Senator McCain.... the Democrat?

F

FireMax

New member
Click here to read the full story

This story is from the NY Times. McCain should remember the Times. He was gushing and so flattered that they endorsed him back in January. Imagine that... a Republican who is happy that the NY Times endorsed them. Bizarre.

This story points out the real problems McCain has in trying to get Conservatives to vote for him. His problem is... well, he is not a Conservative. In fact, he has flirted with switching parties to the Democrats after the 2000 election and he flirted with becoming John Kerry's running mate in 2004.

As a Conservative who has voted for Republican Presidential candidates since I was a college student in 1988, I believe that I have pretty good cause to say that I am flabbergasted at McCain's nomination on the Republican ticket. I have towed the line with this party which I used to identify with. However, as this story makes clear, the Republican party has now put forth a candidate who is not like me. In other words, he is not Conservative like me.

It takes a lot of gall for McCain to stand before a television camera and profess to be Conservative when it is clear that he is about as Conservative as Hillary Clinton.

I don't believe in "voting for the lesser of evils". I vote for a candidate who is a close match to my beliefs in regard to Conservative principals. If there is not one, then why would I vote for a candidate who does not share my beliefs?

For the first time since I began voting in 1988, I will NOT vote for a Republican candidate in the Presidential election. I will be voting for a third party candidate or I will write in a choice.

McCain the gun-grabber? No ****ing way!

Click here to read the full story
 
While I agree with much of what FireMax has to say I can't see voting for a third party candidate, or not voting, vs. casting a ballot for McCain. He's far from perfect as a conservative, but he's a much more conservative choice than either Obama or Hillary. Voting for a third party candidate would help hand the election to one of those two ultra-liberals and I just couldn't do that.
 
JWT, I realize that I am diverging from many Conservatives whom will vote for a liberal Republican just to keep the most liberal democrat out of the White House.

I didn't take this position lightly. I have not like John McCain since he first began bashing Conservative principals back about 10 years ago. Since then, he has only gotten worse.

As a Conservative, I have long supported the Republican party because it seemed to be a party which shared my positions on most issues such as Gun Control and Freedom of Speech. However, John McCain has shown that he is NOT pro-gun ( Don't take my word for it, read what the 2nd largest pro-gun organization in the USA has to say... http://www.gunowners.org/mccaintb.htm) and he is certainly not pro- freedom of speech because the "McCain Feingold" bill effectively limits our freedom of expression during an election campaign. Others call it the Pro-Incumbent law because currently serving politicians are the only ones which gain from it.).

So, believe me, I did not make this decision lightly. I made it out of principal. What if the GOP puts forth an even more liberal candidate in 2012. Will you vote for him/her too? What is the line which a candidate you would vote for should not cross? It seems to me that McCain crosses the line with most true conservatives. Voting for the lesser of evils is not an option for someone who stands by their principals. That is IMHO.

Peace.
 
the Republican party has now put forth a candidate who is not like me. In other words, he is not Conservative like me.
Click to expand...

Too bad a very significant majority of the Republican party (including the conservative base of the Republican party) has rejected a nominee 'like you.' Actually, I don't think that this is a bad thing at all.

So write-in your own candidate. Perhaps you ought to write in your own name, since you are apparently a perfect version of your own conservative self. :p I don't think that McCain will have a problem getting Republican votes, including conservative Republican votes. Or independent votes. He might even get some Democrat votes. Which is making Democrats very nervous. :D
 
It takes a lot of gall for McCain to stand before a television camera and profess to be Conservative when it is clear that he is about as Conservative as Hillary Clinton.
Click to expand...

That is the dumbest thing I have read in a long, long time.
 
I agree that McCain is not conservative, and not a typical Republican either. But to say that "...he is about as conservative as Hillary Clinton" is just not honest. If you look at the way McCain has voted on many issues, there are some votes that are the same as Hillary unfortunately, but there are many more votes that Hillary never would place the same has McCain. In addition, we don't know that it will be Hillary on the ticket yet, and comparing Obama record almost does make McCain look conservative.

If not voting, or writing in make you feel better, than we can't stop you, but you won't feel better once the government gets insanely bigger, your taxes go way up, healthcare goes down the toilet, the list goes on.

Let's think about the better of the county rather than ourselves and do the best we can in November, even if it's not what we hoped for
 
your taxes go way up, healthcare goes down the toilet
Click to expand...

A virtual certainty with either Obama or Hillary in the White House. But then again, those two issues may be no big deal with some voters........
 
I'll still vote for the candidate closest to my values, whether he matches them or not. Because a bad republican is still better than a rabidly progressive/liberal democrat.

What if the GOP puts forward an even more liberal candidate next time? Well, who's fault is that? We had several truly conservative candidates running, and none of them got very far in the primaries. Those of us who care about such things need to make sure we're truly involved in the primary elections and make sure a conservative candidate gets through.

Otherwise ... we're once again voting for the lesser of 2 evils. But I'll still vote for the lesser of 2 evils thsi year, the candidate who voted against the AWB renewal and for the protection of gun manufacturers from law suits. And that would be McCain.

Paint it any way you want it ... but a conservative voting for a third party in protest is a vote for a democrat. And the democrats this year are very, very bad options.
 
Well it's fact time, pros and cons. It's best when making judgments on things with alot of variables to look at it from the worse case scenario. Let's say that the candidate elected performs the acts you most wish they wouldn't but were aware they either intended to or it matched their track records.

McCain allows the Bush tax cuts to expire and maintains the open border polocies of today and even passes a 'cabon tax' . The result would be a failed re-election bid and a new crop of Republicans to choose from in 4 years that can cut taxes again and close the border. Essentially un-doing whatever McCain may do that his successor disapproves of and has mandate to accomplish.

Hillary or Obama (same platform with minor variances) you STLL get the taxes and illeagal imigrations PLUS more gun control AND socialized medicine. Probably in a seemingly benign form initially but the fix gets in. This single action will become an the entitlement program that makes Social Security look like small potatoes and will be impossible to undo. Social Security benefits are received by a few but health care is to be received by ALL. That's the promise of both Democrats. Imagine getting retirees to vote to have Social Security halted and their benefits ended. How much more difficult to have that happen when the entitlement is received by everyone.

It's time to look to our Congressional races. The reality is only your House Representative represent you and is expected to act based upon the will of the majority of individuals withing their district. Senators are to Represent their State's interest and the President the Nations interests. We are a Republic remember, NOT a Democracy as is so often misunderstood. We have a Democratically Elected Representative Republic which is a form of Democracy.

Remember, a straight DEMOCRACY cannot work because the citizens will discover the ability to vote themselves the wealth of the treasury (we call them entitlements) and destroy the democracy. Historically a dictator or invader follows soon after.

Reagan and Goldwater are still dead and their reincarnations didn't run this cycle. The conservative ideal still endures and will take a lot more then John McCain's election to stifle. It's not an 'idea' that can lose favor but rather an affirmation of the greater part of men that believes people can do far more then they think they can and possess a worth realized only be their OWN desire to excel rather then to languish.

When given a choice that is fraught with variables, make your decisions so as to maintain an exit strategy.
 
closet to your values

Garand Illusion I can't agree with your stated philosophy. Your going to vote for a candidate ..."closest to my values, whether he matches them or not." How far do you allow that candidate to vary from your beliefs before you don't vote for them?

I think many of us are in the quandary of determining who we we vote for once the primary fiasco ends. By November there will be two major candidates: neither of them will meet our full expectations while either of them could meet many of them. How do you chose the candidate and not the party at that point?

There are so many significant issue. Some of them outweigh others and some are trade offs. For example: if you are a supporter of the RKBA and also don't want to see the extension of the Iraq mess continue you are in a precarious situation.
 
McCain is not who any of us would want for president.

But, does anyone here actually want Obama? I cannot understand how the man has gotten to where he is.

These two will most likely be the choices. Any vote not cast for McCain, regardless of who it is for, is a vote for Obama.

If Obama is our next president things are going to be worse that anything we have ever seen in our country.
 
But, does anyone here actually want Obama? I cannot understand how the man has gotten to where he is.
Click to expand...

Even though she stumbled over her own words quite foolishly, I still think the point Geraldine Ferraro tried to make is right.

"Oh wow, how far has American grown now that a black guy has a real chance of becoming president? And he's sooo well-spoken and not a hoodlum at all!"

"I'm not racist. I voted for Barack Obama."

friendsbarack450-771532.jpg


Pat Buchanan, of all people, argued it so well that he convinced Hardball host Chris Matthews to agree with him.

1. Is McCain a real, bleeding heart gun grabber? 2. McCain is not a populist. 3. Or you can wax nostalgic about Reagan.
 
You mean McCain is not a Democrat?....... :confused:


If Obama is our next president things are going to be worse that anything we have ever seen in our country.
Click to expand...

No worse than Carter....and much less competent...he'll be a one-termer at best.

Clinton....she's competent and dangerous.....she'll get a second term and maybe find a way for a third.....you know how much the Constitution means to the Clintons ;) ........

McCain....he doesn't stand a chance either way.....
 
I sincerely think that the appelation of RINO as applied to McCain is totally undeserved. I feel that the man just votes his conscience , what he perceives as what his constituancy wants and not in lock step with the party line - be it good or bad. The politico's that I really dislike are the ones who are unable to think for themselves and/or don't have the guts to stand up for what they believe.
 
As a Conservative who has voted for Republican Presidential candidates since I was a college student in 1988, I believe that I have pretty good cause to say that I am flabbergasted at McCain's nomination on the Republican ticket. I have towed the line with this party which I used to identify with. However, as this story makes clear, the Republican party has now put forth a candidate who is not like me. In other words, he is not Conservative like me.

It takes a lot of gall for McCain to stand before a television camera and profess to be Conservative when it is clear that he is about as Conservative as Hillary Clinton.

I don't believe in "voting for the lesser of evils". I vote for a candidate who is a close match to my beliefs in regard to Conservative principals. If there is not one, then why would I vote for a candidate who does not share my beliefs?

For the first time since I began voting in 1988, I will NOT vote for a Republican candidate in the Presidential election. I will be voting for a third party candidate or I will write in a choice.

McCain the gun-grabber? No ****ing way!
Click to expand...

Same here
 
McCain the gun-grabber? No ****ing way!
Click to expand...

Personally, I don't think he qualifies as a "gun-grabber". However, by voting your 3rd party candidate, you might just help put one in the White House.
 
Personally, I don't think he qualifies as a "gun-grabber". However, by voting your 3rd party candidate, you might just help put one in the White House.
Click to expand...

It is this very attitude that got George "I'll sign it" Bush in office.

If you keep voting for the same old your going to keep getting the same old. and reffer to my tag line.
 
It is this very attitude that got George "I'll sign it" Bush in office.

If you keep voting for the same old your going to keep getting the same old.
Click to expand...

John McCain is far from who I would consider the ideal Republican to be the nominee for President. However, I have enough common sense to realize that the concept of "the lesser of two evils" is indeed real. When it comes down to John McCain vs. one of the two socialists on the Democrat ticket, I'll hold my nose and vote for Sen. McCain.
 
Hopefully a political revolt against the two parties will come about as a result of this. I've heard all my life that no matter what all politicians are terrible but this election has taken terrible to a level not seen before. Lesser of two evils this time around is 100x more evil than before: the only reason McCain has a shot this time, just like our glorious Benedict Arnold Bush last time, is because ANYTHING is better than the other, so more evil is allowed. (How exactly they're allowed a toe in this country in the first place I don't know.)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top