Physical Fitness is a MUST!
- Thread starter stonewall50
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Archer 9505
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Have We Taken a Turn?
The original post advocated the benefits of physical fitness as a reasonable part of any defensive training regimen. A point I agree with 100%. A true Renascence Man (or Woman) is someone that strives to be the best possible athlete, warrior, scholar, artist that they are capable of being. The people I admire are/ were exactly that; Jeff Cooper comes to mind. Cool, although I fall far short of the goal it is still a goal. Some of the later post in this thread seem to be in defense of sloth and obesity. Am I missing something? There are varying degrees of potential and capability and not all of us can be Ranger or SEAL fit; but I think we all should strive to be 100% of what we can be. How can that point be argued?
The original post advocated the benefits of physical fitness as a reasonable part of any defensive training regimen. A point I agree with 100%. A true Renascence Man (or Woman) is someone that strives to be the best possible athlete, warrior, scholar, artist that they are capable of being. The people I admire are/ were exactly that; Jeff Cooper comes to mind. Cool, although I fall far short of the goal it is still a goal. Some of the later post in this thread seem to be in defense of sloth and obesity. Am I missing something? There are varying degrees of potential and capability and not all of us can be Ranger or SEAL fit; but I think we all should strive to be 100% of what we can be. How can that point be argued?
It's funny.... my father-in-law is pushing 70. He's had multiple knee replacements, one of which did not go well and had him laid up with a deep bone infection for months. Yet he gets outside multiple times a week, shooting bows or black powder. He's not as physically active as he was 20 years ago, but he's as active as his older and injured body will allow him to be.
Some people are better at making excuses, than with making the most of what they have.
I'm happy he isn't one of those.
Some people are better at making excuses, than with making the most of what they have.
I'm happy he isn't one of those.
redstategunnut
New member
Like a poster above, I do not understand sloth and excuses.
I'll be 44 in less than a month. A few weeks ago, I made a decision to cut some weight and enter my first jiu jitsu tournament. I'm training six days a week for it.
In the last three weeks I'm down from 215# to 206#, and in three more weeks I'll enter that tournament below 200 pounds. I haven't been under 200 pounds in twenty years. I sleep better, think more clearly, and wake up with energy and enthusiasm for the day.
Right now, I'm stronger, lighter, and in better condition than I have been in two decades. With this increased level of fitness, can there be any doubt that I am more deadly than I was? No, there cannot be.
Get up and go do something for yourself. You won't be sorry.
I'll be 44 in less than a month. A few weeks ago, I made a decision to cut some weight and enter my first jiu jitsu tournament. I'm training six days a week for it.
In the last three weeks I'm down from 215# to 206#, and in three more weeks I'll enter that tournament below 200 pounds. I haven't been under 200 pounds in twenty years. I sleep better, think more clearly, and wake up with energy and enthusiasm for the day.
Right now, I'm stronger, lighter, and in better condition than I have been in two decades. With this increased level of fitness, can there be any doubt that I am more deadly than I was? No, there cannot be.
Get up and go do something for yourself. You won't be sorry.
Aguila Blanca
Staff
So I guess we senior citizens who aren't black belts in multiple martial arts disciplines and who don't run 12 miles every morning before breakfast should just stop considering carrying a gun for self defense. Is that the point of this discussion?
I respectfully bow out.
I respectfully bow out.
I can see it now, Ex Navy seal exercised his whole life, ran 20 miles a day expert on hand to hand combat and martial arts expert but now turned bad guy for crack. Was gonna rob 93 year old in wheel chair for money. 93 year old pulls out hawg leg from cushion of wheel chair and caps BG right between the eyes, End of Story!!!! haha Just dont let that hound dog mouth overload that bird dog a$$! You can be blessed with health and fitness and do all kind of amazing things but its awfull hard to outrun a bullet. And dont mess with the less fortunate, They'll just shoot ya.
Aguila Blanca, the point is not that you should not carry. The point is that there are other things you can do that improve your total defensive capability, and overall health.
The point is also that carrying a gun doesn't mean you can bring a gun into play.
My best friend (same age as me, within three weeks) and I ran some drills a little while back. Gave him a blue inert Glock, put the two of us at bad breath distance, and told him to draw on me.
He tried several times. He didn't succeed once. If I know how to jam somebody's draw, what makes you think a bad guy won't know how to do it?
I then taught my friend some counters. Is physical fitness a requirement? No... but it certainly helps quite a bit.
I have a cop friend who has had drug dealers draw on him several times; he hasn't drawn, as his first reaction was to stop their draw and disarm them. A couple or a few ended up with broken arms or wrists for their trouble. That friend also does a regular kettle-bell workout. He doesn't look that big, but his forearm strength is one major factor in why those BG's got hurt, quickly and decisively.
farmerboy, your 93 year old in the wheelchair would have a bit more trouble if your crackhead ex-seal approached from behind, or from a rear flank. Limited mobility leaves one much more vulnerable to flanking maneuvers.
So, physical fitness factors (strength and mobility) are very likely to impact total self-defense capability.
And, physical fitness helps stave off other maladies, and prolongs life - while letting people enjoy a better quality of life.
Again, some people just seem to want to make excuses. If you can't do a thing, that's ok. Just don't pretend the thing has no value, because you can't do it.
The point is also that carrying a gun doesn't mean you can bring a gun into play.
My best friend (same age as me, within three weeks) and I ran some drills a little while back. Gave him a blue inert Glock, put the two of us at bad breath distance, and told him to draw on me.
He tried several times. He didn't succeed once. If I know how to jam somebody's draw, what makes you think a bad guy won't know how to do it?
I then taught my friend some counters. Is physical fitness a requirement? No... but it certainly helps quite a bit.
I have a cop friend who has had drug dealers draw on him several times; he hasn't drawn, as his first reaction was to stop their draw and disarm them. A couple or a few ended up with broken arms or wrists for their trouble. That friend also does a regular kettle-bell workout. He doesn't look that big, but his forearm strength is one major factor in why those BG's got hurt, quickly and decisively.
farmerboy, your 93 year old in the wheelchair would have a bit more trouble if your crackhead ex-seal approached from behind, or from a rear flank. Limited mobility leaves one much more vulnerable to flanking maneuvers.
So, physical fitness factors (strength and mobility) are very likely to impact total self-defense capability.
And, physical fitness helps stave off other maladies, and prolongs life - while letting people enjoy a better quality of life.
Again, some people just seem to want to make excuses. If you can't do a thing, that's ok. Just don't pretend the thing has no value, because you can't do it.
warrior poet
New member
When I was a young boy my father and great grandfather went hunting. My dad came back sore, tired, and without success- frankly, he was worn out. My great grandfather had gotten a deer, field dressed and drug it back, and he was by no means tired. He was 86 at the time and he raced SCCA events until he was 92. He walked everyday, worked in his little orchard (his retirement project) and made homemade applesause, apple vinegar, pear sauce, et cetera. He was active and enjoyed his life, finally going peacefully one night.
I was doing curls with 37lbs dumbells but they were concrete weights, and the plastic had cracked and was leaking dust.. I'd already used Gorrilla glue to seal the cracks, and then later I put duct tape over the newer cracks. it was a mess, so I thought it was time to dispose of the concrete weights.
I only had weight in 10lb increments in iron weights - itlbs had gotten fairly easy anyway, so I just decided yto move up to 40lbs. I had no problem with my arms, curling that weight, but last night I strained a stomach muscle on my left side curling the 40lbs.
I have had 5 hernia operations in my life so far, so, there are lim\its I run up against.
I never thought a measley increase of 3 lbs of weight would make a difference, but to my stomach muscles it obviously did...
I only had weight in 10lb increments in iron weights - itlbs had gotten fairly easy anyway, so I just decided yto move up to 40lbs. I had no problem with my arms, curling that weight, but last night I strained a stomach muscle on my left side curling the 40lbs.
I have had 5 hernia operations in my life so far, so, there are lim\its I run up against.
I never thought a measley increase of 3 lbs of weight would make a difference, but to my stomach muscles it obviously did...
A great question by the OP ... I'm 66, weigh only about 10 pounds more than I did in college and try to stay active ... I don't have arthritis, but my back ain't what it used to be, which limits the kind of training I can tolerate, and that includes martial arts ... I try to practice around my back, using free weights to maintain muscle tone and a home treadmill to keep my ticker ticking ... here's one thing I do religiously -- grip strengthening ... I use a "heavy" tension Gripmaster and it has made a huge difference in my ability to get my gun on target and to deal with recoil in getting it back on target, as well as the amount of time I can spend shooting at the range ... strong hands and wrists are the start of repeat accuracy for me; if you can make the first shot but can't keep the gun on target, you could be in trouble ...
Pretty much dead on.
Think of it like being a Boy Scout and Be as Prepared as YOU can be.
Will being fit help your survival chances? Heck Yeah!
Or think of it in Zombie Apocalypse terms...the kid from "Zombieland" had it right...Rule #1 - Cardio, Cardio, Cardio...
Whether you are outrunning Zombies, gang members, dogs, muggers, rapists...etc...if you can outrun 'em...yer safe.
Rule #2 - Double Tap, Double Tap, Double Tap...self explainitory...lol
Zombieland Rules work on bad guys too...
In the case of Martial Arts...its dang sure better than NOT being trained.
Combine Martial Arts with higher-than-normal human strength, and you REALLY have things working to your advantage.
Add to that medical knowledge of the human body and how to use an attacker's own body against themselves,
or totally incapacitate them with or without killing them...that's pretty darn good stuff to know.
The more you know, the stronger you are, the higher amount of possibilities you have of escaping a truly bad situation with your life.
That's a bottom line that anyone should be able to get behind.
And its also been scientifically proven, that even if you are an old geezer, you will STILL benefit from exercise.
The less excess weight you carry, means you can move faster with less effort...
The more muscle you have, the less effort you expend to move things...
Rant Portion follows...
Ever wonder why some folks complain about recoil from a .40 short & wimpy?? PULEAZE!
Snappy my great auntie's fanny!! Feels about like a Grendel P-30 to me...that's a .22 WMR in case some of y'all didn't know.
The only folks that think .40 & 9mm are too much recoil and they need a .380 need to get their fat butts to the GYM!
The only reason the FBI had to downgrade the 10mm to the .40 Short & Wimpy is because of WEAKLINGS!!
If liberals hadn't made 'em take wimps & weaklings into gov't service, they'd still be using 10mm.
Hello! Its Law Enforcement! If you gotta hire someone to carry a gun & whooparse, get the strongest humans you can find!!
Mr. 5'9 with a 125# max benchpress ain't gonna cut it!! Go get Ms. Amazon 6'3 who can benchpress half a VW bug!
This also extended to my Army life...nothing I hated worse than some pogey-bait bastich falling out on a short march.
I mean, DANG, if you couldn't at least walk 20 miles before you joined up, you coulda picked the freekin Air Force!!
Boot Camp shoulda weeded out the weak, but they've de-nutted most of the boot camps!!
Drill Sgt's can't even CUSS a recruit anymore? WTH??
Just makes you want to round up all the liberals and ship them to China...or maybe the moon...
The less excess weight you carry, means you can move faster with less effort...
The more muscle you have, the less effort you expend to move things...
Rant Portion follows...
Ever wonder why some folks complain about recoil from a .40 short & wimpy?? PULEAZE!
Snappy my great auntie's fanny!! Feels about like a Grendel P-30 to me...that's a .22 WMR in case some of y'all didn't know.
The only folks that think .40 & 9mm are too much recoil and they need a .380 need to get their fat butts to the GYM!
The only reason the FBI had to downgrade the 10mm to the .40 Short & Wimpy is because of WEAKLINGS!!
If liberals hadn't made 'em take wimps & weaklings into gov't service, they'd still be using 10mm.
Hello! Its Law Enforcement! If you gotta hire someone to carry a gun & whooparse, get the strongest humans you can find!!
Mr. 5'9 with a 125# max benchpress ain't gonna cut it!! Go get Ms. Amazon 6'3 who can benchpress half a VW bug!
This also extended to my Army life...nothing I hated worse than some pogey-bait bastich falling out on a short march.
I mean, DANG, if you couldn't at least walk 20 miles before you joined up, you coulda picked the freekin Air Force!!
Boot Camp shoulda weeded out the weak, but they've de-nutted most of the boot camps!!
Drill Sgt's can't even CUSS a recruit anymore? WTH??
Just makes you want to round up all the liberals and ship them to China...or maybe the moon...
CastleBravo
New member
You can't be something you're not, especially if that would require time travel. 
But anyone can make the most of what they've got. Plus you'll probably live longer and feel better doing it.
But anyone can make the most of what they've got. Plus you'll probably live longer and feel better doing it.
Shrek, you're getting into the area of Bona Fide Occupational Qualification -BFOQ under Tile VII, Civil Rights Act of 1964.
Unfortunately, neither the Army nor the FBI did a good job of creating BFOQs as it pertained to physical ability. Of course, they generally were not in the business of creating these defensible HR documents, but the fact is they didn't create them. So there are people in the Army who are physically incapable of physically doing everything they have to do.
A road march is bad enough carrying your own gear, but then you have to pass around the radio, the water, the M60 and the M60 ammo. If you have a few people who can't carry any of that stuff - the rotation get shorter so you basically hand off the water can and 1 click later you're lugging the M60. I was on a road march as part of PLDC, it was a 10 person class and we had 4 soldiers who couldn't carry any of that stuff. Toward the end they couldn't even carry their own pack - and they were the small 30lb rucks - not even the big ones. So in addition to not being able to carry the stuff that rotated around - they weren't even carrying their own rucks!
I always thought the Army should have had absolute physical tasks that you had to preform - or you couldn't get in. If it were a BFOQ it would have had to be something that soldiers had to do as part of their job. I always thought a good BFOQ would have been to carry the equivilant weight of the average soldier with a FCL, one kilometer in 7 minutes. That's like a brisk walk and granted , you're carrying a person on your shoulders, but I always thought that would weed out people who were just not physically capable of doing a lot of things. And it could be argued that a common required task of a soldier is to be able to take a wounded fellow soldier out of a fire zone.
After marching with this people I realized that there was no way I could ever count on them to move me if I got injured and couldn't walk. I can just hear it now "Wait here - I'll go get help!" Oh jeeez...
The FBI might have had a chance to make qualifying with the 10mm a BFOQ after the FBI shootout... it would have been a battle with the ACLU no doubt because of the disparate impact it would have on females, but - they may have had a good case to show that it was a BFOQ which trumps Disparate Impact.
Of course the FBI would have lost quite a few very good agents that were intelligent and competent investigators that just weren't good with qualifying with that powerful round.
As for my physical fitness today -
Today I do nothing.
I am going to the range tomorrow and I don't want the shakes or any muscle tremors to mess up my scores.
Unfortunately, neither the Army nor the FBI did a good job of creating BFOQs as it pertained to physical ability. Of course, they generally were not in the business of creating these defensible HR documents, but the fact is they didn't create them. So there are people in the Army who are physically incapable of physically doing everything they have to do.
A road march is bad enough carrying your own gear, but then you have to pass around the radio, the water, the M60 and the M60 ammo. If you have a few people who can't carry any of that stuff - the rotation get shorter so you basically hand off the water can and 1 click later you're lugging the M60. I was on a road march as part of PLDC, it was a 10 person class and we had 4 soldiers who couldn't carry any of that stuff. Toward the end they couldn't even carry their own pack - and they were the small 30lb rucks - not even the big ones. So in addition to not being able to carry the stuff that rotated around - they weren't even carrying their own rucks!
I always thought the Army should have had absolute physical tasks that you had to preform - or you couldn't get in. If it were a BFOQ it would have had to be something that soldiers had to do as part of their job. I always thought a good BFOQ would have been to carry the equivilant weight of the average soldier with a FCL, one kilometer in 7 minutes. That's like a brisk walk and granted , you're carrying a person on your shoulders, but I always thought that would weed out people who were just not physically capable of doing a lot of things. And it could be argued that a common required task of a soldier is to be able to take a wounded fellow soldier out of a fire zone.
After marching with this people I realized that there was no way I could ever count on them to move me if I got injured and couldn't walk. I can just hear it now "Wait here - I'll go get help!" Oh jeeez...
The FBI might have had a chance to make qualifying with the 10mm a BFOQ after the FBI shootout... it would have been a battle with the ACLU no doubt because of the disparate impact it would have on females, but - they may have had a good case to show that it was a BFOQ which trumps Disparate Impact.
Of course the FBI would have lost quite a few very good agents that were intelligent and competent investigators that just weren't good with qualifying with that powerful round.
As for my physical fitness today -
Today I do nothing.
I am going to the range tomorrow and I don't want the shakes or any muscle tremors to mess up my scores.
I bent over to get a pan from a lower shelf and my back started spasming.
Now it feels like I have a strained back muscle. I'm not going to be lifting weights until my back feels better.
I didn't even pick up the pan, my back freaked out half way down.
This never happened to me when I was in my 20s or 30s.
Now it feels like I have a strained back muscle. I'm not going to be lifting weights until my back feels better.
I didn't even pick up the pan, my back freaked out half way down.
This never happened to me when I was in my 20s or 30s.
Well, according to a number of training sources, once a man hits his 40's, training emphasis should be on flexibility and range of motion. Resistance training is still good, unless one wants to lose both muscle and bone mass, but stretching, yoga, tai chi, etc have more benefit.
(Note: I'm 43, and have shifted from a weight-lifting focus to more bodyweight, calisthenic, and yoga type workouts - but I still lift. I just don't go for the heavy weights any more, but instead go more for reps at moderate weights.)
(Note: I'm 43, and have shifted from a weight-lifting focus to more bodyweight, calisthenic, and yoga type workouts - but I still lift. I just don't go for the heavy weights any more, but instead go more for reps at moderate weights.)