Minimum Wage Clerks Interpreting Your Rights
- Thread starter Rich Lucibella
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Rich Lucibella
Staff
Kodiac-
I do hedge. The Mad Dog Micro is a sub 4" ceramic which goes in my carry on with the Cricket. Additionally, if traveling to a foreign country (like California) where I can't have a firearm, the cane comes along.
Hal-
You make valid observations. Perhaps my anger over this situation resulted in a less than optimal thread title. It's a testimony to the Members here that the point was not misconstrued, however. We're talking about clerks abuse of power.
I commend all who work for their families...regardless of wage. Like Long Path I did the graveyard shift for Pinkertons at the Omaha Civic Center thru grad school...min wage. Screws up your sleep schedule, but allows you to study while earning a living.
However, if the free market works, we must assume that hourly wage reflects education and experience...sure, there's a lot of exceptions, but these do not negate the general rule. My point was that it offends me to have people interpreting my rights who have no idea how to go about that, and no interest in exhibiting the requisite responsibility that goes with the authority.
It doesn't require a college degree to admit that you're wrong when it's calmly pointed out. However, a more experienced person might not take it as a direct affront to their precious authority. How do you get someone more experienced? Pay more...at least for one person at each gate.
Case in point. I went to the Prescott, AZ Courthouse yesterday, empty holster and mag pouch on my hip. Emptied my pockets for the two cops there. What's this? Oops, those are two Marine issue magnesium fire starters that Mad Dog just gave me. We had a brief informational conversation and I was given a receipt. No problem. What do you think the PBI drones' reaction would have been? Guaranteed, I'd have missed that flight.
If the airports can't afford to have someone of the training level of a police officer to arbitrate such issues or a Disney type hierarchy which can get a real supervisor on site in minutes, so be it. I just don't have to like it or accept it. I don't and I don't. BTW, I fly thru Dallas at least once a month...I've found the security there polite and efficient.
Rich
I do hedge. The Mad Dog Micro is a sub 4" ceramic which goes in my carry on with the Cricket. Additionally, if traveling to a foreign country (like California) where I can't have a firearm, the cane comes along.
Hal-
You make valid observations. Perhaps my anger over this situation resulted in a less than optimal thread title. It's a testimony to the Members here that the point was not misconstrued, however. We're talking about clerks abuse of power.
I commend all who work for their families...regardless of wage. Like Long Path I did the graveyard shift for Pinkertons at the Omaha Civic Center thru grad school...min wage. Screws up your sleep schedule, but allows you to study while earning a living.
However, if the free market works, we must assume that hourly wage reflects education and experience...sure, there's a lot of exceptions, but these do not negate the general rule. My point was that it offends me to have people interpreting my rights who have no idea how to go about that, and no interest in exhibiting the requisite responsibility that goes with the authority.
It doesn't require a college degree to admit that you're wrong when it's calmly pointed out. However, a more experienced person might not take it as a direct affront to their precious authority. How do you get someone more experienced? Pay more...at least for one person at each gate.
Case in point. I went to the Prescott, AZ Courthouse yesterday, empty holster and mag pouch on my hip. Emptied my pockets for the two cops there. What's this? Oops, those are two Marine issue magnesium fire starters that Mad Dog just gave me. We had a brief informational conversation and I was given a receipt. No problem. What do you think the PBI drones' reaction would have been? Guaranteed, I'd have missed that flight.
If the airports can't afford to have someone of the training level of a police officer to arbitrate such issues or a Disney type hierarchy which can get a real supervisor on site in minutes, so be it. I just don't have to like it or accept it. I don't and I don't. BTW, I fly thru Dallas at least once a month...I've found the security there polite and efficient.
Rich
You know, the more threads I read here, the more Mykl's sig applies or correlates.
One reason that you didn't have problems at the Prescott Courthouse is that you were dealing with professionals, who probably were paid as such, at least in relation to a rent-a-cop.
With any job or profession: If you pay peanuts, expect to draw monkeys.
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Will you, too, be one who stands in the gap?
Matt
One reason that you didn't have problems at the Prescott Courthouse is that you were dealing with professionals, who probably were paid as such, at least in relation to a rent-a-cop.
With any job or profession: If you pay peanuts, expect to draw monkeys.
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Will you, too, be one who stands in the gap?
Matt
At the risk of deviating (just a bit [g]) from the thread -- I forgot to mention that I always make the ticket counter people ASK for my ID. I'm fighting a rear-guard action, fighting against people being conditioned into showing ID without being asked.
One time I asked the male agent what the ID criteria was, thinking of using a homeowner's assn. ID just for kicks. He told me in an open and friendly manner, "Any State of Federal ID, such as . . . ". The female clerk GLARED at me as if to say "How DARE you question us?". She was REALLY steamed. I felt my work was done there,
and happily boarded the plane.
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If you can't fight City Hall, at least defecate on the steps.
One time I asked the male agent what the ID criteria was, thinking of using a homeowner's assn. ID just for kicks. He told me in an open and friendly manner, "Any State of Federal ID, such as . . . ". The female clerk GLARED at me as if to say "How DARE you question us?". She was REALLY steamed. I felt my work was done there,
and happily boarded the plane.
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If you can't fight City Hall, at least defecate on the steps.
Mike Spight
New member
Rich, et al:
Amazing...I too worked as a security guard for about one year after starting college on the GI bill. Worked the night shift, came home and slept for about 3 hours...got up and went to class, studied and wrote...slept for about 3 more hours and went back to work.
On reflection after 25 plus years, it was really pretty scary...I worked for the company for about 2 weeks and was made the site supervisor at the plant we provided contract security for. Some of the old boys I worked with were good people, but not exactly the brightest light on the tree. But, it was the best they could do, and God bless em, they didn't go on welfare.
Mike
Amazing...I too worked as a security guard for about one year after starting college on the GI bill. Worked the night shift, came home and slept for about 3 hours...got up and went to class, studied and wrote...slept for about 3 more hours and went back to work.
On reflection after 25 plus years, it was really pretty scary...I worked for the company for about 2 weeks and was made the site supervisor at the plant we provided contract security for. Some of the old boys I worked with were good people, but not exactly the brightest light on the tree. But, it was the best they could do, and God bless em, they didn't go on welfare.
Mike
Several years ago, in another job that required me to travel extensively by commercial air, I was stopped at security (can't remember the airport, just the incident) after they x-rayed my briefcase. The security woman asked me to open my briefcase, then took my case of titanium darts that I ALWAYS carried with me, and told me that they could not be allowed on the plane.
I was astonished. I had been carrying that case of three darts and several replacement flights in my brief case for two years and had never been questioned. I stated as much, so the supervisor was called, then the supervisor's supervisor. Ultimately, someone said that I couldn't take them onboard without the pilot's approval!
One of the crowd of uniforms went and got the pilot, who had just arrived at the nearby gate. He came over, was apprised of the situation, and basically said, "Good God, don't you people have anything better to do? Let him go through!"
I guess this topic isn't a recent phenomenon.
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Gun control is being able to hit your target.
[This message has been edited by whitebear (edited September 21, 1999).]
I was astonished. I had been carrying that case of three darts and several replacement flights in my brief case for two years and had never been questioned. I stated as much, so the supervisor was called, then the supervisor's supervisor. Ultimately, someone said that I couldn't take them onboard without the pilot's approval!
One of the crowd of uniforms went and got the pilot, who had just arrived at the nearby gate. He came over, was apprised of the situation, and basically said, "Good God, don't you people have anything better to do? Let him go through!"
I guess this topic isn't a recent phenomenon.
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Gun control is being able to hit your target.
[This message has been edited by whitebear (edited September 21, 1999).]
My problem was at the Oakland County (MI) Courthouse. No knives allowed, they take them and you never get them back. I dumped everything that had anything that even looked like a knife blade in my briefcase and locked it in the car. Except I forgot my money clip which had a tiny pair of scissors and nail file (about 1" long). The male Courthouse Security Officer checked them out and was going to send me on my way, a female officer wanted to take the money clip. She was over ruled by others at the gate/door. She was not so worried about the nail file, I think, but was more interested in getting the money clip for herself since the clip is made from silver with a jade dragon inlay.
The funny thing was that there was a pair of scissors laying out where the public could reach them with blades about 8" long.
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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
The funny thing was that there was a pair of scissors laying out where the public could reach them with blades about 8" long.
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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
Gwinnydapooh
Retired Screen Name
(Vigorous nodding of head)
Grayfox, careful with the jinx, man. We already have that (the law against "menacing blades") in Illinois. It's a state law against "dangerous blades," which, conveniently, have NEVER been defined in any law or court. Pick any knife blade you damn well please and write a paragraph about why it's dangerous. Good. Now write one about why it's not dangerous. Damn, that's stupid.
I feel kinda wimpy now, anyway. Knives are banned at the school where I student teach and I've just been leaving mine in the car. I doubt I'd ever be caught but why take the chance as a student teacher? Try telling your average dorky liberal principal it took you five years to get your certificate because you got thrown out of your first student teaching situation for carrying illegal weapons . . . .
As for "clerks" interpreting your rights, the thing that really pisses me off is going on here at my college. I'm an RA (Resident Assistant, kind of an underpaid security, fixit, mommy-to-freshmen kind of job) and I recently found out that some of my fellow RA's told their residents in the first hall meetings that no knives would be allowed in dorms and any found would be confiscated. That would be fine if it were the rule, but IT's NOT. WE hand out the rule books and they started the year by lying about the rules. There are rules against guns, fireworks, combustibles, etc, but nothing against knives. I know it's just a college job but I can't believe these *******s can't take it a little more seriously than to LIE to their residents about the rules we're supposed to enforce!!!
Grayfox, careful with the jinx, man. We already have that (the law against "menacing blades") in Illinois. It's a state law against "dangerous blades," which, conveniently, have NEVER been defined in any law or court. Pick any knife blade you damn well please and write a paragraph about why it's dangerous. Good. Now write one about why it's not dangerous. Damn, that's stupid.
I feel kinda wimpy now, anyway. Knives are banned at the school where I student teach and I've just been leaving mine in the car. I doubt I'd ever be caught but why take the chance as a student teacher? Try telling your average dorky liberal principal it took you five years to get your certificate because you got thrown out of your first student teaching situation for carrying illegal weapons . . . .
As for "clerks" interpreting your rights, the thing that really pisses me off is going on here at my college. I'm an RA (Resident Assistant, kind of an underpaid security, fixit, mommy-to-freshmen kind of job) and I recently found out that some of my fellow RA's told their residents in the first hall meetings that no knives would be allowed in dorms and any found would be confiscated. That would be fine if it were the rule, but IT's NOT. WE hand out the rule books and they started the year by lying about the rules. There are rules against guns, fireworks, combustibles, etc, but nothing against knives. I know it's just a college job but I can't believe these *******s can't take it a little more seriously than to LIE to their residents about the rules we're supposed to enforce!!!
Two of us had been through the metal detector routine at a Philadelphia courthouse before. The person I was with was licensed to carry concealed and had checked his piece and spare ammo in at the security booth each time we visited the building. I had divested myself of anything controversial, save for a Kershaw Multitool. I handed the gadget to my companion before we reached the metal detector and he was able to check it in with the revolver.
However, the last time we went to the courthouse, the person I was with was told that the multitool was prohibited on that floor. While he was able to check in a .357 Magnum stoked with full power loads, he was told that the deadly multitool had to be removed immediatly or there could be legal consequences. I was able to find a ground floor customer service booth to babysit the Kershaw.
Once while passing though an airport detector with a few other people to wait for some folks to disembark, I had to switch on the MiniMaglite and Surefire 9P torches I was carrying that night. The airport staffers wanted to confirm that they were working flashlights, not something else.
Hmmmm...if I had carried a large flashlight in, they would have really had a fit.
Jeff
However, the last time we went to the courthouse, the person I was with was told that the multitool was prohibited on that floor. While he was able to check in a .357 Magnum stoked with full power loads, he was told that the deadly multitool had to be removed immediatly or there could be legal consequences. I was able to find a ground floor customer service booth to babysit the Kershaw.
Once while passing though an airport detector with a few other people to wait for some folks to disembark, I had to switch on the MiniMaglite and Surefire 9P torches I was carrying that night. The airport staffers wanted to confirm that they were working flashlights, not something else.
Hmmmm...if I had carried a large flashlight in, they would have really had a fit.
Jeff
David Wright
New member
Rich, several years ago, that same company asked my wife as she was going thru to help "test" the orangutans, uh, security folks.
The supervisor gave her a wooden form wrapped in foil that looked like a semi-auto. He went with her to the x-ray. My wife thought it would be easy to spot, especially since it was bigger than a Desert Eagle and the supervisor was standing right there and watching over this nonsense.
Guess what? They missed it. Twice. The supervisor loses his cool and says, "Run it again!" to the orangutans. They finally spot it. Give-em a banana!
So, what if someone breaks a large shard of thick "security" glass, wraps a lot of duct tape around it for a handle and adds a string for hanging on the neck, gets on a plane, and in midair grabs a baby or small child for social leverage? Who's running the plane then? Oh, sorry, my mistake. Can't happen.
The orangutans would have spotted it.
Seriously, just for amusement, even though I am retired (or is it just, tired), I would almost do this job for free. My job would be, at my discretion when and where, to check airport security.
DFW would be my first choice. Pass the bag through, then show my i.d., and say, why didn't you see that MP5 in the bag? Go get your supervisor. Hey, I can dream can't I?
Oh, and getting low pay is no excuse for sloppy work. That nonsensical arguement didn't fly back in my day, and shouldn't be tolerated now, IMHO.
Same as it ever was......
The supervisor gave her a wooden form wrapped in foil that looked like a semi-auto. He went with her to the x-ray. My wife thought it would be easy to spot, especially since it was bigger than a Desert Eagle and the supervisor was standing right there and watching over this nonsense.
Guess what? They missed it. Twice. The supervisor loses his cool and says, "Run it again!" to the orangutans. They finally spot it. Give-em a banana!
So, what if someone breaks a large shard of thick "security" glass, wraps a lot of duct tape around it for a handle and adds a string for hanging on the neck, gets on a plane, and in midair grabs a baby or small child for social leverage? Who's running the plane then? Oh, sorry, my mistake. Can't happen.
The orangutans would have spotted it.
Seriously, just for amusement, even though I am retired (or is it just, tired), I would almost do this job for free. My job would be, at my discretion when and where, to check airport security.
DFW would be my first choice. Pass the bag through, then show my i.d., and say, why didn't you see that MP5 in the bag? Go get your supervisor. Hey, I can dream can't I?
Oh, and getting low pay is no excuse for sloppy work. That nonsensical arguement didn't fly back in my day, and shouldn't be tolerated now, IMHO.
Same as it ever was......
Rich Lucibella
Staff
To all the airport security lurkers who might ever visit this Board:
If you understand the job and walk the fine line between doing your job and being a common nuisance, we commend you.
If you do not, thanks for affording us this opportunity to rant and, please, grow up!
If you work the PBI Sunday morning, Concourse C shift - with all due respect....Bite Me!
I'm your worst enemy.
Time to start Part Deux, if anyone has an inkling.
Rich
If you understand the job and walk the fine line between doing your job and being a common nuisance, we commend you.
If you do not, thanks for affording us this opportunity to rant and, please, grow up!
If you work the PBI Sunday morning, Concourse C shift - with all due respect....Bite Me!
I'm your worst enemy.
Time to start Part Deux, if anyone has an inkling.
Rich
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