Mild Recoiling Intermediate Calibers?

B

Big Tom

New member
Hi guys I had a few questions since I am looking to get into hunting next year. I currently have an H&R Ultra Varmint in .223 and was going to get a new barrel for it when I found out H&R had closed shop...like 2 a while ago now. I confess I have been too busy with work to pay much attention to much firearms news these last few years working overtime to get to this point of a bit more comfort.

Well here's my thing the H&R is rather heavy with that bull barrel and I was thinking that maybe the .223 would not be as effective as some other calibers anyway for white tail. I am recoil sensitive in my shoulder due to sustaining a few injuries when I played football and being in a few car accidents. I was considering a .25-06, .22-250, or something else. I am able to get .25-06 practice ammo for pretty reasonable at .88 cents a round at my local gun shop. but .243 was way higher cost wise at about $1.10 a round.

Any advice for me? And also how is a .25-06 on recoil? And also would it be a decent round for Elk? To compare I've shot a winchester 94 that was a .30-30 and it tore me up pretty good. It took almost a week for the sharp pain to go away. Your suggestions are appreciated.
 
Hi. A .25-06 using 100 grain bullets has a bit more recoil energy than a 100 grain .243.
The cost of the ammo is really not something to consider anyway. .25-06 isn't a really common cartridge in most Eastern States either. Assuming The First State is East.
Your issue is more about the weight of the rifle. In the .30-30(a 6/7ish pound .30-30 just hurts to shoot. Far too much felt recoil for the power of the cartridge.) and the H&R(not gone according to their site.) at 7 to 8 pound single shot, you're going to feel it.
A great deal depends on what is wrong with your shoulder and where you are(no deer hunting with a semi in PA, for example, but look into a semi-auto chambered in .25, .26 or .27 calibre if elk are on the menu.
 
A few years ago I bought a low recoiling rifle for my wife. It was a 260. I worked up loads for it and decided I really liked everything about it. Think of it as a 270 Lite. Shoot 100 gr Nosler BT's in it and recoil is barely more than my 223. I highly recommend it, or the 6.5 Creedmore, which is a ballistic twin.

The wife decided that she didn't really want to hunt, so I took it for my own and parked the 270.
 
If you look around you'll find cheaper 243 ammo than 25-06 ammo, recoil is much better too. In reality the 243 does everything a 25-06 does and it does most of them better. Both are borderline acceptable for elk size game, both are just about perfect for deer size game. I wouldn't pick either as an elk round, but if either were all I owned it wouldn't stop me from hunting.

243 and 30-30 have about the same recoil, but the difference is in the rifles. All lever actions have 19th century stock designs that really make recoil seem much worse than the numbers say it should be. A 243, 30-30 or even a 308 from a modern designed stock will feel much more comfortable to shoot.

The 6.5 Creedmoor is the hot round right now. Recoil is only slightly more than 243 and performance is close enough to 270 to call a tie.
 
6.55x55 or the 7mm-08 --- Go for the vitals on an elk, and maybe stay off a shoulder shot. Barnes TTSX bullets might be the ticket for elk.

My 6.55x55 Swedish Mauser is a sweet low recoiler.
 
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I have a CZ 527 in 7.62x39...recoils a little harder than my browning x bolt in .223 but not bad at all.

Not a hunter but I'm sure it would do what you need it to.
 
Lots of folks are taking deer with 223's. A 25/06 blasts out the same gas jet as a 30/06 and Newton's second applies to gas as much as lead.
 
Take a hard look at the stock of the rifle. A stock that fits well with a decent recoil pad goes a long way to reducing "felt" recoil. If the 30-30 you shot was the typical Winchester/Marlin lever carbine, it has a classic look, but definitely not the best recoil absorbing design.

I love the 6.5x55, but in your case I definitely recommend the .243. Just find one that fits and has a good pad, or get one installed.

PS: I am not a big fan of the .223 for deer, just because there are better rounds out there. But if I were in a survival situation, I have no doubt I could bring down a whitetail quickly with my AR. If you're a good shot, look to the availability of ammo with, say, Sierra GameKing 65's, and shoot what you have.
 
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I don't know the laws in your state, but an AR-15 in medium game suitable calibers like 6.5 Grendel, 6.8SPC, and 30 Rem AR. All three of them are easy enough to find and recoil will be very mild. My 7 year old nephew shoots my 6.5Grendel and with a 123gr SST at 2450fps recoil is very little and kills deer handidly.

In a bolt gun a 6.5x55 or 6.5 Creedmoor would be easily enough for deer and recoil would be easy to handle.
 
The .243 Win or the 6.5 Creedmoor are more than adequate for deer and they have relatively light recoil. For elk I would go with the 7mm-08 at a minimum. Remember that recoil is based on simple physics (mostly weight) and to some extent the ergonomics of the stock. I like all three calibers but for hunting the 7mm-08 is the best of the three. The 25-06 is ok in a heavy gun (long action). I had one in an old Savage 110 that had light recoil and was extremely accurate. If you are concerned about pain, I would probaby invest in a brake, regardless of caliber. Be sure to get a screw in muzzle cap since many guides do not allow braked guns on their hunts, if you ever decide to go that route.

The price of ammo is insignificant for a hunting gun. You buy a box or two of ammo, sight in the scope, do a check shot every once in awhile and you are good to go. A box of ammo with the right gun/scope combo should last you several seasons. I just bought a new box of ammo for my 7mm-08. Over the last few years I have shot 6 deer with that gun out of one box of ammo. The 14 other rounds were for sighting-in and for an occasional check shot.
 
If your shoulder really is a mess, the only choice I can think of is the .243or other 6mm round, 100-110 grain bullets that reach about 3,000fps. To move up to a larger bore requires heavier weights and charges to maintain ballistics.

The .250 savage would have been a good choice, but the .243 wound up being superior in my thinking about your needs. Plenty of great cartridges that are low recoil, sufficiently powerful and accurate for deer and elk. I would personally try out a 7-08 with a recoil pad, and if you're going to do a lot of shooting on the bench, get a lead sled or some other recoil reducing tool.
 
Sounds to me like you want a rifle that is easy on recoil and cheap to shoot. You already own a 223, so why not opt for a 7.62X39 bolt action? My 8 year old can shoot one with no discomfort. Out to 300-ish yds, it is a good deer/pig/medium game rifle, and at about $.32/shot it is also economical to shoot.
 
7.62 x 39 is about your only answer if a 30-30 has to much recoil for you. Go you not have friends with a SKS so you can try out a few shots before you spend money?
 
The .308 cartridge has a long and enviable reputation for being a very lethal killer of big game animals. Remington offers "Managed Recoil" ammunition which offers significantly less kick. Try it, you'll love it.

Jack
 
1. 25-06 on recoil?
2. And also would it be a decent round for Elk?
3. To compare I've shot a winchester 94 that was a .30-30 and it tore me up pretty good.
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1. Having to buy store ammo your held hostage to what the manufactures want to market. Shooting the 25-06s lighter bullets weights will certainly help in the recoil department. 87 gr. is preferable. Especially if intending to fire your rifle repeatedly.

2. I know a couple fellows who use their 25-06s for elk. Father & son team. They both prefer using the heaviest of 25 cal. bullets available. (117-120 gr.) for their big game hunts. One of the fellows goes so far as to have his friend (me) make custom loaded ammo for his rifle. A bullet weight & profile that my old friend promotes for the harvesting of big mule deer and elk that has worked well for him over the years is the Hornady 117 gr. Round Nose.

3. Yes sir those little Winny 30-30s can make the toughest hard core shooter wench with pain. Kind'a reminds me of shooting a 12 gauge sawed off with a 1-1/4 weight Ball slug. In comparison I found the Marlin model 336 30-30 for some reason not having such a bruising recoil as the Win 94s.
If intending to compare a Winny 94 to a 25-06?
The Winnys recoil seems to be very quick & sharp._ 1/4 bore 06 has more recoil poundage but too me it feels kind'a like spread out over a longer duration in time. More of a push than a sharp knuckled punch in feeling.
If wanting little to no felt recoil. 243 is best for that. 243 has always been a cartridge considered (#1) on the list for a Lady's use. But there is a major difference between the 25-06 & 243. In reality the 25-06 does have ability to take Elk and Big Mule deer without much difficulty for its shooter. A well placed rib shot on either animal. Little to no chase is required to retrieve their game. 243 in my experience would require a back of the Head Shot to get those same results. Good luck with your purchase Big Tom.
 
Big Tom asked:

Mild Recoiling Intermediate Calibers? Also decent round for Elk?

..... I am recoil sensitive in my shoulder due to sustaining a few injuries when I played football and being in a few car accidents.
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BT, That's quite a situation you are asking about!

Decent low recoiling rifles for elk would generally have:
Recoil Energies in the 18 to 22 ft-lb range.
Recoil Velocities in the 11 to 13 fps range.
That 223 for yours would be about 3 Energy and 5 Velocity.




The guys have listed many cartridge/rifle combinations that would figure between the above ranges.
Rather than giving you all the fish dinners, You can use this link to calculate these recoil numbers for yourself:
http://huntamerica.com/recoil_calculator/

You can use this link to estimate the weight of powder charge and bullet velocity needed in the above calculator.
http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/

You can get rifle weights from the manufacturer's website. Add about 1/2 Lb if you plan to add a scope on it.




I agree with jmr40 and ligonierbill in that;
"some 30/30 rifles stock designs that really make recoil seem much worse than the numbers say it should be"
and
"A stock that fits well with a decent recoil pad goes a long way to reducing felt recoil"
respectively.

Also, You can figure a muzzle brake will reduce those calculate recoil energies and velocities by about 50%.
The downside of a MB is the very loud sound!
You AND ANYONE AROUND YOU will have to use hearing protection when you shoot a rifle with a MB even while hunting.

...
 
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