Remember When Smith and Wesson was anti-gun?

I always felt the Bill Ruger thing was like seeing a huge boulder rolling down hill. You can see it coming, and nothing you can do can stop it from crushing you, if you stay where you are.

What Ruger said was essentially, "If you don't want to get crushed, stand over here to the side, like I am."

He could have picked a spot better for the rest of us to stand on, but he didn't. He picked one that was fine for him, and could fit the rest of us, if we were willing to squeeze in to his spot... which we weren't.

That is a whole lot different than people saying "Ruger pushed the boulder at us!"
 
Whatever Bill Ruger's faults, I noticed that Ruger is aggressively marketing factory 25rd magazines for their 10/22, not to mention selling all of its various AR models with 30 round mags.
 
There was a time when people thought they could protect our interests and theirs with "compromise". It was naive, but at the time, they thought you could throw the antis a bone and get them off our backs as opposed to losing much more. It was short sighted, and most have since learned that if you give up anything, they simply come back for another bite.

The NRA backed the Instant background check at the time, not because they thought it was a good idea, but because they thought it would appease the antis. LaPierre still laments, and explains this every time they throw it in his face and demand the NRA support even more useless background checks.

Didn't Colt stop making the AR to appease the antis? I'm not sure.
 
The Bill Ruger thing was not only NOT overblown, it was way underblown. They were hardcore anti-2A back then.

But all's well that ends well - they aren't any more, thanks to the public outcry / backlash / boycott, and due to Bill Sr. the anti dying.

The S&W was also not overblown. They deserved to be boycotted, too. And the boycotts in fact worked to change both of their attitudes (along with changing product lines and market demands).

As for hillary hole guns, they were already making them at that time, weren't they?

There was a time when people thought they could protect our interests and theirs with "compromise". It was naive, but at the time, they thought you could throw the antis a bone and get them off our backs as opposed to losing much more. It was short sighted, and most have since learned that if you give up anything, they simply come back for another bite.
Click to expand...

Bingo! Exactly.
 
As for hillary hole guns, they were already making them at that time, weren't they?
Click to expand...
No, that was the direct result from the agreement they signed and is about the only part of the agreement still being observed. I don't think it's any coincidence that the owner of S&W is a lock company.

I don't mind that there is a lock. Always good to have options. I just wish it were more unobtrusive like the lock on Taurus revolvers or on the Springfield 1911s. I do own a couple of SW revolvers with locks but I've passed on buying more because I can buy pre-lock revolvers instead.
 
TimSr said:
There was a time when people thought they could protect our interests and theirs with "compromise". It was naive, but at the time, they thought you could throw the antis a bone and get them off our backs as opposed to losing much more. It was short sighted, and most have since learned that if you give up anything, they simply come back for another bite....
Click to expand...
Or they take it over our objections -- like they just did in Washington State when the voters adopted I-594 by a 20% margin. The gun owners of Washington State quite possibly could have worked out a much more satisfactory law in the legislature if they hadn't underestimated the public support for Universal Background Checks.
 
I worked in a very busy Gun Shop from the mid 80's through the early 90's and as I remember lots of every day gun owners were rather anti as to who could own firearms and what kind of firearms should be allowed . You can still here this stuff from a few . On a prepper web site I go to there was a discussion on LEO's being anti 2nd Amendment when I posted some of the stuff everyday shooters have said I guess some of them realized that We as firearms owners do not allways agree . Thats not a weakness just Human behavior . I personaly think we should be able to own anything the Military has the only limit is what you can afford $$$ .
 
jimbob86

The years of the Clinton Administration were dark times for the gun industry and the 2nd Amendment.
Click to expand...

I would argue that in a way the Clinton years was the best thing possible for American gun-owners. It shook many of us (I include myself in that group) out of our complacency. I know that there are those who wouldn't agree, but like psalm7 posted gun-owners are people and people do not always agree 100% on everything. Impossible and against Human nature.
 
Last edited:
I would argue that in a way the Clinton years was the best thing possible for American gun-owners.
Click to expand...

So, would you also argue that the successful Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was he best thing possible for the US NAVY?
 
44 AMP

So, would you also argue that the successful Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was he best thing possible for the US NAVY?
Click to expand...

I think it depends on how you look at it. Don't you? Both events.
 
Bill Ruger attempted to use the power of government to destroy his competition and the rights of citizens.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
"Bill Ruger attempted to use the power of government to destroy his competition and the rights of citizens."

And you blame him for that? Psssh. That's business, my friend. Just as it's our job to fight back against that behavior. Both are equally necessary for prosperity and freedom (respectively)

"The years of the Clinton Administration were dark times for the gun industry and the 2nd Amendment."
I would disagree, from a longer-looking standpoint. Our political system, as tumultuous and irritating as it is, is still functional at curbing the worst ambitions our eager pols would foist upon us. Therefore, there was (in retrospect) not as much existential risk to the RKBA as was feared at the time; we weren't about to go off a cliff, we were already falling and about to be snapped back by the bungie cord. Nothing good about testing that cord, even if it does jerk us back to reality as part of the process. It was a dark period, but by necessity got bad enough to make us recoil from it.

TCB
 
So, would you also argue that the successful Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was he best thing possible for the US NAVY?
Click to expand...

Yes, because had the USN met the Japanese fleet in the open sea, American losses would have been far greater, and permanent. As it happened, many of the ships were not only nearly empty, a majority of their crews survived...... and nearly all of the sunken ships were salvaged/refloated, and many of them fought again .....

....as for the dark days of the Clinton Administration, yes, I think they resulted in an awakening of gun owners to the fact that the Antis will not be content with any compromise, and will always proceed toward their ultimate goal ...... I certainly woke up, and became politically aware for the first time in my life.....
 
Bill Ruger attempted to use the power of government to destroy his competition and the rights of citizens.
Click to expand...

Certainly you are entitled to your opinion. I look at it differently. I believe Bill Ruger tried to convince the power of government not to destroy him and the rights of citizens. In this, he was not fully successful, and has been demonized because of it.

There was going to be a mag round limit. There was NO hope of avoiding that, the "fix was in" with Congress. What Ruger tried to do was convince them NOT to choose 6 or even 5 rounds as the limit (which was what was being considered).

Is he being remembered for creating what has become one of the major US gun companies? No. For bringing us many,many truly excellent guns at prices the working man could afford? No. All you are remembering is an old man, late in his life, who shot off his mouth (admittedly foolishly) trying to stop ignorant politicians from destroying his life's work.

You have the right to your opinion, but while you are damming his memory for getting us a 10 round limit, you might want to consider some faint recognition of him helping us keep from getting a 5 round limit.

You might also consider putting the blame were it really belongs, on politicians and the anti gun movement.
 
Remember When Smith and Wesson was anti-gun?
Click to expand...


No. S&W did what they had to do to stay in business to continue to produce firearms. They continue to produce firearms that are so much in demand that you rarely see them in stock. Their firearms are also considered by many to be some of the best in the world. How anti-gun is that? Because of the little hole in the frame? How about when Remington put internal locks on it's long guns? They had the same little "Hillary Hole" in the trigger guard. Strange that there are not countless internet threads about this touting the likelihood of complete gun failure, and lets boycott them because of their antigun sentiments. They must be in cahoots with S&W and Bill Ruger conspiring to take away our guns that they are trying to sell to us. Bill Ruger was also a long way from anti gun. He said how he felt and said what he thought might save his largest group of consumers the ability to buy his firearms. Didn't like what he said, so be it. But to call him anti-gun? Pretty long stretch there.
 
The NRA backed the Instant background check at the time, not because they thought it was a good idea, but because they thought it would appease the antis. LaPierre still laments, and explains this every time they throw it in his face and demand the NRA support even more useless background checks.
Click to expand...

The instant background check was damage control. The Brady Bill, with both background checks and a waiting period, was going to pass. By instituting the NICS system, the waiting period, at least, went away.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top