Great discussion guys thank you. I remember when the Marine Corps still had us shooting irons on the rifle range before we switched over to the RCO. IMO, that move took all the basic fundamentals of marksmanship that we instilled in young marines away. Today, these guys don't have a clue how to shoot with back up sights.......anyways, I say that because I can appreciate using irons at the 500 (no sandbagging or bipod).....shooting a target at 1k with irons blows my mind haha!. I should have stated in my post that money was a concern, as much as I want the high end glass $1,000 just isn't in my budget. I'd like to think I'm a good enough shot to do it with a 10x, but based on the general consensus, you guys confirmed the viper HST for me. I wanted to talk myself out of it by buying the PA scope, but I think I'll roll with the vortex and use the mil discount.