Parent Arrested for Carrying Licensed Gun Into School

DocH

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Parent arrested for gun incident

Story Created: 08/29/2000 18:16:59


By KEVIN FLOWERS

Staff writer


An Erie man was arrested after walking into Strong Vincent High School with a loaded semiautomatic handgun Tuesday afternoon. The defendant later said that he had done so before "and no one said nothing to me.''

Tuesday evening, Erie police Det. Kenneth Merchant charged Ronald John Neiswonger, 52, 536 W. 19th St., second floor, with one count of carrying a firearm on school property, a first-degree misdemeanor.

Police claim Neiswonger walked into Strong Vincent, 1330 W. Eighth St., shortly before the final school bell Tuesday and went to the school's office wearing his licensed 9mm semiautomatic handgun in a shoulder holster. Strong Vincent students are dismissed each day at 3 p.m., acting school Principal Janet Woods said.

Police said a permit Neiswonger got from the Erie County Sheriff's Department allows him to carry a concealed weapon. Neiswonger also brought two additional clips of ammunition with him into the school on Tuesday, police said.

Police and school officials said no one was hurt or threatened. Authorities also do not believe Neiswonger went to the school to harm anyone, Erie police Lt. James Skindell said.

Neiswonger talked to reporters after being arraigned before District Justice John Vendetti Tuesday. He said that he went to Strong Vincent Tuesday to talk to someone about his 15-year-old son, an 8th grader at the school. Neiswonger said he had been told the boy was not in school Tuesday.

Neiswonger also said he took the gun with him to Strong Vincent one day last year, again to talk to someone about his child. "But nothing happened then,'' Neiswonger said. " I told them I had a permit to carry it ... and no one said nothing to me.''

Even someone with a concealed weapon permit is not allowed to bring a handgun onto school grounds in Pennsylvania, according to police and Erie Schools Superintendent James Barker. And the Erie School District has a well-publicized "zero tolerance'' policy on weapons that pertains to both students and adults, Barker said.

"The rule is very simple. There is zero tolerance,'' Barker said while standing outside Strong Vincent Tuesday afternoon. "Only those who are authorized, like state and local police and the FBI, are allowed to (carry weapons on school property).

"There is absolutely no circumstance when a parent should bring any type of a weapon onto school property,'' Barker continued. "It will not be tolerated.''

Barker said a "concerned citizen'' who lives near Strong Vincent called police about Neiswonger. That person saw Neiswonger get out of his car and noticed he was wearing the handgun, Barker said.

After police were notified, uniformed officers made it to the school within minutes, Barker said. There were also off-duty Erie police officers working as security at Strong Vincent, said Jim Perfetto, the school district's chief security officer.

Neiswonger was arrested in the school's office. One Strong Vincent teacher said "he didn't even have time to do anything ... because the police were right there.''

Merchant said Neiswonger told police he asked to talk to Woods, the principal. "But he never got a chance to,'' Merchant said.

Police did not draw their weapons on Neiswonger in the office, Merchant said.

"We did have our hands on our guns. You have to remember there's people in that office at that time who had no idea why we were there, Merchant said.

"When he saw us he just put his hands up,'' Merchant said. Officers then took Neiswonger's gun.

Barker said that Neiswonger was taken into custody within five minutes. As a precaution, school officials delayed dismissal of Strong Vincent's students.

"At no time did this individual brandish, threaten or show the weapon,'' Barker said.

Police said Neiswonger purchased his 9mm semiautomatic handgun in 1996 and obtained the permit some time after that.

Erie County Sheriff Bob Merski confirmed that Neiswonger has a valid gun permit, one of 10,000 on the books in Erie County. Statewide, about 110,000 concealed weapons permits are currently valid, Merski said.

Merski would not comment on how long Neiswonger has had the permit. "That's confidential information,'' Merski said.

Love said Neiswonger told police he applied for the permit for protection, claiming that he and others in his family had been threatened in the past. Neiswonger did not elaborate to police about who made those threats, Love said.

Most people who apply for such permits are looking for personal protection, Merski said. And if an applicant does not have a criminal record, a concealed weapons permit is not hard to get.

"It's a standard application that is printed up by the Pennsylvania State Police,'' Merski said.

Merski said most permits are issued to "very law-abiding citizens. I think that of all the gun permits currently issued to people in the state, only 933 were revoked, for whatever reasons, in 1999,'' Merski said.

At his arraignment Tuesday evening, Neiswonger said he was unemployed. "I'm on disability,'' Neiswonger told Vendetti.

Vendetti set bail at 10 percent of $5,000. Neiswonger was released after posting $500.

Copyright 2000, Times Publishing Company
[/quote]

Well, besides being a moron, did this guy really break any laws? Isn't there a phrase in the law about "firearms possession for other lawful purposes" or somesuch?

There were other articles about this in the paper today. The Erie papers are very antigun, and the editors really got a case of the vapors over this. Luckily, Sheriff Merski is a strong RKBA supporter, from what I've heard.
 
Moron is right. He sounds like a "cowboy" wanting to "show off" with his gun in plain view in a holster just like Dirty Harry uses.

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Gunslinger

I was promised a Shortycicle and I want a Shortycicle!
 
If PA law says no carry in schools, no carry in schools. A permit holder is required to know the law about where they may and may not carry. In Florida, for example, you may not carry at sporting events (except shooting sports). If you don't know that, and are caught with CCW at a Magic game, you can be written up and you will lose your permit.
 
What a brain dead moron. If I understand this correctly,He was open carry in a shoulder holster? Anyone with half a brain knows that in todays society one does not carry a gun into or onto school property, unless you are LEO.....DUH
I have to also say the newspaper took every opportiunity to make this guy sound EVIL...
He even bought two additional magazines with him.
Stupid, Stupid, Stupid :rolleyes:

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We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
First of all, I agree that this guy is a moron for carrying in a school against the law.

Secondly, I can't seem to find the sentence that states he had a shoulder rig out in an open carry fashion. The guy might have had a jacket on and his jacket flops open as he gets out of his car, thus allowing Mr. Concerned Citizen to spot the carry rig. Maybe the reporter just "forgot" to mention the jacket?

If it was open carry, this guy is a TOTAL IDIOT.

[This message has been edited by jcoyoung (edited August 30, 2000).]
 
It first sounded like he was carrying open until you read on.

"Neiswonger told police he applied for the permit for protection, claiming that he and others in his family had been threatened in the past"...maybe it was by High School kids, and therefore he needed protection in the school.
 
This is a victimless "crime" where the charges should've been reduced to an infraction IMO. It's a well known fact that schools aren't a safe haven anymore, lets not forget what happened in AR 2 days ago, and Jonesboro, and Columbine, and... well u got the point. But this doesn't mean an individual should parade a semi automatic with 2 full clips.
I'm siding with the state of PA on this, not because this guy broke the "law", but cuz of stupidity. Sadly I do hope he retains his permit and gets an ankle holster and a snubnose to go with it for concealment.
 
The radio reports this morning mentioned that the guy was wearing "a large black overcoat" that was inappropriate for the weather. The school superintendent was quoted as saying that "his mode of dress (i.e. the coat) itself would have prompted a search". I think they might've been on a little thin ice with that, absent the call from the "concerned citizen."
 
I'll have to look up the PA laws, but I don't think there is a specific state prohibition on carry in schools. The radio said he would be arraigned on "Federal misdemeanor charges", which leads me to think there are no specific state laws under which he could be charged.
 
Yep - Enforce the laws on the books! Right?

Thanks NRA!

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Thane (NRA GOA JPFO SAF CAN)
MD C.A.N.OP
tbellomo@home.com
http://homes.acmecity.com/thematrix/digital/237/cansite/can.html
www.members.home.net/tbellomo/tbellomo/index.htm
"As nightfall does not come at once, neither does oppression.
In both instances there is a twilight when everything remains
seemingly unchanged. And it is in such twilight that we all
must be most aware of change in the air - however slight -
lest we become unwitting victims of the darkness."
--Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas
 
In Arkansas the law is quite plain...you CANNOT carry in a school or on school grounds.

Being an Arkansas CCW Instructor myself, I make it quite plain to the students that they absolutley cannot carry in school. We have the Prosecuting Attorney and the Local Sherrif adress the class about the law and where they can carry and where they cannot.

IT seems to me that if the man was unnaware that he could not carry in school and it is against the law, his CCW instructors were not hitting that subject hard enough.
Personally I would consider it a failure if one of my students was busted for breaking the law unintentionally as it would be a lack of communication on my part.

Being an irresponsible idiot is one thing. An uniformed ,unaware citizen is another. :(
 
It's beginning to sound like there is more to this than we have been told so far -- I don't know on which side.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DocH:
The radio said he would be arraigned on "Federal misdemeanor charges", which leads me to think there are no specific state laws under which he could be charged.[/quote]

That'll be interesting. The Supreme Court threw out the original federal law on carrying on&near schools. Congress passed the same law again shortly afterwards. Can't wait to watch them throw it out a second time.


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ACHTUNG! ALLES LOOKENSPEEPERS!

Das Internet is nicht fuer gefingerclicken und giffengrabben. Ist easy droppenpacket der routers und overloaden der backbone mit der spammen und der me-tooen. Ist nicht fuer gewerken bei das dumpkopfen. Das mausklicken sichtseeren keepen das bandwit-spewin hans in das pockets muss; relaxen und watchen das cursorblinken.
 
Some people do what they want to do reguardless if they were taught correctly, or not. Part of the responsability is to know/remember the rules! Not just give me my permit, and I'm free to do what I want. I'm sure there are a lot of CCW carriers that are idiots, or have big ego's, because they can carry. These are noticed more than the much higher percentage of holders that are responsible. Uless you screw up the media, and politicians don't care. Hey, look at how many people have drivers licenses, but can't drive worth a d@mn.
 
I am so tired of "zero tolerence" on things. It's just a way out for the ones in charge not to have to make decisions. In Sav GA zero tolerance rules got an Eagle scout suspended, driving licence supspended, and a bunch of other crap cause he had a rusty ax and swiss army knife left over from a scout meeting. An anonomous informant told someone about the objects, which were locked in a trunk.
 
You guys that are calling this man a moron based on this article are missing the point.

This man is lawfully excercising his constitutional right to keep and bear arms, school or NOT, and you all are crucifying him.

Shame on you! Because you all whine about "uncontitutional this!" and "uncontitutional that!" It's just words. Walk the walk and be men of character.

If you are not willing to practice civil disobedience, then SHUT THE HECK UP! and let others do it for you until you can do it for yourself.

Don't hang ANYONE out to dry who's doing something, ignorantly or not, to practice what is a natural right!

Someone told me that Benjamin Franklin said, "The best way to get rid of bad law is to MAKE them enforce it."

Man this really pisses me off... :mad:

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John/az
"When freedom is at stake, your silence is not golden, it's yellow..." RKBA!

See The Legacy of Gun Control film at: www.cphv.com

Do it for the children...

[This message has been edited by John/az2 (edited August 30, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DocH:
The radio reports this morning mentioned that the guy was wearing "a large black overcoat" that was inappropriate for the weather. The school superintendent was quoted as saying that "his mode of dress (i.e. the coat) itself would have prompted a search". I think they might've been on a little thin ice with that, absent the call from the "concerned citizen."[/quote]

What do you say when you call 911 ? " Hello , what is your emergency " " Well , uh , I uh just saw a guy with a big overcoat ." " Has this person threatened anyone ?" " Uh , well uh no BUT it's a BIG overcoat ." " Well , perhaps if you stand in front this person with the BIG overcoat they will open it up and let you search them . Thank you for calling ."
This guy is an idiot anyway . I've known people to wear just because they can so as to attract attention . When I go into a place where I am not sure of I even leave my Paratool in my pick-up .



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TOM
SASS AMERICAN LEGION NRA GOA
 
MORON!, it is this kind of negative BS that prejudices the rest of society against us.

Regardless if he ment no harm, he created a situation that he knew, would end in his prosecution.

Waterdog
 
I have found www.packing.org to be a truly excellent source for concealed carry information. Accordingly, I just checked their Pennsylvania page regarding locations where CCW is prohibited. It says:

"Places off-limits while carrying:
A person is forbidden to carry a firearm into a court facility. However, notice that firearms are prohibited must be posted at the courthouse entrance and facilities for checking firearms must be provided by the county. Title 18 Pa. Crimes Code Section 911."

Maybe there is an applicable Federal law and/or maybe there are other germane Pennsylvania statutes that apply, however, there is obviously no mention of schools.

Nevertheless, based on the information available in this thread, I share the opinion that this guy was a moron.


[This message has been edited by RWK (edited August 30, 2000).]
 
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