction. Forget fancy loads and gun handling, pick one and figure the only sound a burglar should hear is your safety going off just before you shoot him. The first thing he should see is a bright light in his face so you can make sure it isn't Junior sneaking home or the next door neighbor drunk and in the wrong house.
I have had both things happen.
Light him up
Identify
Take action
Wait for cops
Keep mouth shut till you talk to lawyer
Peter M. Eick
New member
Got me on the "2" gauge. Edited to be the correct 12.
To answer your question, since for 2 decades my 12 gauge 18" slug gun that I got when we went to ANWR, was my only shotgun and since I used it for years to do skeet, sporting clays, bird shooting, pest control and deer hunting. I have gotten reasonably used to the recoil, the operation and instinctive nature of using it.
The two times, I have gone for it in the middle of a night when I was sound asleep I was shocked at how instinctive it was. I remember waking up, thinking go for the gun and the next thing I had it and was racking it closed. By the time I had the round chambered I was wide awake and the wife was on the phone to 911. We went into defensive mode and in both cases things worked out just fine.
Thanks for the advice. I feel confident and comfortable with my handling of the gun and how I have it loaded and to me that is what really matters.
To answer your question, since for 2 decades my 12 gauge 18" slug gun that I got when we went to ANWR, was my only shotgun and since I used it for years to do skeet, sporting clays, bird shooting, pest control and deer hunting. I have gotten reasonably used to the recoil, the operation and instinctive nature of using it.
The two times, I have gone for it in the middle of a night when I was sound asleep I was shocked at how instinctive it was. I remember waking up, thinking go for the gun and the next thing I had it and was racking it closed. By the time I had the round chambered I was wide awake and the wife was on the phone to 911. We went into defensive mode and in both cases things worked out just fine.
Thanks for the advice. I feel confident and comfortable with my handling of the gun and how I have it loaded and to me that is what really matters.
But seriously folks...
Generally they recomend #1 Buck.
Firearms Yactical Institute:
http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs10.htm
20 Gauge Shotshell Ammunition Recommendations
We're unaware of any ammunition company who offers a 20 gauge shotshell that is loaded with #1 buckshot. The largest shot size commercially available that we know of is number 2 buck.
From a strict wound ballistics standpoint, we feel the Federal Classic 3-inch 20 gauge Magnum number 2 buckshot cartridge is the best choice. It contains 18 pellets of number 2 buckshot in a plastic shotcup with granulated plastic shot buffer.
However, the Federal Classic load might produce too much recoil for some people. Given this consideration, Remington's Premier Buckshot 2 ¾-inch 20 gauge number 3 buckshot cartridge is the next best choice. This load contains 20 pieces of nickel-plated, hardened lead shot that is buffered to reduce pellet deformation from post ignition acceleration and terminal impact. The Remington buckshot load will probably produce the tightest shot patterns in 20 gauge shotguns.
Third place is Winchester's 3-inch 20 gauge Magnum number 3 buckshot cartridge, which contains 24 pieces of buffered, copper-plated, hardened lead shot.
"Number 1 buck is the smallest diameter shot that reliably and consistently penetrates more than 12 inches of standard ordnance gelatin when fired at typical shotgun engagement distances. A standard 2 ¾-inch 12 gauge shotshell contains 16 pellets of #1 buck. The total combined cross sectional area of the 16 pellets is 1.13 square inches. Compared to the total combined cross sectional area of the nine pellets in a standard #00 (double-aught) buck shotshell (0.77 square inches), the # 1 buck shotshell has the capacity to produce over 30 percent more potentially effective wound trauma. In all shotshell loads, number 1 buckshot produces more potentially effective wound trauma than either #00 or #000 buck. In addition, number 1 buck is less likely to over-penetrate and exit an attacker's body."
Generally they recomend #1 Buck.
Firearms Yactical Institute:
http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs10.htm
20 Gauge Shotshell Ammunition Recommendations
We're unaware of any ammunition company who offers a 20 gauge shotshell that is loaded with #1 buckshot. The largest shot size commercially available that we know of is number 2 buck.
From a strict wound ballistics standpoint, we feel the Federal Classic 3-inch 20 gauge Magnum number 2 buckshot cartridge is the best choice. It contains 18 pellets of number 2 buckshot in a plastic shotcup with granulated plastic shot buffer.
However, the Federal Classic load might produce too much recoil for some people. Given this consideration, Remington's Premier Buckshot 2 ¾-inch 20 gauge number 3 buckshot cartridge is the next best choice. This load contains 20 pieces of nickel-plated, hardened lead shot that is buffered to reduce pellet deformation from post ignition acceleration and terminal impact. The Remington buckshot load will probably produce the tightest shot patterns in 20 gauge shotguns.
Third place is Winchester's 3-inch 20 gauge Magnum number 3 buckshot cartridge, which contains 24 pieces of buffered, copper-plated, hardened lead shot.
"Number 1 buck is the smallest diameter shot that reliably and consistently penetrates more than 12 inches of standard ordnance gelatin when fired at typical shotgun engagement distances. A standard 2 ¾-inch 12 gauge shotshell contains 16 pellets of #1 buck. The total combined cross sectional area of the 16 pellets is 1.13 square inches. Compared to the total combined cross sectional area of the nine pellets in a standard #00 (double-aught) buck shotshell (0.77 square inches), the # 1 buck shotshell has the capacity to produce over 30 percent more potentially effective wound trauma. In all shotshell loads, number 1 buckshot produces more potentially effective wound trauma than either #00 or #000 buck. In addition, number 1 buck is less likely to over-penetrate and exit an attacker's body."
AirborneMosinFan
New member
Put side saddles on
Bird Shot & Human target
Well If I read this correct you were wondering if game and target shot is good against a human. Sheriff deputy told me that gangs are killing each other with bird shot at close range and its a mess. As for the cat or dog by by. It also depends on your distance from the target 10 feet dead guy anyone behind 2 pieces of 1/2 inch sheet rock safe, now I did not say unhurt, but survivability is excellent. 00 Buckshot or any heavy shot sheet rock maybe not a good shield. Personally I use #4 shot for Home defense doesn't go through exterior walls easy and close range no pattern just a big hole.
Mace
Well If I read this correct you were wondering if game and target shot is good against a human. Sheriff deputy told me that gangs are killing each other with bird shot at close range and its a mess. As for the cat or dog by by. It also depends on your distance from the target 10 feet dead guy anyone behind 2 pieces of 1/2 inch sheet rock safe, now I did not say unhurt, but survivability is excellent. 00 Buckshot or any heavy shot sheet rock maybe not a good shield. Personally I use #4 shot for Home defense doesn't go through exterior walls easy and close range no pattern just a big hole.
Mace
AirborneMosinFan
New member
Bought a new rail mount for my maverick 88
I mounted a flashlight and it works and looks great. Check out cheaper then dirt for cheap universal mounts
I mounted a flashlight and it works and looks great. Check out cheaper then dirt for cheap universal mounts
Dennis1209
New member
Contrary to popular belief, there is a Rx for those that sleep walk into someone's home. Lead poisoning has been found to cure burglary, home invasion, criminal trespass and drug dependency. Just a small dose of DOUBLE AUT has been found to relieve the criminal symptom. Side affects may include; ringing of the ears, unforgettable racking sound, bright flash, a burning sensation of the thorax, an expulsion of gray matter and a loss of bladder control. Beware of imposter's making the same claim (Bird shot, #4, #2, etc.). Don't walk, RUN, to the nearest store and pick up your new box of 00 Buck Shot!!!
Disclaimer: Bird shot is for birds. A .45 or any handgun is for CCW outside the home. A 12 ga. shotgun with 00 Buck shot is the ONLY reliable home defense sausage grinder intended to STOP the threat, NOW.
Disclaimer: Bird shot is for birds. A .45 or any handgun is for CCW outside the home. A 12 ga. shotgun with 00 Buck shot is the ONLY reliable home defense sausage grinder intended to STOP the threat, NOW.
Wow, this argument is a everlasting and as much fun as .45 vs 9mm or 1911 vs Glock.
The only time I am going to use deadly force is if I feel that I have no choice. Been there, they ran back out the door, and nobody got shot. This is an optimal outcome.
If I have to shoot, it will be to stop an attacker asap and I will not use marginal equipment. No pistol comes anywhere near a shotgun or rifle for stopping deadly problems. Pistols are for when you have to carry concealed. I carry pistols everyday but I don't have any Hollywood illusions about them.
Rather than relying on what Granpappy told you or the guy in the gun store told you or what a cop told you, check out the actual facts. Google is your friend, there is plenty of video and pictures available showing how effective bird shot is and the answer is that it is marginal.
Most of the time bad guys will run at the sight of a gun, so anything will work. In most of the remaining shots fired with get them running whether you hit them or not, anything, including bird shot will work here also. If you need to stop a determined attacker bird shot may or it may not work, I don't want to find that out.
Unless you live in a very rural area, slugs are not worth the risk. Every bullet has a lawyer attached and slugs going through the neighborhood is way too exciting for me. At home defense distances buckshot is a far better stopper.
If you are worried about your walls use airsoft, bird shot will tear up drywall, again google it for demonstrations.
The only effective round that has low penetration is 5.56, preferably with varment loads, but they won't work in my shotgun.
The only time I am going to use deadly force is if I feel that I have no choice. Been there, they ran back out the door, and nobody got shot. This is an optimal outcome.
If I have to shoot, it will be to stop an attacker asap and I will not use marginal equipment. No pistol comes anywhere near a shotgun or rifle for stopping deadly problems. Pistols are for when you have to carry concealed. I carry pistols everyday but I don't have any Hollywood illusions about them.
Rather than relying on what Granpappy told you or the guy in the gun store told you or what a cop told you, check out the actual facts. Google is your friend, there is plenty of video and pictures available showing how effective bird shot is and the answer is that it is marginal.
Most of the time bad guys will run at the sight of a gun, so anything will work. In most of the remaining shots fired with get them running whether you hit them or not, anything, including bird shot will work here also. If you need to stop a determined attacker bird shot may or it may not work, I don't want to find that out.
Unless you live in a very rural area, slugs are not worth the risk. Every bullet has a lawyer attached and slugs going through the neighborhood is way too exciting for me. At home defense distances buckshot is a far better stopper.
If you are worried about your walls use airsoft, bird shot will tear up drywall, again google it for demonstrations.
The only effective round that has low penetration is 5.56, preferably with varment loads, but they won't work in my shotgun.
grousebuster
Inactive
20 ga.?
My plan will not be palatable to some but here it is.First I'm a Marine,Viet Vet-no not an ex Marine as I'm still breathing.First line of defense in the house is Rocko-90 pound German Shepherd who does not care for people who are not family.He has better ears and nose than I do.Second a 20 gauge-I know-I have a multitude of firearms to chose from but-it's a short-legal-side by side with 6 rounds of 3in #4 buck in an elastic carrier on the stock.I have shot #4 buck out of this gun at an old automobile and the shot penetrates completely through the door panels.Plenty of penetrations for in house use in my opinion.2 rapid shots which unless the local chapter of the Hells Angels kicks in the door should get things started or ended nicely.And yes I have practiced reloading and can do it quite fast-not nearly as fast as follow up shots from a 1911 or my model 19 but I don't have to worry about rounds leaving the house.Anyone learn about a vertical butt stroke in infantry training?Try that with a hangun-kind of last resort though.lol The original poster I suspect is fairly inexperienced but a 20 is not a completly bad choice IMHO if-it's all you have or is one that offers multiple shots and if as others have suggested a better overall plan is developed.The NRA Guide to the Basics of Personal Protection In The Home is a must read to cover most possibilities.
My plan will not be palatable to some but here it is.First I'm a Marine,Viet Vet-no not an ex Marine as I'm still breathing.First line of defense in the house is Rocko-90 pound German Shepherd who does not care for people who are not family.He has better ears and nose than I do.Second a 20 gauge-I know-I have a multitude of firearms to chose from but-it's a short-legal-side by side with 6 rounds of 3in #4 buck in an elastic carrier on the stock.I have shot #4 buck out of this gun at an old automobile and the shot penetrates completely through the door panels.Plenty of penetrations for in house use in my opinion.2 rapid shots which unless the local chapter of the Hells Angels kicks in the door should get things started or ended nicely.And yes I have practiced reloading and can do it quite fast-not nearly as fast as follow up shots from a 1911 or my model 19 but I don't have to worry about rounds leaving the house.Anyone learn about a vertical butt stroke in infantry training?Try that with a hangun-kind of last resort though.lol The original poster I suspect is fairly inexperienced but a 20 is not a completly bad choice IMHO if-it's all you have or is one that offers multiple shots and if as others have suggested a better overall plan is developed.The NRA Guide to the Basics of Personal Protection In The Home is a must read to cover most possibilities.