stagpanther
New member
Ended up raising the rings in order to clear the magnification lever, which it does just barely even with high rings.
Model 70 sporter in 270 Weatherby magnum
- Thread starter stagpanther
- Start date
Stag,
EGW base might work well for you. They are pretty tall. Even my 50mm Sightron STAC uses low rings when combined with the EGW base.
Also, for a magnum, for 200 yard zero, your probably a lot closer if you do 1-1,1/4" high.
Heck, my non magnum cartridges are only at 1.5" high at 100 for a 200 yard zero.
EGW base might work well for you. They are pretty tall. Even my 50mm Sightron STAC uses low rings when combined with the EGW base.
Also, for a magnum, for 200 yard zero, your probably a lot closer if you do 1-1,1/4" high.
Heck, my non magnum cartridges are only at 1.5" high at 100 for a 200 yard zero.
stagpanther
New member
That's the beauty of Weatherby magnum hunting cartridges--they have an extensive point-blank range relative to the kill zone size. They may not print sub .5 MOA--but if they can hold around MOA through that trajectory--that's a great benefit for serious hunters. I had an extra set of Leupold high rings on hand which I already installed and re-installed the scope to. I worked on the owner's newer MK 5's which he installed the same scope on--but Weatherby's bolts have a different lug system resulting in a shorter bolt handle throw. This gun was the one he replaced with the MK 5--but I'm getting more confident I can get it to shoot nearly as well--maybe as well-- as the newer gun.
44caliberkid
New member
At Christmas time a friend showed me a pre-64 Model 70 he inherited from his grandfather. The action was amazingly smooth, beautiful rifle. Made me want one, since I love vintage firearms. I found one at a gun shop in 300 H&H. He wouldn't take my offer but it isn't moving either. I'll give it another try at the end of the month.
stagpanther
New member
The receivers are built like tanks--and the pre-64's have the highly-desirable controlled-feed mauser style bolt. Many think the switch to the push feed bolt was the death knell of the post-64 model 70's--though the receiver is still "a monster."
reynolds357
New member
I like the push feed model better. Control feed being more reliable is a myth that has been repeatedly debunked.The receivers are built like tanks--and the pre-64's have the highly-desirable controlled-feed mauser style bolt. Many think the switch to the push feed bolt was the death knell of the post-64 model 70's--though the receiver is still "a monster."
stagpanther
New member
It's probably a historical context thing--though apparently big 5 dangerous game hunters can make a pretty good argument for control feed. The safety is just a tad kludgy for my tastes but bomb-proof simple in stopping the firing pin, otherwise I really love the over-all design of the receiver. The only other small beef I'd address would be having a bolt knob with better scope clearance. The Weatherby ammo finally came in (I shot a few of my own 130 gr Berger hunting hybrid handloads and they did quite well--but they only shoot weatherly factory stuff) and today looks like the only break I have in our stormy weather weather to try em out, it's 5 degrees outside right now.
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stagpanther
New member
I went out and tried the factory weatherby stuff--which generally shoots very well and consistently in the other weatherby rifles I've shot it through. Temperature was around 20, but after a couple of groups that flew really wide I decided to put the cartridges in my pocket and shoot them pretty fast. This group was the best I could do--but I wouldn't represent it as "typical all-day long" It's average velocity was 200 fps slower than what weatherby lists on their box, though the SD was a very acceptable 11 fps (out of 8 shots recorded). This group took everything I had to steady on the rests, and obviously will not be a reliable indicator of what to expect shooting while hunting. The barrel is free-floated, but I'm not convinced that's such a great idea with this particular cartridge and a fairly slim sporter profile barrel. I'm sure there's a very good reason Weatherby chooses to put a pressure point on the larger magnum sporter barrels, I'm guessing it has to do with timing and barrel "whiplash"--but that's a bit above my pay grade and would certainly welcome commentary by Bart and/or unclenick on that. In any event, I'm going to tell the owner's daughter we need to go out and do a session together to get this rifle tuned to her shooting style. The trijicon scope generally shoots well, but I found shooting into the sun--hard with any optic--was especially bad with it.
Attachments
Yup! That's minute of barn door accuracy right thar!!! 
My advise....
Take a piece of cardboard, and wedge between the barrel and forestock. You can play with position and how thick. Then mark forestock ( NO, NOT a permenant Sharpie!!) and lay in some fibreglass matting (YES, with the resin) for your pressure point.
Ruger 77 has pressure point in their forestock. Removing it voids any accuracy warranty.
My advise....
Take a piece of cardboard, and wedge between the barrel and forestock. You can play with position and how thick. Then mark forestock ( NO, NOT a permenant Sharpie!!) and lay in some fibreglass matting (YES, with the resin) for your pressure point.
Ruger 77 has pressure point in their forestock. Removing it voids any accuracy warranty.
stagpanther
New member
Thanks for the suggestion--I thought about that but I need to clear with her daddy first.
stagpanther
New member
you are a bad boy...no soup for you!
After doing that, will the pressure on the barrel always be the same regardless of how the rifle's held when fired?
stagpanther
New member
That's a problem right there--I know sometimes it will be freehand shot (though my guess pretty rarely) otherwise braced on a pack, tree branch or stand rail. I thought maybe just putting some spacer material in the area atop the front sling swivel might be a good idea?
On a different note, the chamber throat/freebore must be amazingly long (or perhaps worn)--using a modified gage I couldn't get a 129 gr LRX to engage the lands without falling out of the case mouth.
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When the round fires, the barreled action starts vibrating. So does the stock fore end. All before the bullet leaves. If you think the barrel should vibrate the same for each shot fired, shouldn't there be ample clearance from barrel to stock to let that happen?
As the stock also vibrates, if it's resting on anything hard it'll bounce off it. Amount varies with how hard it is.
https://www.varmintal.com/amode.htm
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stagpanther
New member
Theoretically--yes. But there are two separate things going on--the whip of the barrel, and the foreend is also flexible enough, even though it's wood, that it bends even under light pressure so that the "rebound" could vary from one shot to the next. I think to truly free float the barrel I'd need to take down the channel quite a bit and then bed the entire stock.
Why not epoxy bed just the receiver and totally free float the barrel so the stock fore end and barrel can whip and wiggle at their own resonant and harmonic frequencies? Especially those of the barrel. External force on the fore end will bend it so some clearance to the barrel is needed else the barrel will whip and wiggle different from shot to shot.
That's the standard procedure for match winning record setting bolt action target rifles.
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Both styles proved equally reliable in NRA high power competition rapid fire matches shooting 10 shot strings in 60 seconds. Big game guides in Africa liked big bore bolt guns on Winchester 70 and magnum mauser 98 style control feed actions reliability.
Remington's 700 and 40X were problems with broken extractors and feeding rounds from magazines. These box magazine actions are less than half as stiff as the Winchester 70 ones.
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Ok, 2 things...
First, the Weatherby Magnums use lots of freebore. To get speed, you need pressure. And Weatherbys are all about speed. If the bullet is contacting the lands, you can get quite a pressure spike. Sudden raises in pressure (spike) are not desirable. And if bad enough can be flat out dangerous.
Weatherby combats the pressure spike by giving the bullet a good jump. (this is a lesson learned from single shot, lever, and auto/semi auto firearms). While this helps keep spikes in check, when making the cartridge, you want as little bullet runnout as possible.
Theory, the straighter the bullet when it contacts the rifling, the straighter it comes out of the muzzle.
Second,
With changing shooting rests, comes changing pressure on the forestock. (as long as it's rested on the forestock and not the barrel, i see it all too often!)
With a raised pressure point, it won't matter where the pressure is applied from a rest, it will still transfer to that raised pressure point between the stock and barrel.
Another option would be to full length bed, ala Melvin Forbes with his Forbes, and now New Ultra Light Arms.
Doing this gives zero flex on the stock, although the stock needs to be fairly stiff to begin with.
And i'd use Devcon for this, not Acraglass.
First, the Weatherby Magnums use lots of freebore. To get speed, you need pressure. And Weatherbys are all about speed. If the bullet is contacting the lands, you can get quite a pressure spike. Sudden raises in pressure (spike) are not desirable. And if bad enough can be flat out dangerous.
Weatherby combats the pressure spike by giving the bullet a good jump. (this is a lesson learned from single shot, lever, and auto/semi auto firearms). While this helps keep spikes in check, when making the cartridge, you want as little bullet runnout as possible.
Theory, the straighter the bullet when it contacts the rifling, the straighter it comes out of the muzzle.
Second,
With changing shooting rests, comes changing pressure on the forestock. (as long as it's rested on the forestock and not the barrel, i see it all too often!)
With a raised pressure point, it won't matter where the pressure is applied from a rest, it will still transfer to that raised pressure point between the stock and barrel.
Another option would be to full length bed, ala Melvin Forbes with his Forbes, and now New Ultra Light Arms.
Doing this gives zero flex on the stock, although the stock needs to be fairly stiff to begin with.
And i'd use Devcon for this, not Acraglass.
The fore end is not as stiff as the barrel. Measure them and you'll find out. Competitive shooters know this as the sling's changing force on the forends moves point of impact most notably with M1 and M14 rifles. Especially when slung up in prone wherein the point-of-impact moves horizontally as the front elbow position changes left or right.
Note the force on the barrel at that point will vary which changes the spread of line of fire to the line of sight.
Note the recoil axis (the bore axis) on those Forbes rifles is above the butt plate and the rifle's center of mass. That'll bend and flex the stock from recoil during barrel time. Exactly like all conventional stock shapes. It also makes the barrel bend during barrel time. Melvin Forbes is either ignorant or false advertising.
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