New to blackpowder

I would forget the starter kit and get the items separately. As for cleaning I don't use patches I use bore mops. Hot soapy water is the best cleaner you can get. The 51 is a good gun. The 58 Remington may be a little more user friendly but I prefer the Colt's designs myself. Don't fool with a brass frame. You can only shoot light loads in them and IMO they're not worth the money. Not to mention historically inaccurate for most of them.
 
If you don't know what it was loaded with, you're taking a big risk shooting it out. If someone loaded it with smokeless, it will explode like a bomb when fired. You can google that and see the pictures of what remains.

You can either pull the ball out or remove the nipples and pick the powder out.

There should be no danger in picking the powder out. If you are really concerned about it, fill your sink with water and dunk the thing in the sink with the nipples out and pick the powder out while it's soaking wet. When all the powder is out, you can set the cylinder on a block of wood with a hole drilled in it, and then use a large nail to drive the bullet out of the chamber into the hole in the block of wood.

Steve
 
I had some some powder go bad in a my revolver before, took the nipple of, picked at the powder, dumped it out, put some fresh powder back in, rammed the ball down to make sure it was tight, capped it up and fired away. I was a little scared though, you could attach a string to the trigger or something and go a distance off and shoot it so you dont have to hold it. Once you take the powder out look to see if there is rust behind the ball in the chamber.

Dont get a starter kit, the flask is nice to have, the measure looks good, the capper will be useful (I dont have one) but I dont know about the nipple wrench. You want hardened steel wrenches, I'll give you a link to a good one. Also the starter kit isn't worth it, you could probally buy some balls from someone on here or over on the castboolits forum, or at cabelas or any store like that. Cabelas has a good price for pyrodex black powder subsitute, and they also sell caps. the lube or wads isn't totally necessary, it just keeps the fouling down. People claim it prevents chainfires, and some say chainfires occur from the nipple end. it's a big controversy in the black powder world.
As for the '51, they are classic C&B revolvers. They do put them on sale if you wait, they had them $180 at Christmas. Colt black powder revolvers do hang up though, the hammer pulls the spent cap of each nipple sometimes on some guns. The remington 1858 doesn't do this.
If you really have to have lube, you could buy some unsalted crisco at the grocery store.
Have fun! Once you start shooting black powder, there's no going back
 
You might want to try a "schraeder valve tool" used for unscrewing car tyre valves, & so available from the local car parts store. In many cases its as good as, or better than a nipple wrench.
WD-40 applied liberally & left to soak overnight will help with the powder. & Hawg's idea with a drywall screw (also dripping with WD-40) should pull the ball easily enough.
 
Ok thank you guys for the replies. I have plenty of Schrader valve tools I'm an avid mountain bike rider so I have those. Will try and make it work with that and then soak with wd40 and pick it out slowly with something that's not metal. And yes the starter kit looked like craps but it looked decent enough to get me started. But I guess I'll just go the other route and get what I need as I need it. And yes I have done quite a bit of reading so brass frame is out of the question for me I plan on shooting it quite a bit so don't want to worry about the frame stretfhing over time. I like the 51 the best for looks so I will start there but I'm sure I will get more as time goes along thanks again everyone for the replies I will keep you updated as I make progress and pick up a gun of my own. One more question though is there anyone in socal that shoots? Be fun to be able to meet up with someone that has experience and shoot with them
 
Hawg said:
You could just screw a wood screw into the ball and pull it with a pair of vise grips. There's no danger in picking at the powder with something non sparking.
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What Hawg said +1. Pulling the ball and picking the powder out is perfectly safe and the easiest way to clear a loaded chamber short of capping it and firing. What powder remains after you get the bulk of ir out can be washed out with hot water.

First thing you need to get is a nipple wrench so you can remove the nipples and apply some anti seize to the threads to make them easier to remove later.
 
Maximus89

I don't understand how a Schrader valve stem tool is going to help. The shape of the end to remove a stem is similar, but the diameter is way smaller.
Those nipples may very well be stuck tight, so the cylinder may need to be soaking in some concoction of tranny fluid and penetrating oil as we speak.

I don't know what stores you are near, but I have been happy with my nipple wrench from Cabelas. I prefer the 'T' style handle as I think it is easier to apply steady pressure while keeping the wrench fully engaged with the nipple. It's easy to round the corners off of a stuck nipple, and then you have a much more difficult task. Anyway that costs about $20.

You said you were a machinist. If it were me, I might just try to make a nipple wrench if I had some steel tube stock, and then temper it.

I think that I would try to get Dad's pistol working to see if you could shoot it this weekend. You could just get some .44 cal balls ($15), #10 caps($8) and some Prodex 'P' ($20) and be in business if the gun cleans up and all works.

That's about $63 with the cost of a wrench, and would let you shoot 100 times. You would need to decide whether to get .451 or .454 balls. I would go bigger for a better seal in the chambers.

Sure would like to see you pull it together for this weekend, but don't take any chances. Best work to get the loaded cylinder unloaded first!
 
If you buy a nipple wrench get one that's hardened. They do cost a lot more tho. Or you can make one out of a 1/4 drive socket. Get one the cone part of the nipple will fit into and slot it out with a dremel.
 
Ok so update, I have a nipple wrench ordered it will be here Friday. My dad has some fffg black powder is that good for tis gun? He also has some smokeless but I believe that's a big no no for this gun so we will just forget about that. He also has some primer caps and balls for ammo.so hopefully I'll be able to get it ready for Sunday at the range. What else do I need? I know I need lube can I use the regular gun cleaners I use on modern hand guns? And for lube oil on the action parts do I use the same as I use to lube the wads and ball?
 
The 3fg is perfect. Yes, leave the smokeless at home if you want to remain close to all your digits. Don't use normal gun cleaner for bore and chambers. Hot water, hot water and dish soap, Ballistol/water - anything natural. You can use whatever ya want in the action.

Still trying to wrap my head around anyone selling/buying a loaded firearm though. That's a new one.
 
Ok great, and by bore you mean the bore of the barrel correct? And ya I'm a little astonished by that too the only thing I can say is it was the early 80's so it was a different time he bought it for 20 dollars.makes me wonder if something is wrong with it. I noticed on another thread that some people talk about a gap I'm guessing between the chamber on the cylinder and the barrel bore. What is good and what's acceptable? It has a steel frame so I don't think frame stretching will be there but maybe the arbor for the cylinder is worn out or the clip thing that holds the barrel to the arbor? What should I check for before I shoot it? Thank you all for the replies, I respect your knowledge and generosity in helping me.
 
I wouldn't use modern gun oil because it contains petroluem, use ballistol oil, or somepeople use olive oil, never tried it myself. I bet those nipples are rusted on, you might need to put the cylinder in a vise between 2 pieces of wood and rag to give you more leverage when you go to take them out. Sounds like you have all the necessities for shooting, dont use smokeless unless you don't like living.;)
 
to start you off use olive oil for oil & Crisco for grease.
Clean with hot soapy, followed by warm clean water. Shake, blow & hair dryer dry & re oil immediately.

You may find the balls, even if marked for a caliber aren't quite the right size. Back in the day standardization was unheard of in the modern use of the term, so a .44 ball might be .451", .454", or even .457" & you'll have to experiment to find the best fit.
 
I noticed on another thread that some people talk about a gap I'm guessing between the chamber on the cylinder and the barrel bore. What is good and what's acceptable? It has a steel frame so I don't think frame stretching will be there but maybe the arbor for the cylinder is worn out or the clip thing that holds the barrel to the arbor? What should I check for before I shoot it? Thank you all for the replies, I respect your knowledge and generosity in helping me.
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Cylinder gap is checked with the hammer at full cock. .002-.004 is good .008 is IMO acceptable. However some guns have arbors that are too short and the depth of the wedge will affect cylinder gap to the point of locking the gun up if driven in too deep. On a gun with the correct length arbor wedge depth won't matter. IMO a wedge should be pressed in and out with the thumb tho some will argue that point. If the arbor is too short it's an easy fix with washers or D&T for a set screw in the end of the arbor.

I guess different ones have different sized holes
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They do.
 
Ok thanks everyone for the replies update, got one nipple off seemed fairly easy the rest seem to be rusted on soaking with some wd right now than going to vice it up and try again and I looked at the clearance looks really small didn't measure yet but I am able to press the cylinder back more and opens up the gap looked to be almost .025 " maybe more didn't measure but is it supposed to move like that?
 
Yeah it will move against the hand. That's the end shake but you check gap with hammer cocked and cylinder in full lockup.
 
The cylinder didn't feel like it locked up it still had that shake when the hammer was fully cocked. But update one nipple is stuck and won't come out guess the tool I got was cheap it started rounding the corners so I left it. I will just use it as my dead chamber. The 3 chambers with blackcpowder came off got the powder and balls out so time to do a deep cleaning than lube it up. Is it ok to use the chamber with the stuck nipple as my dead chamber? How can I mark it? Should I glue it up and just get all new nipples when I get a new tool? I just want to take it out this weekend with what I have and see if it shoots. Please advise me on what action I should take thank you .
 
You could mark it with something like whiteout or a marker or just use it as is. Try to turn the cylinder with the hammer cocked. If it turns you've got more problems that need to be addressed before you fire it.
 
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