New re loader here with questions

Burn rates on powder.
Do we look for a faster burning powder for a 9mm in a short barrel (4 inch or so)?
Will the quicker burn then create the pressures needed to accelerate the projectile down the barrel and maintain the velocity we are looking for?
I thought I read that folks use slower powders in rifle charges as there is more mass in the projectile and to maintain pressure in the barrel as the projectile moves toward the muzzle.
 
This thread is a great primer for first time reloaders. You'd still have to read the manuals, of course, but great info here.

As with others, I started loading Berry's plated bullets before the internet was in full swing and their instruction sheet said to use the same load data as I had for lead bullets, same weight, same shape. I did that and never had any issues. Accuracy/precision was just fine and I got good groups out of my pistols and revolvers. It was just plain old plinking ammo but it worked very well.

What I noticed, though, is that depending on what load manual I used, the data was all over the spectrum. Using a Speer book delivered radically different load data than the Lyman book and both were different than the other books I had. When I saw that, I just compared them all and started with the lowest of them and worked up from there until I hit an accurate load, then stopped. I never felt like I needed the load with the highest pressures or velocities.

As for crimping, I rarely crimp much anyway, just a very light taper crimp which is mostly just to get the flare back out of the brass.

As mentioned, the K.I.S.S. rule works. Be safe, but you don't have to over think it.

--Wag--
 
Like all of this I imagine why the #1 rule for starting is always get a good book! Not only will it provide the basics and a constant reference but it should also provide a very good idea of which components one could use or at least give a reference as to what to look for.

If you need to buy locally then shop for what is available, start a list. Most starters are not going to be ordering 10,000 primers or 10lbs of powder so as we all know hazmat fees can eat up any savings you find on line. Look around and know what powders are available to you locally.. Try to find a load in the manual with components that are readily available and actually have load data published. Take the time to research what the powder companies have available. I find I go there now first because it is usually the most current information available. Also they are trying to sell powder for as many different bullets as possible were the bullet makers are only interested in selling their bullets and they don't care what powder you use.

I only hope that we didn't muddy and confuse the waters too much to turn someone away.
 
Ok, today was the day, finished the set up of the Lee classic Turret press.
Took it all apart and cleaned and lubed everything. Starting from scratch so to speak.
I downloaded the Hodsdon load data for titegroup and used the data for lead round nose bullet's.
115 Gn copper plated RN.
10 rounds each at 3.9, 4.0, 4.1, 4.2 grains. COL 1.104.
Max load is 4.3, but what can I say, dinner was ready and you can call me anything you want,,, but late for dinner!! LOL
Tomorrow I will shoot and log the results.
This should be interesting.
 
Good for you SkipperT!
Really hope you enjoyed your new pastime along with that new press.
I do have to question your COL though. 1.104 seems awful short. Are you sure you didn't mean 1.140"?

Now this is also just me but when I start a new load for the 1st time when I test fire I always load one round at a time in my auto loaders. Just as a safety precaution and also to check function, will it feed an eject and lock the slide back. At least with the first starting loads. My one gun is rather heavy and will many times not fully cycle with starting loads.

Lest us know how your day at the range goes with your test rounds!
 
"Will the quicker burn then create the pressures needed to accelerate the projectile down the barrel and maintain the velocity we are looking for?" You referenced a 4" barrel.

It doesn't work that way but some people will still try to tell you it does. You can call a powder manufacturer if you don't believe me. Believe it or not a slow burning powder for a particular cartridge will give the highest velocity even in a 2" snubby barrel.

An example for you: If you are loading .357 and using Bullseye, a fast burning powder, you will never get the same velocity in any barrel length, both being the same, you can get with say H110, a slow burning handgun powder. With the Bullseye you will probably blow up your gun trying to get the same velocity you can get with H110 due to too much pressure for your gun.

So your 4" 9mm barrel will get the higher velocity with a slower burning powder. And a slow burning powder for a 9mm isn't the same as one for a .357. Btw rifle powders are usually significantly slower burning than handgun/shotgun powders.

I hope this helps you understand a bit more about what is going on. You are going to be glad you started loading your own ammo not only because of cost savings but the extreme versatility you can't get with factory ammo.
 
Kmw1954, The COL from Hodgdon's website called for an overall length of 1.100" so I left it touch longer.
I started with this new machine, de-capping, resizing and re-priming 100 rounds. Just to get the feel and learn the process.
Then I worked with the flare and powder drop die until I got the flare just enough to start the bullet.
I moved on the bullet seating die and got it started and tweaked to the 1.104" setting,, that was a slow but fun process, and then set the crimping die to just a touch of a crimp. I did not see any deflection of the soft copper coating so I hope I am doing this right.
Then I started with the powder drum and tweaked this for an hour or two again figuring out how the thing worked and whether it is was consistent or not. It wasn't to bad I did see slight variations of +/- 0.02 gns pf powder. I verified the powder drop with both the Lee Beam scale and an electronic scale I bought.
As I did the 10 loads for each setting, I checked everything every other round and seems to be very consistent.
The reason I have done 10 loads each is because I am going to test two firearms, a Glock 17 and SW Shield. I chose these as the Glock I use every week at IPSC and the Shield is new with a pretty stiff spring. Figure this should give me a pretty solid idea of whether or not these loads will work.
Have to start somewhere.
 
Here is the data I used:
BULLET WEIGHT
115 GR. LRN
Starting Loads Maximum Loads
Manufacturer Powder Bullet Diam.
C.O.L. Grs.
Vel. (ft/s)
Pressure
Grs.
Vel. (ft/s)
Pressure
Hodgdon Titegroup .356" 1.100" 3.9 1,075 25,800 CUP 4.3 1,151 30,500 CUP
 
SkipperT, just looked thru my notes and data and yes from the looks of things the LRN are loaded short with a much reduced powder charge. The reason I mentioned anything is because I an use to seating the 115gr Berry's plated bullet out at 1.130" to 1.140" with both the HP-38 and the Ramshot powders.

Again good luck, have fun and post back your results! I know I'll be waiting to hear from you.
 
Quote cervri: Start off by getting yourself a couple of reloading manuals.

Yes, start here and read the manuals. I like the Lyman manual. The first 120 pages or so tell all about how to reload and be safe doing it. Then comes the loads for the different cartridges. Most of the data shows the load the ops found best for the cartridge and powder in question. Get the book, look through the data, then go buy components. Remember, start low and work up. Have fun!
 
kmw1954 said:
SkipperT, just looked thru my notes and data and yes from the looks of things the LRN are loaded short with a much reduced powder charge. The reason I mentioned anything is because I an use to seating the 115gr Berry's plated bullet out at 1.130" to 1.140" with both the HP-38 and the Ramshot powders.

Again good luck, have fun and post back your results! I know I'll be waiting to hear from you.
Click to expand...
I hope no one minds me jumping in on this. I, too, am a new re-loader. I'd been collecting spent brass for nearly my entire shooting life, with the aim of one day loading my own. This thread, along with responses, is a near duplicate of my scenario.
My dear wife gifted me with a Hornady Lock-n-Load Class kit for Christmas, and I've been adding to it, while preparing brass for that eventual reload. Of course I've made a few mistakes already, but that's the joy of learning something from scratch.

Here's where I am to date, and why I need help.

Lee 4-die 9mm set
Berry 115gn 9mm Copper Plated round nose
Hodgdon HP-38 powder
Cleaned Fiocchi Italian brass (G.F.L. stamp) with Franklin Arsenal Rotary Tumbler
Berretta 92FS 9mm

Load data:
Set 1: 4.2 gn HP-38, COL 1.125", CCI 550 magnum primer (first mistake- CCI 550 vs 500 which is why I loaded 4.2 gn), 2nd mistake - loaded 100 rounds

Set 2: 4.4 gn HP-38, COL 1.125", WIN WPL primer - attempt to correct Set 1, then
repaeated 2nd mistake - loaded 100 rounds

Set 3: 4.6 gn HP-38, COL 1.1", WIN WPL primer - loaded 10 rounds

Used a combination of Hodgdon Reloading Center Data and Hornady Cartrodge Loading Handbook for powder and COL ideas. WIN321 data used where HP-38 was not listed.

Shooting Experience:
Set 1: 100% failure to eject/load next round
Set 2: 100% failure to eject/load next round
Set 3: (which was first round fired) 70% failure to eject/load next round

Test comparison:
15 rounds Fiocchi American new 115 gn FMJ RN
93.3% successful recycle, eject, new round loaded - no stovepipe, one round caught on feedramp.

In general, Set 1, Set 2, and Test comparison rounds fired true, pretty close to where I pointed (I am not a crack shot).

Set 3 - highest charge with deepest bullet seating, rounds fired tight group, but all pulled left of center.

This is my first post, so I apologize for the length and any lack of clarity.

Any ideas why my reloaded rounds failed to recycle? On a positive note, I recovered every round fired, since they were all manually ejected.
 
markr6754,

I would suggest here would be a good starting point:
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/595577/lyman-max-cartridge-gauge-9mm-luger

You're asking a lot of a handgun cartridge fired thru a pistol. Has to feed cleanly out of the magazine, has to come out at the proper angle, has to hit the feed ramp properly, and has to be a good fit for the chamber. The above tool will at least insure that the cartridge is a good fit for your chamber. Hope that helps.

Don
 
markr6754, welcome to the group.

Not to be mean but it really might be best to start a new topic as your questions are quite specific. It would facilitate more concentrated answers to you questions w/o getting lost in this topic.

From what you have posted as your load data it mimics mine almost to a tee. Only real difference being the primer used and the brass headstamp. The firearm I am using is also very similar in that I am using a Taurus PT92C as one of my test guns.

With my starting loads with HP-38 at 4.2 gr. All would feed an eject with the only failure being that it would not lock the slide back on the last round.

I do not believe the problem lays with your reloads but more with your gun seeing as you are also having failures with factory loaded rounds.
 
USSR said:
markr6754,

I would suggest here would be a good starting point:
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/595577/lyman-max-cartridge-gauge-9mm-luger

You're asking a lot of a handgun cartridge fired thru a pistol. Has to feed cleanly out of the magazine, has to come out at the proper angle, has to hit the feed ramp properly, and has to be a good fit for the chamber. The above tool will at least insure that the cartridge is a good fit for your chamber. Hope that helps.

Don
Click to expand...
USSR, appreciate your feedback. I had a similar thought in mind. Prior to firing anything I did drop a loaded round down into my barrel to check for fit and ease of entry/exit. In preparation, I have a part on order...not the specific gauge you posted, but a Lyman Multi-Caliber Handgun block since I intend to reload 9, 45ACP, and 357/38 Special.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/4...special-44-remington-magnum-45-colt-long-colt

Is the specific cartridge gauge a better tool to use than the multi-caliber block? At his point I'm not opposed to adding additional tools if they'll give me a greater control over my loads.

Thanks again for the feedback.
 
kmw1954 said:
markr6754, welcome to the group.

Not to be mean but it really might be best to start a new topic as your questions are quite specific. It would facilitate more concentrated answers to you questions w/o getting lost in this topic.

From what you have posted as your load data it mimics mine almost to a tee. Only real difference being the primer used and the brass headstamp. The firearm I am using is also very similar in that I am using a Taurus PT92C as one of my test guns.

With my starting loads with HP-38 at 4.2 gr. All would feed an eject with the only failure being that it would not lock the slide back on the last round.

I do not believe the problem lays with your reloads but more with your gun seeing as you are also having failures with factory loaded rounds.
Click to expand...
kmw1954,

I don't consider it mean at all. I'm new to the forum, so whatever you seniors feel are best practices, I'm ready to follow them. I gave a thought to a new thread, and failed to follow that original thought. Nonetheless, you've provided the best answer...your loads were successful with the same powder, charge, bullet, and gun type. I'm familiar with the Taurus, and since Brazil is using the same plant that used to manufacture the 92FS, I'm confident that your experience serves as a validation that I need to look closer at my specific firearm for answers. I'll take my problem to a new thread.

Thanks for your kind response. Super helpful.
 
Is the specific cartridge gauge a better tool to use than the multi-caliber block?
Click to expand...

A gauge is a gauge is a gauge. One is as good as another. I use either Lyman or L.E. Wilson.

Don
 
Excellent. Thanks. I'm so new at this I don't know up from down. Now I know a gauge is a gauge is a gauge...I just need mine to be delivered.
 
Finally made it to the range.
Shot 90 rounds and here is what I did:
Used a Glock 17 and the SW Shield. 9mm

Berry's copper plated 115 gn RN
Titegroup powder;
COL 1.104
10 rnds, 3.9 gn
1 squib
9 rnds down range, easy recoil, brass only flew 3 ft.
Functioned ok in each firearm.

10 rnds, 4.0 gn
Good function still good recoil, all 10 down range.

10 rnds, 4.1 gn
Felt a bit more recoil, all 10 down range and the brass has moved out to about 8 feet.
More like a factory recoil, 2nd shot a little harder to acquire.

10 rnds, 4.2 gn
Felt like a standard factory round, recoil like the same, all 10 rounds down range, no issue.
Overall both firearms worked like they should preferred the 4.0 load, soft, good function and easy 2nd shot acquisition.

Then I loaded 50 rounds:
SNS Castings 115 gr polymer coated lead.
4.3 gn, listed as min for Winchester 231 powder.
I had 1 squib in this group as well.
Over all this seemed liked a factory load at the minimum load.
Snappy recoil, good function and Worked in both firearms.
If I use this again I may drop down to 4.1 gn and test that load for feel and function.

Overall my first rounds fired that I made,,, worked very well.
Have to keep an eye on the process and make sure every casing gets a powder charge!
I did buy a small LED reading light and mounted to the press,, can see so much better now!!

Time to re-fill the brass!!! LOL
 
SkipperT, nice report. Question though. Please explain your 2 squibs? Did these fire and stick in the barrel or were they Failure to fires?

I've been loading the 115gr Berry's RN with HP-38/Win231 at 4.2gr to a length of 1.130" and they have worked very well.
 
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