Seriously wanting a brush gun!

OP Here

The problem is that when you have your 30-30 (which typically is a 3moa rifle) and a deer happens to step out at 200+ yds, you're kind of screwed. Been there, done that - dumped the 30-30 for a Rem Model 7 .260 with an 18.5" bbl. It is actually the same length and weight as the Win 94 it replaced but it has more than double the range.
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Funny, this does have me thinking outside the box on the lever actions. To be honest part of the reason I want one is just because they are so cool. Keep the suggestions coming on alternatives.

Of course other than a lever gun you could go all Woods Ninja with an AR platform in 50 Beowulf, or 458 SOCOM!
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Funny, 2 minutes after buying a CZ75b yesterday the dude at the LGS offers me a Sig 716 in .308 for $1300! Gotta admit that was a little more than tempting, but could only do it on credit so I passed. I did have my .223 AR in the blind and that was perfect, I am just a little concerned about the adequacy of the round for Whitetail.
 
Lota good choices listed for "brush" guns.

I have several listed in the posts above ... Winchester and Marlin .30-30's. A Savage 99E in .308.

My choice for true brush shooting is a Winchester Model 71 in the 200 grain .348. I consider brush and forest hunting as different scenarios though.

Kinda surprised someone hasn't mentioned the venerable .45-70 such as the Marlin offering. Great "brush" round.
 
If you already have an ar lower, you can get into .450 Bushmaster for under $600. Watch prices with anyone who sells Bushmaster, they put the uppers on sale about twice a year. The 16" barrel is plenty long. The cartridge is not capable of utilizing the longer barrel lengths offered.
If you do go the route of the Bushmaster, the trash can is a good place to deposit the factory mag. They seem to run best with un-altered Sig-Sauer polymer 5.56 mags. (Yes, the Sig mags that everyone says are junk for using in a 5.56.)

Nothing is wrong with the Socom or Beouwolf, but ammo turned out by Hornaday at NORMAL prices is definitely a plus for the Bushmaster. Despite what you read on the interwebs, reloading the Bushmaster is no problem; so long as you understand headspacing.
 
I know, you see people all the time bragging that their Marlin does better than that. However, even when those are true (and many are not), those rifles are very few and far between.
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Not really. The rifles capable of doing that aren't that rare at all. The thing is, most people aren't willing to do what it takes to get that sort of accuracy out of them. They want to just go down to the local store, buy a box of any old cheap-o factory ammo and be done with it. Toss in a poorly adjusted barrel band and you aren't going to get super great accuracy. Thing is, for a lot of people even that level of accuracy is good enough. 3 MOA is just fine if you never take a shot over 100 yards.

If you are willing to do it right, if you are willing to work up some handloads and make sure that your rifle is in good shape, then you can get decent accuracy from most Winnies or Marlins.
 
An M4A3 .300BLK w/ 14.5" bbl and pinned flash hider, Aimpoint Comp 4 red dot, quad rail w/ tactical vertigrip would be a perfect brush gun... and not just for hunting. :cool:
 
I chose an AR in 7.62x39 for my brush gun.
I still think that the world's greatest brush gun would be a Hakim in 8mm Mauser with its barrel chopped down to 18".
 
For deer, if you can hit a gallon jug at the maximum distance you plan to shoot then you are good to go. I wouldn't get caught up in accuracy especially within 100 yards. At 100 yards, any decent rifle without a scope can do what you need.

My problem is when I intend to do some under 100 yard hunting there's always a deer far away. It's hard to get a .45 Colt 150 yards without a scope. I typically long range hunt with a scoped .243 and I always end up seeing deer up close.
I've kinda switched directions and I'm using a .45-70 NEF single shot. So far I haven't fit a scope on it but I'm thinking of switching to better sights of maybe a 1x4 scope. Next year I'm gonna try hunting with a 7.62x39 pistol.
 
gb_in_ga,
If you are willing to do it right, if you are willing to work up some handloads and make sure that your rifle is in good shape, then you can get decent accuracy from most Winnies or Marlins.
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What he said.

Like all rifles ammo makes a difference. My winchester 94 likes Winchester powerpoints in 150 grain. Federal and Remingtons shoot differently in this rifle. My dads 336 likes Federal 150 grains.

Of course reloading gives you the best option to fine tune your load.
 
Well, the guy already has a .270 and I am guessing it is a bolt action. To me a "bush" gun fires a moderate round which at close range does the job. Take the 30-30. In Canada years ago it was used on Moose. You could get a 190 grain bullet in Canada. So....a 30-30 ought to be fine. I've used a 30-30 on a lot of game. Black bear- ran 20 yards, deer- knocked down. Seems okay as far as power.
There are a lot of good lever actions. The Savage is a very good gun, locks up well, and you can get a .308 chambering. Browning makes a good lever action. Both of these are more bulky than the Winchester 94 or Marlin 336. I put a scope on my Marlin 336 to help ID if a deer has antlers- in heavy cover even at 50 yards- that can be an issue. I know you aren't supposed to use a rifle scope to scan an area and I don't. It is when I actually see a deer for sure.
I use a 2 1/2x fixed power scope. The field of view is good, it is fast, no front and rear sights to line up. When I was younger I used open sights which were fine for 50-70 yard shots.
There used to be some famous hunters up in Vermont that used pump actions in 30-06. That seems like a very good choice.
The semi-auto rifle has the fastest second shot. Semi-autos are viewed as "dangerous" however nothing is etched in stone. If you are already using semi-auto pistols, shotguns, and rimfires then using the same on a deer rifle isn't much different.
The Rem semi-auto can be had with a plastic stock and fairly short barrel. That is a good choice in my opinion because you can go through heavy under cover and not worry about an expensive and beautiful wood stock getting all beat up. That Ruger in 44 Mag- that has to be a real joy to carry if you are still hunting.
If younger shooters will be using the rifle then the lever has a really big plus. You can hunt with no live round in the chamber, you can lever a round as you raise the gun to fire. Same thing with the pump action. This would be for deer drives, still hunting, etc. If you are in a tree stand- that's different. As a teen I hunted that way- either by myself or as part of a drive. I never felt handy capped.
Finally, on the newer levers, there is a cross bolt safety that older guns lack. That cross bolt is a "must" You can leave it on as you unload.- On a lever you cycle rounds in and out of the action. On a semi-auto- just take out the clip and pull the bolt back.
 
Hey Savage 99, Did you switch stocks on your .358 Featherweight? Mine has no comb on the top. Maybe mine was switched at one time.
 
What if any years of the 94's are to avoid?
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I wouldn't avoid any but if you want a scope then you want one made from the late 70's to current because the older ones had a side mounted scope base. Kind of ugly and it isn't on top of the barrel so if you zero it at a certain range anything further will create an x pattern with the bullet moving to the left the further you shoot beyond the zeroed range.

It's not a big deal as the scope sits about 1cm to the left of the barrel so I zero my rifle to shoot 1 cm to the right.
Here's an auction showing one with a side mount scope.
http://www.gunauction.com/buy/11470795

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What if any years of the 94's are to avoid?
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Personally, in addition to what Blindstitch said about the angle eject I would also look for one that was made before the lawyers started forcing them to carry safeties. The idea of a safety on an external hammer rifle is an oxymoron. If they had even made a safety that was a "trigger lock" safety it wouldn't have been so bad. However, the genius that designed it made it a hammer block safety. So, when the safety is on the hammer can fall (and spook an animal) without the round going off. I lost a good pig that way - would have been a broadside shot at less than 20 yds. First time I ever saw a pig smile. :mad:
 


444 marlin
tc encore with a MGM heavy factory barrel

265gr hornady flat point with a charge of h4198
.6" (3 shots) at 100 yards
 
When did they start with the safeties?
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With Winchester it was somewhere around 1992 for the cross-bolt safety and around 2003 they switched to a tang mounted safety. Marlin started earlier - early 80's. Although somebody else will have to say whether the Marlin is a trigger lock safety or a hammer block safety. I haven't shot one of the Marlin lever actions since the mid 70's.
 
My 44 model 94 has a half cock safety. I got it new in 92. I was told it is the last year. I do like it.

As to the 45-70 mentioned, I have a revolver in that caliber and would love a lever gun in that same. Then like my 44 I have the same cartridge for both.

I really like my savage 99 in 300 savage. Store bought rounds are hard to find at times which is a great reason to reload. Very flat round to shoot.

Since I prefer handgun hunting, I either don't take a rifle or take one the same caliber of my handgun.

Mel
 
Well I would generally avoid the ones made after 1963. The only calibers I would be particularly open to are 30WCF and 38-55. 32 Winchester Special would be OK if I really, really liked the rifle, but it is ballistically nearly identical to the 30-30 that it offers no distinct advantage, while ammo for the 32 is harder to find and more expensive, too. The 30-30 is the premier caliber for the model 94. There have been some more powerful cartridges like 444 Marlin and 450 Marlin, but that much power means a lot more recoil for such a light rifle. The 30-30 is a perfect balance of power with acceptable recoil in a Winchester 94 carbine. There have been millions of these Winchesters made, with a lot of varients over the last century+. One might say they're all good and just choose one that appeals to you. Some folks like the, "Saddle-ring Carbine". Others are obsessed with collectin as many different variants as they can find. I personally prefer the ones made before 1950, the carbines with longer forearms and checkered hammers. For rifle versions, I find the model 55, (a special configuration of the model 94), to be particularly appealing, though I prefer the solid frame, rather than the take-down model. I like a well-worn, silvery patina of a 75 year old gun as long as the bore is in good shape. The hunt for the right one is half the fun.
 
In your senario I would have so many choices....three pre 64 Winchesters in 25-35 and .32 Winchester Special, SKS, Mosin Nagant heck I could use shotgun with 000 buck either my Marlin or Mossberg which I could pack two barrels but probably I would just use my Ivar Johnson Cattleman in .44 magnum and attach the stock.
 
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