pro-gun liberalism

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higgy1911

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frankly I'm at a loss. 2nd amendment issues are the most important to me and I will always vote for whatever candidate comes closest to upholding my view on them.

However, voting for me is always a depressing process, as are politics in general.

I don't understand how guns and gun rights have become the property of the conservative parties. I don't mean to criticize conservatives, I'm sure most of you are. We can certainly agree to disagree. I just find myself in a dark mood. I personally believe in live and let live, and people's freedom. That's part of why I'm pro-gun. also because I like guns, and even if I thought they were "bad" i'd still be pro gun. I really just don't understand why liberals are not pro-gun. it never made any sense to me.

and what the heck is a pro-abortion, pro-gay rights, pro-war(sort of), pro-drug legalization, pro-immigrant sort of guy to do. Libertarians never have a chance, and while philosophically I believe mostly what they do, I find myself more and more in favor of some "nanny-state" philosophies. which of course doesn't mesh at all with the way I feel about drugs or guns.

All I can say is the older I get the less politics makes any sense to me at all. guess i'll just cast another republican vote, and go home and clean my guns. but man, it sucks.
 
Sounds like you are a Conservative/moderate Democrat which is a rare breed today. The Democrat party has been taken over by the far left which controls almost all aspects of the party. That is why the National Democrat party is anti gun, which is not the case in state Dem parties. There are plenty of Pro gun Democrats around on the state and local level. Really you should keep your independent streak and vote as an independent. Vote for the candidate not the party.
 
could be. problem being independants never seem to win. KY has had respectable Dems in the past, but we're teetering. Yarmuth is a leftist, and a radical. I couldn't believe he won.
Love your signature by the way, so true.
 
I didn't mean to vote for a Independent candidate but remain politically independent. Don't join a party or an ideology. Be yourself. Vote for the best candidate that fits your beliefs whether being a Democrat or Republican.
 
I think that if you will look up the dictionary definitions of Liberal and Conservative, you will find that the real meaning of those words have little relavance to their political applications. The Democratic party has become more Socialist or Marxist than Liberal and the Republican party often treads dangerously close to Fascism. It is very difficult to actually vote your conscience these days as a vote for the lesser of two evils is still a vote for evil. What's a guy to do? Libertarian? Constitution party? There are others but have you heard of them? Neither have most other people.

I feel your pain.
 
M14fan said:
I think that if you will look up the dictionary definitions of Liberal and Conservative, you will find that the real meaning of those words have little relavance to their political applications. The Democratic party has become more Socialist or Marxist than Liberal and the Republican party often treads dangerously close to Fascism. It is very difficult to actually vote your conscience these days as a vote for the lesser of two evils is still a vote for evil. What's a guy to do? Libertarian? Constitution party? There are others but have you heard of them? Neither have most other people.
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I agree completely, and the part in bold is especially important for people to realize. (With the neocon takeover of the GOP, a degree of Marxism has leaked into the GOP as well.)

Neither major party believes in the kind of "live and let live" freedom on which America was founded. Both seek to increase government power and lessen freedom, just in somewhat different ways.

What's the answer? For me, it's to vote third party, to help try to wake up others to the relentless Republicratic assault on our Constitution, and to keep buying guns and ammo while I still can.
 
I am a bit confused...

Did I write that first post and just forget? :confused:

The only difference is I would have said pro-choice and not pro-abortion. :)

I will add that there are a lot of non-crazy, non-oppressive, pro-personal responsibility liberals out there...just like their are a lot non-crazy, non-hateful, pro-freedom of choice conservatives.

Unfortunately the politicians we are presented with these days seem to be playing to one extreme or the other and hoping to rally the crazies on one side or the other to their cause while not offending any more of the middle than they have to knowing the middle will have to choose the lesser evil. I just have a hard time with a political system where both sides spend all their time trying to be "the lesser evil" while rallying the weirdos.
 
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I hear it time and time again, "vote for who suits you" and then I hear "don't vote for them, they don't have a chance of winning."

What do you think would happen if everyone voted for who they agreed with over who they thought could win? IMHO I think RP or huck would have had more votes if the sport-politikers didn't vote for rudy or mitt because they wanted a popular well known republican to win the nomination hopefully guaranteeing a republican prez instead of a good prez. Same for dems. Maybe obama would be last instead of first.
 
Higgy, As someone who is conservative in my overall life, I believe there is a lot of us who fall in the middle. I've tried to decide if I am a liberal conservative or a conservative liberal.

I remember back room abortions and am pro choice. Our drug policy is a joke, there should be lifting of the current prohibition and let adults make adult choices. Buy your pot down at drug store and use it in the privacy of your home. Our son is gay, in a committed relationship and we love him.

I've found the news can no longer BS me cause I'm a TX Redneck that shoots guns, makes my house payments with no help from the government and pays way to much in taxes but barely complains. Personally, since Reagan was not available I'm glad Bush has been in the Presidency the last 8 years.

Maybe all this makes me a moderate, a realist and human (or crazy)
 
The 2nd Amendment is the purview of conservative and libertarians because for too many Liberals (notice the capital L to differentiate it from true liberalism), it's not about letting people be who they are; it's about forcing everyone else to conform to a Liberal world view of who they should be.

A true liberal wants everyone to be themselves. Don't like [insert issue here]? Fine, don't support it but don't interfere with it.

A Liberal wants everyone to accept and support what the Liberal wants. Don't like [insert issue here]? Well, you are wrong for doing so, you are legally required to facilitate the practice of [that issue] by those who are more advanced in their thinking than you, and you will do so financially.

Big "L" Liberals don't want people to have access to weapons because 1) people who do so tend to be those who understand they are ultimately responsible for themselves, 2) access to weapons provides a brake on Liberal ambition, exactly as the 2A was intended to do, and 3) most Liberals project their own control issues onto others and thus think anyone who has a gun will want to dominate another person.
 
The liberals I am around here at work at a large state university are big supporters of the “nanny state”. I think this is for 2 reasons. First is we indirectly work for government though state government funds to the university or federal and local grants. It is easy to fall into the big government trap when your paycheck depends on it. The second many liberals (independent of how much education they really have) have the Ivory Tower Syndrome where they think they are the enlighten ones that should be in charge and they don’t trust the average citizen. The part I find funny is they often complain about government abuse of power, stolen elections, and all kinds of conspiracies. Yet they only want government to have all the guns and it to be more powerful in general. To be clear the social engineering and large government policies that have taken over both parties have turn me into a libertarian. The neocons and evangelical parts of GOP have ruined it for me and the Dems are just short of being called the communist party.
 
it's not about letting people be who they are; it's about forcing everyone else to conform to a Liberal world view of who they should be.
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And Conservative don't push their views on others. Find that Conservatives are just as guilty of pushing their ideology on others.
 
And Conservative don't push their views on others. Find that Conservatives are just as guilty of pushing their ideology on others.
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Absolutely. But Big "C" Conservatives don't have the support structure in place to force said ideology onto the masses as a whole. That's why you see many of those agenda items never make it to the light of day or into practice. Compare that with the Liberal items which fill the United States Code, the case law, the laws of various states, the universities, etc.
 
join the club :p (although I'm not pro-war unless it's in a clear case of defense)


It's amazing because so many of the pro-gun advocates out there spout superlatives about freedom and liberty and self-determination yet they're the first ones to get all up in a tizzy about legislating morality.

At the same time many of the anti-gun activists are the first ones to point to freedom of speech and the 4th amendment yet dutifully ignore the second because "it was written 200 years ago!" :rolleyes:

Both sides are filled to the brim with hypocrisy. Welcome to American politics, would like an appetizer?
 
Dont worry about labels or parties.

Support the candidates who you agree with the most.

There will never be a perfect candidate, nobody can be all things to all people, (but not for lack of trying).
 
The Democratic party IMO has evolved to a socialist or communist philosophy. They want what I have for the good of the people.

Someday maybe there will be another choice, more moderate. Until then I guess it's up to you and me to fight the fight.
 
In a nutshell, politics seems to have descended to:
Democrats = Socialists (with the exception of a few "Goldwater/Bluedog Democrats")
Republicans = Fascists (with the exception of a few guys who aren't NeoCons)

Doesn't matter how you slice it, both parties are authoritarian statists. There's an agenda being forced from both angles, and no matter which party wins in Congress and the White House, it's always a little slice of Individual or States' Rights that dies with each additional bill.

We need a third party to represent State and Individual Rights and Interests... something that maybe only takes 20% of the House and Senate, but drops the Repub/Dem numbers down to 40% each so that they can't do anything without examining the impact to concerns of liberty and individual rights.

Government works best when it does nothing at all... the 1994 government shutdown was probably the most efficient it has ever been.
 
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