Should I dump the .40S&W?

H

HistoryJunky

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Today I went to the range for the second time with my .40S&W M&P and Shield, as well as my AK and my dad's .22 Revolver. I made about 150 reloads of 5.8gr of Silouhette under a 180gr HCFP bullet to run through both guns.

That is pretty close to the maximum recommended load for that powder/bullet combination according to my reloading manual. My reasoning for that is so I will be training with a level of recoil that is similar to a self-defense load.

Previously I was shooting factory loads that were not as strong. After shooting about 50 rounds through my full size M&P my hands could feel the vibrations and my knuckles were tight.

When I put a single magazine through my Shield .40, I didn't want to shoot it anymore. I may have shot a total of 3 magazines through it and put it away for the rest of the range trip.

I used to have a full size 9mm that did not give me such issues. I'm questioning whether I should dump the .40 or just hang in there. Has anyone had any similar issues?
 
Have you tried commercial self-defense loads? Not all of them are harsh, some are seemingly quite mild. It sounds like you are punishing yourself unnecessarily with those hot reloads.

That said, a Shield in .40 would be a bit much for me. Mine is a 9mm. The regular M & P, why not keep it, and dial it back on the self-punishment....
 
It depends

Is this just a fun range gun or a serious self defense gun? A 40 can be tamed without too much trouble. Substitute 155 grain bullets under 180 grain recipes. When you do this, you'll get around the same speed as the 180 or a tad faster with a much lighter bullet. Recoil goes way down. 155 lswc loads adjusted to seat with the full diameter just at flush will feed fine and these will be very accurate too. These should function most guns without trouble. AA#5, 231, etc will all work using the 180 grain data and 155 grain bullet. You may just not like the recoil of 180 grain full house loads you created or the factory equivalent but since you are reloading, you have a lot of options not available in factory ammo.
 
That's the struggle I'm having I guess. I know the gun is accurate. The load is made shot POA, but I had to really slow down and concentrate. If I fired more than 1 shot every second or two, my group was more like a pattern.
 
Sorry, I don't know how to quote on my computer.

I chose the 5.8 load because all I have right now for a powder measure are the CC scoops. The .17 and .3 scoop together make 5.8 grains.

I don't find commercial target ammo to be bad at all.

Maybe I should just get an actual powder measure? :confused:

I guess the real question is does the extra recoil of .40 S&W worth it over the 9mm?
 
The .40 S&W out of a small gun is bit tough to handle. On subcompact guns, I prefer 9mm such as Glock 26 or Kahr PM9. Those guns only have room for your 3rd and 4th finger. The .40 S&W is a great round, but only if YOU can handle the recoil. It is a dream to shoot in larger guns like my STI Edge and Sig P229. I had a H&K USP Full Size that would put them through the same hole all day long.

Best option is to see if you can buy a 9mm barrel and swap springs and mags.
 
Should I dump the .40S&W?

This thread made me chuckle. Many suggest to down-load your reloads, use lighter bullets, find softer shooting commercial rounds....all sound like you are trying to make your .40S&W into a 9mm. Follow up shot delay is one of the downsides to having that much power in a handgun.

Be careful spending all your time shooting soft reloads. One you dive back into full power or self defense loads, it's gonna be a real eye opener.

Good luck with your decision and safe shooting!
 
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HKFan, that was the whole idea behind shooting full power reloads. That way, I would be used to shooting full power loads when I shot my defense loads.
 
Only you can make that decision but based on what you are saying it probably would be a good idea to consider moving to 9MM. Shooting should be fun and not to the point you want to not shoot a firearm anymore. I don't enjoy shooting .40 in lighter pistols. My metal frame P229 handles .40 wonderfully though.
 
I probably will end up going back to 9. Just on the premise that I want to shoot the same caliber in my carry gun and range gun. In my shield the .4o is too much.
 
I say you keep the .40 and dial back the practice rounds a bit. I like my .40 cast reloads to travel around 925-940 fps. If you get up toward 1000 fps you get some pretty peppy recoil. Obviously you need to be able to shoot hotter loads, but constant practice with full bore loads leads to less practice and sometimes bad habits. You wouldn't shoot a .357 magnum with full house loads all the time, so why do that with your .40?

As for switching calibers, you are reloading a very versatile caliber that few people reload. I can't tell you how much free brass I get offered because nobody reloads .40. Don't give up on it yet.
 
2afreedom said:
I say you keep the .40 and dial back the practice rounds a bit. I like my .40 cast reloads to travel around 925-940 fps. If you get up toward 1000 fps you get some pretty peppy recoil. Obviously you need to be able to shoot hotter loads, but constant practice with full bore loads leads to less practice and sometimes bad habits. You wouldn't shoot a .357 magnum with full house loads all the time, so why do that with your .40?

As for switching calibers, you are reloading a very versatile caliber that few people reload. I can't tell you how much free brass I get offered because nobody reloads .40. Don't give up on it yet.
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You are right on the free or very cheap brass. I've gotten so many weird looks from people when I say I reload .40
 
too much

The .40 operates at fairly high pressure, and in addition to recoil with the heavier slugs, concussion is notable, especially if shooting indoors. The .40 can be a handful for certain shooters in certain guns.

If the FBI would only admit it, I suspect that is the main reason that the agency is once again swappping guns and calibers. Despite their reputation, many FBI agents are not gun slingers.

Now that I think about it, didn't an article just run in the "Rifleman" that alluded the very same?
 
Well, I wouldn't. But not because I think 40 is so great or anything, but I do like the cartridge.

I've handloaded maybe 10,000 rds of 40 and have found it 'challenging' to dial in a sweet spot. But, there are a couple of propellants I've found that seem to be pretty good: Clays, Solo 1000 and Nitro 100 are all roughly equivalent, with Nitro 100 producing impressive accuracy and punch with 180 gr bullets.

I guess if you don't enjoy the round and find you're not having a good time shooting it, then I'm not sure there's any good reason to keep it around. I dislike almost everything about 9mm...so I don't shoot it. It's really as simple as that. Its popularity, availability and any other ility don't have much influence on me, and any real or imagined wonders of 40 should probably not have much influence on you, either. You gotta be confident with the gun and the ammo.

All that said, I often come back to a real basic for me...and that is the idea that you can't shoot more recoil without giving your body time to learn to deal with it. And it takes time. You really DO have to develop muscles to do this, and shooting over time gets that done.

I think 40 is pretty versatile in terms of loads, even if I've had a tough time in finding super accurate loads. For a carry gun, I think it's worth learning to shoot well. I'm just not a guy that thinks every caliber you have has to be loaded to 5% beyond its book max to 'get the most out of it'.

To me the best and most worthy reason for sticking with 40 is to develop what's needed to be confident and competent with 10mm. :D

The .40 operates at fairly high pressure
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Yes, exactly the same pressure as 9mm.
 
9mm is equal to .40 and .45 IMO, pistol rounds all generally suck at stopping threats, especially compared to long guns. Shot placement is the key factor in whether a threat ceases hostile action or continues to fight. Seeing how your .40 is becoming uncomfortable to shoot I would say you are on your way to developing a flinch, not to mention having a slower shot recovery time. No point in down loading the .40 when you could have a higher capacity 9mm with similar "power".

A heavy full size gun in 9mm like a Sig P226, Beretta 92, Browning Hi-Power, or CZ75 should cure your recoil woes.
 
You should have rented a tupperware .40 cal before you bought one. Now you either have to suck it up or sell it. You could try the 155 grain bullets and see if that will work. Maybe rent a metal .40 cal and see if you can handle that. It amazes me that so many of you ignore simple physics and then gripe about it later.
 
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