Senator McCain speaks to the NRA

It's absolutely astounding how some here are so unwilling to fight for their freedom and so quick to belittle those who are.

But with each post it becomes clearer those people who are NOT our allies against a government gone bad.

I ask no individual to take up arms to protect their freedom and mine. But I have nothing but loathing for those who speak with derision about individuals like Ron Paul (and others) who still seek peaceful resolutions to this nation's problems. If you won't support the peaceful solutions....don't come crying when less peaceful solutions are later resorted to.
 
conscience and practicality

I agree in principle with Steelcore and Danzig. HOWEVER, there are facts to consider:

1. Ron Paul or Bob Barr have NO chance of becoming President this cycle. None. Wishing or beating our breasts with conscience will not do it.

2. It will be either Obama or McCain. It will likely be close given the number of swing states

3. Although neither are sterling, McCain is a better friend to the 2nd ammendment.

4. While it might FEEL GOOD to "vote conscience for Paul or Barr, that vote probably takes one away from McCain, which helps Obama.

If A: Neither McCain or Obama are desireable
B: McCain is more desireable than Obama
C: McCain or Obama are the only possibilities, then
D: McCain is the only rational choice, albeit not maybe the best

It might feel good to tell yourself that you are voting your conscience, but the result of the vote will contribute to a less desireable outcome. I FULLY agree that we need more options- more viable ones, like Ron Paul. Ones that get time at debates, increased exposure, etc. However, as the vote is now upon us, now is NOT the time to attempt to effect change by voting for one that cannot win. Like it or not, a vote for RP or BB increases the chances for Obama. Remember Nader and Gore last time? Exercising our power in democracy during the off election years to demand increased exposure would be a better use of conscience. Being active in the NRA, or on a local/state level during the non election years, lobbying our representatives to get increased 3rd party support would be more effective.

Proclaiming that one will "vote conscience" might feel good, but the consequences will likely not. If our votes, every one of them matters, then feeling good about voting in a manner that will increase the likelihood of the opposition winning is misguided at best.
 
Well then, if I have to vote for a candidate I don't want, just to avoid another candidate I don't want, just so I can say that I voted for the winner, why even vote at all?

Because what you are really saying is that I can't vote for the candidate I want, because he can't win. That means my vote doesn't count. I would rather abstain that vote for someone that is against my values, and McCain and Obama are both against my values. That is why neither one will be getting my vote this year. I think I will leave my presidential vote blank.

BTW- Don't give me that "If you don't vote for McCain, you are voting for Obama" stuff, either. If that is the best reason you can give, then you have one sorry-a**ed candidate there.
 
If A: Neither McCain or Obama are desireable
B: McCain is more desireable than Obama
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Not true on every issue, an important one being spending. When McCain proposes new spending, Ron Paul will vote no, and it will pass because Repubs won't cross their guy. When Obama proposes new spending, Repubs will be in an uproar and might slow the train down a bit.

If you look at govt spending growth in the past several administrations, there is an odd but discernible pattern: government spending grows faster when we have an R in the White House, and I believe it is because an R in the White House means there will be no opposition from Congress.

The most recent example is the most glaring: government spending grew almost three times as much under W as under Hillbillary.

The out of control spending has got to stop, or at least slow down. We're borrowing and printing money like crazy, undermining our own wealth.
 
For those of you who like your guns and the rights associated with them,, In GODS Name please vote for Mccain!!! I know Ron Paul would be better, but he has no chance. Do you remember the little old goofy independent named Ross Perot?? He took alot of Conservative Votes away from George Bush the first and we ended up with Clinton. Ron Paul is the same thing. He has no chance. Stand up for your rights,( hold your nose if you have to )and Vote McCain. Unless you like Higher taxes, Socialized medicine and no damn gun rights. Obama wants all small arms banned. Just look at his site. Not one damn word about guns said ,,,at all. He is hiding it. I see horns on that little pointy head of his, right above his Dumbo ears.
 
For those who want to beat the drum for one candidate or another during this poiltical season, here are some grades from the folks at GunOwners.org that might give you pause ... or send you scurrying to find another presidential candidate. You'll note that Obama has the best score of the three: a mere F. McCain and Hillary both received F- scores:

http://www.gunowners.org/109srat.htm
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GOA has truly lost their marbles if they truly believe that McCain is indistinguishable from Hillary and worse than Obama on gun rights.

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_obama.html

Personally, I don't think McCain is going to be much help for RKBA. He will pass legislation extending the NICS system to private sales. The most we will be able to hope for is no new AWBs. Of course, there is always the argument that McCain will pick Justices who will be key in developing positive Second Amendment case law following Heller. The problem with this is that McCain has already shown what he thinks of the First Amendment with his campaign finance law. If he plans to nominate more Justices in that vein, then who knows what we will get.

About the only positive McCain has going for him is Obama. Obama is worse than Hillary in practically every way. Not only is he noticeably worse on RKBA - as a constitutional law professor, Obama is well-educated enough to know just how big of a lie he is selling. He knows the history and meaning of the Second Amendment and yet still thinks Illinois (i.e. Chicago) gun laws aren't strict enough. Not only that; but he is perfectly OK with twisting the meaning of the Constitution to get that result.
 
GOA has truly lost their marbles if they truly believe that McCain is indistinguishable from Hillary and worse than Obama on gun rights.
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Ha, that's putting it nicely. If it were up to the GOA, the recent decision by the Second Circuit dismissing a junk lawsut against firearms manufacturers would not exist, and the case would still be dragging on in Court. The GOA doesn't have any marbles to lose in the first place. McCain co-sponsored the legislation that killed that stupid lawsuit. He also voted agains the assault weapons ban. Don't ask the GOA about those votes, or about their opposition to that legislation. ;)
 
GOA has truly lost their marbles if they truly believe that McCain is indistinguishable from Hillary and worse than Obama on gun rights.
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What is sickening is that we are in a position to need to compare any of the three in the first place. Seriously, of all the people in this country WHY DID IT HAVE TO BE THEM?!?!?!?
 
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