National Parks Carry update

I think this is great news for more than one reason. Now, I am FAR from being an Obama supporter (and would need a lobotomy to become one), but this is one piece of legislation he has pushed for that I agree with. I am extremely glad that the National Parks carry permission was tacked on, but even moreso because it wasn't some huge tax and/or spend bill that it was attached to. I am a capitalist through and through, but the credit card industry has royally screwed its card-holders over and over. And sadly the worse victims are those who can least afford the rate change from 12% to 29% at the whim of the CC companies.

On a side note, I've skimmed through the legislation, but didn't see how this would affect those facilities maintained by the Army Corp of Engineers. Anyone able to shed some light on this?
 
The NY Times has been having hissy fits about the amendment for awhile. Why doesn't Obama stand up to the evil gun lobby? Oh, dear - he is misbehaving.
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<---hands hanky to the NY Times. Actually, I love this. Puts the big O between a rock and a hard place. He' going to sign it, I'd be shocked if he doesn't. Maybe the love affair with the leftist press won't be quite so slobbery now. :)
 
The House agreed to the Senate Amendment in two votes. The first vote was all but Sec. 512. The second vote (Roll Call 277), on agreeing to Sec. 512, passed with a lesser Democratic margin than the rest of the Amd. As the House agreed to the Amd, the bill is final and goes to the President.

FINAL VOTE RESULTS FOR ROLL CALL 277
(Democrats in roman; Republicans in italic; Independents underlined)

H R 627 YEA-AND-NAY 20-May-2009 2:24 PM
QUESTION: Concur In Sec. 512 of Sen Amdt.
BILL TITLE: Credit Cardholders’ Bill of Rights Act of 2009

Yeas Nays PRES NV
Democratic 105 145 5
Republican 174 2 2
Independent
TOTALS 279 147 7


---- YEAS 279 ---

Aderholt
Adler (NJ)
Akin
Alexander
Altmire
Arcuri
Austria
Baca
Bachus
Barrow
Bartlett
Barton (TX)
Bean
Berkley
Berry
Biggert
Bilbray
Bilirakis
Bishop (GA)
Bishop (UT)
Blackburn
Blunt
Boccieri
Boehner
Bonner
Bono Mack
Boozman
Boren
Boswell
Boucher
Boustany
Boyd
Brady (TX)
Bright
Broun (GA)
Brown (SC)
Brown-Waite, Ginny
Buchanan
Burgess
Burton (IN)
Buyer
Calvert
Camp
Campbell
Cantor
Cao
Capito
Cardoza
Carney
Carter
Cassidy
Chaffetz
Chandler
Childers
Coble
Coffman (CO)
Cole
Conaway
Costa
Costello
Courtney
Crenshaw
Cuellar
Culberson
Dahlkemper
Davis (AL)
Davis (KY)
Davis (TN)
Deal (GA)
DeFazio
DeGette
Dent
Diaz-Balart, L.
Diaz-Balart, M.
Dingell
Donnelly (IN)
Dreier
Driehaus
Duncan
Edwards (TX)
Ehlers
Ellsworth
Emerson
Etheridge
Fallin
Flake
Fleming
Forbes
Fortenberry
Foster
Foxx
Franks (AZ)
Frelinghuysen
Gallegly
Garrett (NJ)
Gerlach
Giffords
Gingrey (GA)
Gohmert
Goodlatte
Gordon (TN)
Granger
Graves
Grayson
Green, Gene
Griffith
Guthrie
Hall (TX)
Halvorson
Harper
Hastings (WA)
Heinrich
Heller
Hensarling
Herger
Herseth Sandlin
Higgins
Hill
Hinchey
Hodes
Hoekstra
Holden
Hunter
Inglis
Issa
Jenkins
Johnson (GA)
Johnson (IL)
Johnson, Sam
Jones
Jordan (OH)
Kagen
Kanjorski
Kennedy
Kind
King (IA)
King (NY)
Kingston
Kirkpatrick (AZ)
Kissell
Kline (MN)
Kratovil
Lamborn
Lance
Latham
LaTourette
Latta
Lee (NY)
Lewis (CA)
Linder
LoBiondo
Lucas
Luetkemeyer
Lummis
Lungren, Daniel E.
Mack
Maffei
Manzullo
Marchant
Markey (CO)
Marshall
Massa
Matheson
McCarthy (CA)
McCaul
McClintock
McCotter
McHenry
McHugh
McIntyre
McKeon
McMorris Rodgers
McNerney
Meek (FL)
Meeks (NY)
Melancon
Mica
Michaud
Miller (FL)
Miller (MI)
Miller, Gary
Minnick
Mitchell
Mollohan
Moran (KS)
Murphy (NY)
Murphy, Patrick
Murphy, Tim
Murtha
Myrick
Neugebauer
Nunes
Nye
Oberstar
Obey
Olson
Ortiz
Pallone
Paul
Paulsen
Pence
Perlmutter
Perriello
Peterson
Petri
Pitts
Platts
Poe (TX)
Pomeroy
Posey
Price (GA)
Putnam
Radanovich
Rahall
Rehberg
Reichert
Reyes
Rodriguez
Roe (TN)
Rogers (AL)
Rogers (KY)
Rogers (MI)
Rohrabacher
Rooney
Ros-Lehtinen
Roskam
Ross
Royce
Ryan (OH)
Ryan (WI)
Salazar
Scalise
Schauer
Schmidt
Schock
Schrader
Sensenbrenner
Sessions
Shadegg
Shimkus
Shuler
Shuster
Simpson
Sires
Skelton
Smith (NE)
Smith (NJ)
Smith (TX)
Smith (WA)
Souder
Space
Spratt
Stearns
Stupak
Sullivan
Tanner
Taylor
Teague
Terry
Thompson (MS)
Thompson (PA)
Thornberry
Tiahrt
Tiberi
Titus
Turner
Upton
Walden
Walz
Wamp
Welch
Westmoreland
Whitfield
Wilson (OH)
Wilson (SC)
Wittman
Wolf
Young (AK)
Young (FL)

---- NAYS 147 ---

Abercrombie
Ackerman
Andrews
Baird
Baldwin
Becerra
Berman
Bishop (NY)
Blumenauer
Brady (PA)
Brown, Corrine
Butterfield
Capps
Capuano
Carnahan
Carson (IN)
Castle
Castor (FL)
Clarke
Clay
Cleaver
Clyburn
Cohen
Connolly (VA)
Conyers
Cooper
Crowley
Cummings
Davis (CA)
Davis (IL)
Delahunt
DeLauro
Dicks
Doggett
Doyle
Edwards (MD)
Ellison
Engel
Eshoo
Farr
Fattah
Filner
Frank (MA)
Fudge
Gonzalez
Green, Al
Grijalva
Gutierrez
Hall (NY)
Hare
Harman
Hastings (FL)
Himes
Hinojosa
Hirono
Holt
Honda
Hoyer
Inslee
Israel
Jackson (IL)
Jackson-Lee (TX)
Johnson, E. B.
Kaptur
Kildee
Kilpatrick (MI)
Kilroy
Kirk
Klein (FL)
Kosmas
Kucinich
Langevin
Larsen (WA)
Larson (CT)
Lee (CA)
Levin
Lewis (GA)
Lipinski
Loebsack
Lofgren, Zoe
Lowey
Luján
Lynch
Maloney
Markey (MA)
Matsui
McCarthy (NY)
McCollum
McDermott
McGovern
McMahon
Miller (NC)
Miller, George
Moore (KS)
Moore (WI)
Moran (VA)
Murphy (CT)
Nadler (NY)
Napolitano
Neal (MA)
Olver
Pascrell
Pastor (AZ)
Payne
Peters
Pingree (ME)
Price (NC)
Quigley
Rangel
Richardson
Rothman (NJ)
Roybal-Allard
Ruppersberger
Rush
Sanchez, Loretta
Sarbanes
Schakowsky
Schiff
Schwartz
Scott (GA)
Scott (VA)
Serrano
Sestak
Shea-Porter
Sherman
Slaughter
Snyder
Sutton
Tauscher
Thompson (CA)
Tierney
Tonko
Towns
Tsongas
Van Hollen
Velázquez
Visclosky
Wasserman Schultz
Waters
Watson
Watt
Waxman
Weiner
Wexler
Woolsey
Wu
Yarmuth

---- NOT VOTING 7 ---

Bachmann
Barrett (SC)
Braley (IA)
Polis (CO)
Sánchez, Linda T.
Speier
Stark
 
According to an article I read, many of the new Dems in Congress come from western states, and they don't have the anti-gun attitude of their eastern confreres.
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The Roll Call 277 tally seems to back this up... over 40% of House Dems voted "Yea". :) What was that about legislative posteriors? ;)
On a side note, I've skimmed through the legislation, but didn't see how this would affect those facilities maintained by the Army Corp of Engineers. Anyone able to shed some light on this?
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Unfortunately, after reading the section myself, I don't think it has any effect on property overseen by the USACE. That stinks- we will still be prohibited from CCW at the numerous USACE-maintained parks located near TX lakes. I had my hopes up. :(
 
I am a capitalist through and through, but the credit card industry has royally screwed its card-holders over and over. And sadly the worse victims are those who can least afford the rate change from 12% to 29% at the whim of the CC companies.
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No you arent a capitalist through and through. You are only one to the extent that your ox isnt gored.:D

Nopw us guys that pay our cc bills on time and have nice low rates and no fees and perqs are gonna get screwed as the banks spread the loss from deadbeats around.

And the gun ammendment is great :)

WildnowicancarryindenaliAlaska ™
 
Still can't carry in Yosemite. But the place is so crowded I don't think there's room to draw anyway.

Nopw us guys that pay our cc bills on time and have nice low rates and no fees and perqs are gonna get screwed as the banks spread the loss from deadbeats around.
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Thanks for subsidizing me big guy! :D
 
I am a capitalist through and through, but the credit card industry has royally screwed its card-holders over and over. And sadly the worse victims are those who can least afford the rate change from 12% to 29% at the whim of the CC companies.
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Bull. Read the contract. If you don't like it, don't deal with that company. If it's a policy they all use, don't carry a credit card. There are no "victims", only people who don't read contracts or who think "it'll never happen to me..."
 
No you arent a capitalist through and through. You are only one to the extent that your ox isnt gored.

Nopw us guys that pay our cc bills on time and have nice low rates and no fees and perqs are gonna get screwed as the banks spread the loss from deadbeats around.
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ummm, you don't know me, nor how well I pay my credit cards or any of my other bills. I pay on time. I have paid off all but one credit card, and the one remaining card is at a 2.9%. However, I DO have friends who DO pay their CC on time, but did make the mistake of running their cards up to close to the limit... THAT is what made the CC companies jack their rates up. Got that? They made payments on time. IMHO, they should NOT have gone so far into debt, but does that in itself justify SCREWING them by doubling their interest rates? That type of blood-sucking from the CC companies is what has helped get a socialist like Obama elected. No doubt there are many out there who don't pay their bills on time or not at all. And no, I don't want to share that burden of having their debts forgiven. But why punish those who go into debt and honestly try to pay off those debts off by grossly increasing their interest rates?? Perhaps you think Madoff and Enron are shining examples of capitalism. Not I. Nor do I think those CC companies that gouge honest consumers promote the interest of capitalism. But perhaps the victims of Enron and Bernard Madoff are simply whining because their "ox got gored" btw, if you are such the financial wizard, I suggest you invest in a decent spell-checker! :D
 
However, I DO have friends who DO pay their CC on time, but did make the mistake of running their cards up to close to the limit... THAT is what made the CC companies jack their rates up. Got that? They made payments on time. IMHO, they should NOT have gone so far into debt, but does that in itself justify SCREWING them by doubling their interest rates?
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Should have read the FINE PRINT in their contracts before they agreed to accept the card then

That type of blood-sucking from the CC companies is what has helped get a socialist like Obama elected.
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LOL....Obama saaaaaaaaaaave us LOL

btw, if you are such the financial wizard, I suggest you invest in a decent spell-checker!
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BTW,learn how to capitalize.:rolleyes:

WildthatsallfrommeonthisthreadAlaska ™
 
Funny how they can get away with wrapping so many seemingly disparate issues into one law. I often wonder why we would allow this.... besides we don't need any help pulling our threads off topic.

thatsallfrommeonthisthread
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Cheaper 'n a spell checker anyway.:)
 
I'm glad they split the bill. Even when the hoodwinking works towards my own views, I don't like how they tie in unrelated legislation into things pretty much guaranteed to pass. I think each thing should be voted on individually. I understand that some bulk legislation would be a tidal wave if it wasn't tied together in a single vote, but I really don't care if the have to work late hours and, God forbid, work the same hours we do without break to make sure that all legislation gets fair consideration.

That said, Kudos. It's amazing the commentary between say a Huffington Post comment thread and one here. Polar opposites and it's just mind boggling how anti's think that this means that any goon with a gun will be able to walk in and start firing away. The Brady's even went as far as to say that regular folk shouldn't have to worry about someone carring an AK47 around as they tried to enjoy the parks.

Do any of you plan on taking your AK47 into Yellowstone? Didn't think so.
 
Unfortunately it appears as if the regulations will go into effect 9 months after signing by Obama. That means I still won't be able to carry when I'm up on the Blue Ridge Parkway here in a couple weeks.......:(
 
Okay, in effect in 9 months --
But does it immediately un-do the injunction?

Or are you correct that we will be waiting 9 months?!

My annual BRP run is set for the second weekend in June.

I'm ****** if I can't carry. I'll be the guy loading a subcompact Glock on the BRP exit ramp when we head to town for a meal, fuel and a room. :(
 
Is this thread about the amendment to carry in National Parks in the Credit Card bill, or about the Credit Card bill itself?

Some of you are to be commended for trying to keep this on topic. Others of you may well find your access to this forum, if not TFL, in jeopardy. :mad:
 
Okay, in effect in 9 months --
But does it immediately un-do the injunction?

Or are you correct that we will be waiting 9 months?!
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I hope I'm wrong, but that's the way I read it.

I doubt this legislation will undo an injunction that was filed against a regulatory change, but IANAL so maybe some of our resident legal eagles can weigh in there........
 
tiberious10721 said:
how come we wont be able to carry in yosemite park?
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Short answer: The new law forces National Parks to conform to State law on carry questions. In California, open carry is rather problematic. Under Concealed Carry, you must have a CA CCW. Only residents may obtain a CA CCW. CA does not recognize any other States permits.
Sevens said:
Okay, in effect in 9 months --
But does it immediately un-do the injunction?
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The injunction is against a regulation, not a law, so it stands. The law (a legislated act) overrides any regulation to the contrary. Hence, when the law goes into effect, the injunction (against the regulation) will be moot.
 
The new law forces National Parks to conform to State law on carry questions. In California, open carry is rather problematic. Under Concealed Carry, you must have a CA CCW. Only residents may obtain a CA CCW. CA does not recognize any other States permits.
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That's what I thought and since the average Schmuck in CA is denied CC, only special people will be carrying in Yosemite. My local Sheriff thinks I'm special, but not in the sense that he would issue me a permit.
 
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