No place is immune to the forces of nature...that's for sure. But to build in an area where you know that hurricanes are going to hit relatively often defies logic. It's just like these people who build their multi-million dollar houses on the edge of cliffs in California only to have it crash into the sea in an El Nino year.
Pathetic: Where is our government?
- Thread starter Ptown Beretta
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Mike Irwin
Staff
"I defy any of you to find me one place in the world where humans live that is immune from the forces of nature."
Washington, DC.
The most unnatural place on the face of the earth.
Washington, DC.
The most unnatural place on the face of the earth.
BerettaCougar
New member
Lets goto NO and help the national guard... this is a calling for minute men!!!
Im serious i want to go!!! but gas is too expensive....
Im serious i want to go!!! but gas is too expensive....
+1 gc70
The last thing we want is the Federal government taking over for the states.
The States must invite the feds and national guard from other states to come into their territory.
National Guardsmen are day to day citizens and cannot swim any better than their neighbors.
Getting the local guard to muster up is nigh unto impossible in the middle of the disaster.
There are not enough guardsmen, helicopters, busses and water trucks etc., to bring water from the undamaged states, in large enough quantities, or fast enough, to slake the thirst of several million people across several damaged states.
Stop whining about where your Uncle Sam is... he's paying for the clean up, and you can bet he's doing whatever else can be done to help... wouldn't you? Wouldn't almost anybody?
Why are you assuming that the gov'mint should save your ass... in the end YOU are responsible for your own ass, and all you have the right to expect from the gov'mint is financial assistance and whatever else can be done with the resources available.
There are millions of people with clothing and money and volunteers and homes wanting very much to help... the conditions are such that even the Red Cross, and every other support group, cannot overcome.
This disaster is simply too damn big!
My state has already passed a bill to take in a minimum of a thousand families and feed and clothe them until the recovery is made. It really gripes me to hear all the ungrateful left wing welfare staters complaining that not enough is being done or jackass remarks like,
"If it was a predominantly white populace that was in distress there would be a lot more done a lot faster... Bull-oney!!
Stay in your easy chair, watch the sensationalizing news media and proagandizers on your TV and bitch, if you must, to someone else!
The last thing we want is the Federal government taking over for the states.
The States must invite the feds and national guard from other states to come into their territory.
National Guardsmen are day to day citizens and cannot swim any better than their neighbors.
Getting the local guard to muster up is nigh unto impossible in the middle of the disaster.
There are not enough guardsmen, helicopters, busses and water trucks etc., to bring water from the undamaged states, in large enough quantities, or fast enough, to slake the thirst of several million people across several damaged states.
Stop whining about where your Uncle Sam is... he's paying for the clean up, and you can bet he's doing whatever else can be done to help... wouldn't you? Wouldn't almost anybody?
Why are you assuming that the gov'mint should save your ass... in the end YOU are responsible for your own ass, and all you have the right to expect from the gov'mint is financial assistance and whatever else can be done with the resources available.
There are millions of people with clothing and money and volunteers and homes wanting very much to help... the conditions are such that even the Red Cross, and every other support group, cannot overcome.
This disaster is simply too damn big!
My state has already passed a bill to take in a minimum of a thousand families and feed and clothe them until the recovery is made. It really gripes me to hear all the ungrateful left wing welfare staters complaining that not enough is being done or jackass remarks like,
"If it was a predominantly white populace that was in distress there would be a lot more done a lot faster... Bull-oney!!
Stay in your easy chair, watch the sensationalizing news media and proagandizers on your TV and bitch, if you must, to someone else!
What bothers me is seeing dozens and dozens of young, able bodied people on the side of the road crying for help when they're fully capable of saving themselves. The idiots shooting at the rescue helicopters don't deserve to be rescued. I don't care what your situation is, no one has the right to put the lives of rescue workers at risk as well as the lives they're likely saving by transporting them to a hospital.
This is a great tragedy but I'm starting to hope Darwinism takes its' toll. The strongest and smartest will survive. I feel no sympathy whatsoever for any family that chose to stay despite the warning of a category five hurricane. I feel for the families and the victims but anyone that can save themselves should do so instead of waiting for that big government hand to save them.
This is a great tragedy but I'm starting to hope Darwinism takes its' toll. The strongest and smartest will survive. I feel no sympathy whatsoever for any family that chose to stay despite the warning of a category five hurricane. I feel for the families and the victims but anyone that can save themselves should do so instead of waiting for that big government hand to save them.
Rich Lucibella
Staff
Redworm-
I suspect you've never lived thru a hurricane evacuation. They had barely 24 hours notice (this thing came out of no where after it passed over us in S. FL). Gas disappears immediately (for those who even own vehicles). Additionally, many people live in poverty or from pay check to pay check in this nation. Get out? For them, the question is not "when" but "how"? Did anyone see a caravan of buses available the day BEFORE the storm? Did we open the railroads to all takers?
Looting and armed gangs? Welcome to America's Inner Cities.....it's been that way for decades. With the resources we make available to the State and Federal government, there isn't a single agency that should be shocked by this; and NONE of them should have been unprepared.
Rich
I suspect you've never lived thru a hurricane evacuation. They had barely 24 hours notice (this thing came out of no where after it passed over us in S. FL). Gas disappears immediately (for those who even own vehicles). Additionally, many people live in poverty or from pay check to pay check in this nation. Get out? For them, the question is not "when" but "how"? Did anyone see a caravan of buses available the day BEFORE the storm? Did we open the railroads to all takers?
Looting and armed gangs? Welcome to America's Inner Cities.....it's been that way for decades. With the resources we make available to the State and Federal government, there isn't a single agency that should be shocked by this; and NONE of them should have been unprepared.
Help themselves? How? Wade thru 12 miles of toxic waste to get to high ground? The only way an able bodied man can "help himself" in a war zone is to take what he needs from others....IOW, by looting and force. Unless needs are met there, that is simply going to spiral.
Rich
You miss my point. First of all I have lived through a voluntary hurricane evacuation when I lived in St Petersburg. I chose to stay because it was a light 'cane (in fact I think by the time it hit land it might've been downgraded to a tropical storm). I know that evacuations are not the easiest thing in the world and I'm not blaming anyone who tried to get out.
But there are certainly people in Nawlins that decided to stay, assuming that surviving Ivan gave them the ability to survive this. I have seen, heard, and read multiple interviews on TV, radio, and in online newspaper articles of people saying the chose to stay. It's them I don't feel sorry for. You don't stay for a Category 5 hurricane when you live in a city that's under sea level and protected by levees half a century too old.
They had more than 24 hours of notice; I was hearing about the storm days before it hit. Storms do not come out of nowhere, there were plenty of signs that it was going to hit and that it was going to hit hard. Now I understand that evacuating masses of people is difficult but again, my lack of sympathy is for those that chose to stay.
Those people that I've seen sitting on the side of the road don't have to wade through anything. The water is not impassable and it's not going to kill them. I feel no sympathy for any able bodied person sitting on the sidewalk waiting for a damn helicopter when they're capable of walking to the nearest shelter.
What's even worse is the idiots shooting at the rescuers to get attention. Those people don't deserve rescue. I hate to say it but Darwinism is going to play a major factor here. The smart ones left town when they knew they could and the strong ones will survive. If a person doesn't have the basic survival skills to cope with a situation like this then I'm not going to feel bad about it.
What bothers me the most is that a town full of so much history is gone. Material things are just that, things. They're meaningless in of themselves but many of those old buildings had a lot of history. But it just goes to show that humanity will never beat nature. After all the damage we've done to earth people refuse to accept the fact that if mother nature wants us gone, we can't do a damn thing about it.
But there are certainly people in Nawlins that decided to stay, assuming that surviving Ivan gave them the ability to survive this. I have seen, heard, and read multiple interviews on TV, radio, and in online newspaper articles of people saying the chose to stay. It's them I don't feel sorry for. You don't stay for a Category 5 hurricane when you live in a city that's under sea level and protected by levees half a century too old.
They had more than 24 hours of notice; I was hearing about the storm days before it hit. Storms do not come out of nowhere, there were plenty of signs that it was going to hit and that it was going to hit hard. Now I understand that evacuating masses of people is difficult but again, my lack of sympathy is for those that chose to stay.
Those people that I've seen sitting on the side of the road don't have to wade through anything. The water is not impassable and it's not going to kill them. I feel no sympathy for any able bodied person sitting on the sidewalk waiting for a damn helicopter when they're capable of walking to the nearest shelter.
What's even worse is the idiots shooting at the rescuers to get attention. Those people don't deserve rescue. I hate to say it but Darwinism is going to play a major factor here. The smart ones left town when they knew they could and the strong ones will survive. If a person doesn't have the basic survival skills to cope with a situation like this then I'm not going to feel bad about it.
What bothers me the most is that a town full of so much history is gone. Material things are just that, things. They're meaningless in of themselves but many of those old buildings had a lot of history. But it just goes to show that humanity will never beat nature. After all the damage we've done to earth people refuse to accept the fact that if mother nature wants us gone, we can't do a damn thing about it.
Rich Lucibella
Staff
Redworm-
Two simple observations. Rhetorical questions, really. They require no reply.
1) How do you separate those who "chose to stay" from those who could not get out?
2) For those "capable of walking to the nearest shelter", NOBODY is telling them where that is! Just look at what we're doing to those unfortunate enough to have believed the SuperDome would be "shelter". They're now dumping 'em in a PARKING LOT 300 miles away!
Rich
Two simple observations. Rhetorical questions, really. They require no reply.
1) How do you separate those who "chose to stay" from those who could not get out?
2) For those "capable of walking to the nearest shelter", NOBODY is telling them where that is! Just look at what we're doing to those unfortunate enough to have believed the SuperDome would be "shelter". They're now dumping 'em in a PARKING LOT 300 miles away!
Rich
I seperate them by what they've said in interviews? People have stated that they chose to stay. I'm not harping on anyone who couldn't get out that wanted to, but some people made the choice to do so. On CNN, on the local news radio station, and in a couple of articles I've read on the whole issue...people have said they decided to stay and try to wait out the storm.
I hate to sound mean or anything but anyone that can get out now should. I know it's hard when you don't have a place to go and if they don't know where the nearest shelter is it's certainly going to be hard. But staying in one spot next to the pile of rubble that was once your home isn't going to help.
It's a terrible disaster but too often I hear about people asking for help when instead they could be helping other survivors who are really in need.
People have stated that they chose to stay. I'm not harping on anyone who couldn't get out that wanted to, but some people made the choice to do so. On CNN, on the local news radio station, and in a couple of articles I've read on the whole issue...people have said they decided to stay and try to wait out the storm. I hate to sound mean or anything but anyone that can get out now should. I know it's hard when you don't have a place to go and if they don't know where the nearest shelter is it's certainly going to be hard. But staying in one spot next to the pile of rubble that was once your home isn't going to help.
It's a terrible disaster but too often I hear about people asking for help when instead they could be helping other survivors who are really in need.
Denny Hansen
Staff Emeritus
It may be the most ruthless instead of the smartest. Be careful what you wish for...
Denny
The Bush Administration chose to forgo 150 million in flood projects in New Orleans...
FEMA practiced for this last year
Two reporters in the Times Picayune predicted this two years ago.....
not like they did not have any warning....
shouldnt the Leader and the administration be due some criticism?
Many people had no money nor any transportation to leave. When folks dont have food and water you can bet survival instintcs will kick in.
As far as this not being covered by the Constitution break your copy out
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
FEMA practiced for this last year
Two reporters in the Times Picayune predicted this two years ago.....
not like they did not have any warning....
shouldnt the Leader and the administration be due some criticism?
Many people had no money nor any transportation to leave. When folks dont have food and water you can bet survival instintcs will kick in.
As far as this not being covered by the Constitution break your copy out
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Seems like Congress had a hand in that, as administrations and Congress has done for years where NO was concerned.
And the projects proposed would have meant nothing to this crisis. The biggest and best ideas thrown around would not have been completed in time to make one iota of difference.
Here's a simple fact: if you live under the sea, you're going to get wet eventually if Murphy decides "today is your day to get screwed." No amount of money will change that fact. NO had flooding problems when there were drizzels, let alone hurricanes.
As for FEMA practicing this, our military practices time and time again. They still blow operations because practice and the real world are absolutely different things. I've gone through an emergency response drill. Everything is scripted, everybody knows their roles. Nobody is under real pressure, and nobody is screaming in your ear to get something done NOW!
"Where is our government?"
What should it be doing? I'm fine with Marines doing search and rescue, but even if it were a federal problem, which it's not, looting in a flooded area is not something any executive-branch agency is set up to deal with.. The people were warned that there would be beaucoup flooding, and by Sunday night that was clear. What wasn't certain was whether New Orleans would be turned into a toxic swamp, and it got lucky on that count.
Some people couldn't get out, but they still chose to live in New Orleans at some point. Is there any city more in danger of flooding that New Orleans? Even Miami is above sea level, or at least almost all developed areas are... flooding recedes without human intervention.
Any sympathy I might have in spite of all that vanishes when I consider that the worst-case scenario involving flooding and toxic sludge was mentioned during the 2004 hurricane season, yet nothing was done in the intervening year to prevent this catastrophy. People did not prepare; the city did not reinforce or heighten levees.
Maybe some of the looters and armed bandits did prepare for this. That doesn't excuse their anti-social behavior, but as far as evolution is concerned they're still a rung above all the floating bodies.
What should it be doing? I'm fine with Marines doing search and rescue, but even if it were a federal problem, which it's not, looting in a flooded area is not something any executive-branch agency is set up to deal with.. The people were warned that there would be beaucoup flooding, and by Sunday night that was clear. What wasn't certain was whether New Orleans would be turned into a toxic swamp, and it got lucky on that count.
Some people couldn't get out, but they still chose to live in New Orleans at some point. Is there any city more in danger of flooding that New Orleans? Even Miami is above sea level, or at least almost all developed areas are... flooding recedes without human intervention.
We can do a lot about it. The people who stayed voluntarily or could not leave could have done something about it if they had started planning earlier, or if they had changed their philosophy. The buildings couldn't all be saved, but the people all could have saved themselves.
Any sympathy I might have in spite of all that vanishes when I consider that the worst-case scenario involving flooding and toxic sludge was mentioned during the 2004 hurricane season, yet nothing was done in the intervening year to prevent this catastrophy. People did not prepare; the city did not reinforce or heighten levees.
Maybe some of the looters and armed bandits did prepare for this. That doesn't excuse their anti-social behavior, but as far as evolution is concerned they're still a rung above all the floating bodies.
kennybs plbg
New member
It's a goverment problem, but it's the State thats not showing up with and comming through. The federal goverment has to assist the State, it's not the other way around.
Funny when ever the federal goverment tries to overstep themselves and implement something on a State all heck breaks loose.
kenny b
Funny when ever the federal goverment tries to overstep themselves and implement something on a State all heck breaks loose.
kenny b
How many of the state's National Guard is in Iraq?
The Federal governments job is to provide for the defense and welfare of its citizens regardless of what state they lived in. every citizen regardless of state pays federal taxes.
to simply state this is a state problem is silly. This natural disaster will effect all of America.
When I was growing up neighbors helped neighbors and didnt bitch and whine about it.
The Federal governments job is to provide for the defense and welfare of its citizens regardless of what state they lived in. every citizen regardless of state pays federal taxes.
to simply state this is a state problem is silly. This natural disaster will effect all of America.
When I was growing up neighbors helped neighbors and didnt bitch and whine about it.
kennybs plbg
New member
"to simply state this is a state problem is silly"
Is that what I said? I think not.
kenny b
Is that what I said? I think not.
kenny b
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