Nighthawk custom

"Worth" is "in the eye of the beholder" so to speak. The more expensive guns generally have better fit, finish, component parts, triggers, etc. And then there's that pride of ownership thing. Is the expensive gun several times more reliable and accurate than a good production gun. Probably not. For example, I bought a new Rolex 30 plus years ago. Have enjoyed wearing most it every day. Due to my line of work, it got scuffed up a bit over that time. Cost more to overhaul 3-4 years ago than I originally paid for the watch. Is it several times more reliable and accurate than a cheap Chinese digital, or your smart phone? Probably not. Still don't regret my purchase.

BTW, Bought a Swiss pistol or two along the way too. I know, I know, your cousin's uncle's buddy's friend, who works in an actual gun shop, says Hi Points are more accurate. Especially those accurized by that guy he knows who works out of his garage:)
 
Say it takes five hours to build the gun.
There are literally tens of thousands of attorneys in this country who will charge you $400 an hour to provide quality work, but there may not be even 100 pistolsmiths who can do the very best work; you wouldn't pay the latter $400 an hour to build the gun upon which your life may depend?
 
RickB said:
Say it takes five hours to build the gun.

There are literally tens of thousands of attorneys in this country who will charge you $400 an hour to provide quality work, but there may not be even 100 pistolsmiths who can do the very best work; you wouldn't pay the latter $400 an hour to build the gun upon which your life may depend?
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If I was convinced that only with that $400 an hr smith I could get a firearm that I can trust my life to then sure, but I'm not.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
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There are literally tens of thousands of attorneys in this country who will charge you $400 an hour to provide quality work, but there may not be even 100 pistolsmiths who can do the very best work; you wouldn't pay the latter $400 an hour to build the gun upon which your life may depend?
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Attorneys and doctors effectively us a guild system under the guise of a industry controlled licensing system backed by the power of the law (practicing law / medicine without a license) to artificially limit the number of practitioners. Because they are operating outside of the free market it is unreasonable to use their charges and wages as a comparison for the rest of us that work within the free market or where government (or other) administered competency tests with no consideration of the supply and demand equation are used to determine qualification. When the various BAR associations and the AMA quit using supply and demand as part of their equation when issuing licensing to artificially limit the number of qualified people and influence the market rates you may have a valid comparison. Besides when i NEED an attorney (or a doctor) I NEED one. A pistol, given waiting periods and various other things, is almost always a purchase for future need or luxury. Further as a pistol is an item a pistol smiths work that was done ten years ago holds value and can be "reapplied" to a need today (I can buy a used pistol). This means that every time Nighthawk makes a new item they actual increase the supply side. When an attorney sells an hour that hour is gone and cannot be resold by the recipient.

Not a solid comparison.
 
No way I'd spend that kind of money on a defensive 1911.

A GOOD custom pistol, maximized, but not overboard & silly, can be done easily for less than half that.

I just did a head-to-head shootout comparison between my old Cylinder & Slide Colt Commander rebuilt in 2006, and a brand new Smith M&P 2.0 Compact.

Both same size, same .45 ACP.
The Colt had not been fired in several years.

In 2006, C&S did $2500 worth of work on the pistol, not counting the initial cost of the gun.
I got the original frame & slide back, but C&S pretty much replaced everything else, with quality components.

In the shootout, with 8 different loads & three different bullet weights, the Colt was fractionally more accurate at 25 yards with best 5-shot groups on 6 loads, tied with the Smith exactly on one load, and lost to the Smith in one load.

The Smith ate up everything without a single malfunction of any kind.
The Colt failed to chamber the first round (slide would not close initially) on three loads with exposed flat-nosed lead jacketed bullets. It functioned fine once the first round WAS chambered.

The Colt has everything it needs.
BarSto barrel, Ed Brown parts, C&S parts, hand-fit parts, de-horned, hard-chromed.

It didn't cost $4000 then & would not cost $4000 today, to get that level of work done.
And it is NOT necessary to spend four grand on a 1911 to get a pistol to bet your life on.

I have two full-sized 1911s here that were maximized by my local guy.
$1500 in after-buy money rendered both perfectly fit for carry, one of which was carried confidently for several years.
No bling, just what was needed to maximize.

In the Commander/M&P shoot-out, incidentally, it was nice to re-visit an old friend in the Commander, and Cylinder & Slide did a magnificent job on it, but I consider the Smith to be the winner.

Totally acceptable performance in both accuracy and reliability, same size as the Commander, carries two more rounds, lighter, simpler to use (no thumb safety).
And you get all that for $450, as opposed to $2500+.
Smith comes ready to go, Colt needs all sorts of work done.

I value my 1911s highly, but if I were going to go back to a .45 it'd be the Smith.
And I'd cheerfully bet my life on it.

The 1911 does need work, but spending four grand on one because you think it's "necessary" to get one that's "good enough" is wrong-think.

If you have the money, it's your money.
But aside from bragging rights, much of that money's wasted.
Denis
 
I finally bought a nice colt 1911, mostly "OK, been there, done that." Am I going to start a big collection of them like I might with revolvers, lever guns and AR's? Nope--just don't feel the love that much.
 
And it is NOT necessary to spend four grand on a 1911 to get a pistol to bet your life on.
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So far I haven't heard anyone saying that you *must* spend thousands of dollars to obtain a reliable self defense pistol. Its simply an option. That apparently, enough people indulge in or these custom smiths would have went out of business long ago.

I would love to afford one such custom gun. Heck, I'd love to afford dozens of custom guns. I would also love to afford a luxury vehicle, a mansion, and a wing of that mansion dedicated solely to expensive wines, meads, and scotch.

But just because I cannot afford all that doesn't mean I will talk disparagingly of those who can afford it.

Either I am just more relaxed in my way of thinking that many of you, or many of you are just holding in a tremendous amount of jealousy and its making you all grumpy.

:p
 
Ok what makes a Nighthawk Custom gun worth $3500?

Well there is two ways of looking at that. One is to figure the actual cost of production; materials, labor, overhead, shipping, etc. plus the rate of profit on top of that. I suspect the latter is hefty.

The second way is what a person is willing to pay for it. That goes beyond it's immediate utility.

If you are looking for a gun for CC or home defense millions of folks can cover that base beginning about $300-$400 bucks.

Beyond that you get into the the needs and wants dept. We may want/need a gun for hunting, or competition, or we want a gun that can shoot 2" at 50 yards, etc.

Right now I have 3 older S&W M41's in 22 l.r. I have 6 different slides for these. They've piled up over the years. Do I need that? I don't know but I got 'em. I never paid over a grand for any of them, btw.

Most of us here likely have more than 20 handguns. Do we need all that? Well I judge what I need. or want. No one else.

If a person wants to pay $3500. for a custom gun that fits them particularly I have no jealousy, gripe, resentment or contempt.

I've been to places around the world and seen beautiful things. I spent good money on that. Did i need to do it? Yeah.

tipoc
 
Jealousy ain't got spit to do with it.
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I believe that is true of you and for many others. There are a few, however, that seem to get angry that someone would spend that much of their own money on a nice pistol. Go figure.

BTW, I mentioned I own a Nighthawk but when I carry a 1911, it's a Dan Wesson. Right now, I'm mostly carrying a SW Compact or Shield, or sometimes a Ruger LCR in 9mm. It's definitely not necessary to spend $3,500 for a good handgun, even a good 1911.
 
I don't care if you want to spend your money on a Nighthawk.
It's your money.

The original question was "What makes a Nighthawk worth $3500?"
And to me the answer is nothing.

I do not & never have cared about bragging or show-off rights.
I rarely show anybody anything I own, and when I do it's more likely to be something out of the ordinary, like a Class III shotgun, or a fun Mare's Leg.
None of those are very expensive.

I do have several custom handguns that ran from a couple grand each up to $3000 each, those include three custom Colt Peacemakers, three custom 1911s, three custom Ruger Reds, a custom Ruger GP, and a custom Smith 686.

Those were each done to "maximize" a particular gun beyond what the factory did.

Only one included any unnecessary "bling", the engraved Red I did as a mid-life crises gift to myself at age 50.
The rest were simply refined, rebuilt, and reconfigured to make them more efficient in filling the niche they were acquired for.

Duping the three 1911s today would around $2500-$3000, and frankly I would not do it again today.
There are simply other choices that do the same job more reliably, cheaper, and with less maintenance.

I do not knock the pistol, or anybody who choses it.
I admire & respect the platform, I'll hang onto mine.
I just don't carry one anymore.

And anything above $3000 in a 1911 is just ego. :)
I could, if I wanted to get into a good one set up for reliable carry function, today do that for $2000.
That'd include the gun buy and aftermarket work.

I would not carry one in stock factory form.

I'm not angry at anybody spending $3500 on a Nighthawk pistol, I'm just answering the original question.

I am not jealous of anybody spending that much on a pistol.
If I wanted to shift some inventory, I could easily acquire one.

I've worked with high-end pistols from Wilson and C&S, and they were works of art.
Those companies put out a spectacular product.
But I was not tempted to keep one sufficiently to buy one. :)
Denis
 
my personally modified sr1911 and les baer UTC feel like the same gun in hand, things change when you shoot them... the les baer practically shoots itself, the ruger...not so much :P
 
Oh those 1911’s

Face it, gun fanciers spend a lot of money on guns. And maybe not one gun in particular but if you own 2 or more, you’ve probably spent enough to buy a Baer.
3 or more, a Wilson and so on. So the real issue comes down to quantity v. “quality” or artistry for that matter. Performance is another issue. You can argue about it till you’re blue in the face but the fact remains that 99% of the shooters alive today will not be able to shoot those exclusive customs any better than they might a top shelf Colt or Springfield that’s “mass produced.” So if you value the artistry of a Guncrafters or Wilson or Cabot more than those dusty things sitting in your safe, get rid of the damn things and go get one. You won’t be sorry!! And if you have the bucks, get one anyway!
 
I ought to say that I can't bring myself to spend $3500. on a single gun. It's not worth it to me, even on lay away.

tipoc
 
I ought to say that I can't bring myself to spend $3500. on a single gun. It's not worth it to me, even on lay away.

tipoc
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I can just because I've shot some world class pistols and like them. Everyone should be able to express their opinion and not feel shame for it. Myself I have always thought NHC was a little questionable. When just about all the founding members have bailed the company for greener pastures that should make you wonder.


Wilson is another one that just baffles me, they think all their products are made of gold. If you can get some sucker to pay $3200 for your "entry level" 1911 God bless you, or pay $65 for their premier 1911 mag. :rolleyes:


But as always deep down they both are great companies with employees who speak English and we should support them. I still have a range bag full of 47Ds even if the springs are a little weak in the long run.
 
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You don’t buy a custom 1911 because it necessarily shoots better! You buy it because you think it’s asthetically pleasing and that is more important to you than the cost.....end of story! It’s a personal decision, no objective factors, and no comparisons matter if that’s your choice!
 
Myself I have always thought NHC was a little questionable. When just about all the founding members have bailed the company for greener pastures that should tell make you wonder.
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NHC went through a bit of a rough patch. When I bought my NH Falcon I considered a Wilson Combat. I spoke to a seller of high end pistols and he confirmed what I had been seeing in forums and elsewhere --- that NHC had really stepped up its game and was as good as, if not better, than Wilson (excluding their Super Grade line). I could not be more pleased with my Nighhawk. The Falcon may be my favorite shooter.

BTW, I also own 1911s from Brown, Wilson, Baer, Dan Wesson, Colt, Springfield, and others. I only mention this so readers understand that I'm simply not a NHC fanboy. I've had experience with other top grade 1911s and middle-of-the-road 1911s.
 
Personally, I can't justify the cost of one. I could use the $3k+ to purchase several other nice pistols, and get custom work on them to perform even better. I like 1911's, but I'd be more happy with 2-3 Dan Wesson's over 1 NH.
 
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