Lever gun caliber choices.

A .45 Colt from a 26" barrel works like a CB cap from a .22. It's already pretty quiet. Cowboy loads are very quiet. Shoots about like a .22, as far as accuracy and drop are concerned. It's a fun little setup that didn't cost much, just the rifle for $500. All the supressors I see cost a kilobuck plus the NFA tax, plus a barrel thread. This doesn't mean I don't want one.
 
How's about;

A Marlin 336 in 30-30
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And a Magnum Research BFR in 30-30
MRBFR30-30.jpg


:eek: What? You said you wanted a lever-action and a revolver to share cartridges :p
 
http://www.garrettcartridges.com/
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BusGunner007, I am not trying to be rude or anything, but did you have a comment to make because that link says nothing to me other then maybe you are suggesting .44 or 44/70 as a caliber with no explanation of why, or maybe that they make good ammo, I don't know.

I link with no comment of your own is a little useless in most cases.
 
I went with .45 colt in my lever gun/wheel gun combo (Winchester 1892 sporter and 7.5 ruger new vaquero). If you are trying for subsonic, .45 colt sounds like the way to go. Personally I had a bit of buyers remorse as I've never handloaded before and it's basically a must if you want powerful tier 2 loads that can be used in both guns. The alternatives are expensive tier 2 loads from buffalo bore, anemic cowboy loads or +p loads that are only suitable for the lever gun. If I could go back, I may have gone with 44 mag. Definitely something to consider.
 
Personally I had a bit of buyers remorse as I've never handloaded before and it's basically a must if you want powerful tier 2 loads that can be used in both guns.
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This is new.

Now I am not planning on needing anything like +P ammo for either the revolver or the rifle, but are you saying that the Cowboy loads are too light and the hot loads too expensive and that nobody is making standard loads that would be suitable for hunting?
 
In my state I believe there are minimum fps requirement for hunting loads. 900 fps for a handgun, 1200 for a rifle. The stuff off the shelf won't provide this type of power. Buffalo bore does make tier 2 loads that exceed these requirements (also suitable for modern 45 colt revolvers) but they are definitely sold at a premium price. Most off the shelf 45 colt ammo is tier 1 pressure, not hard hitting but safe to fire in any 45 colt. Your best bet while hunting would be +p ammo but it is only safe to fire in select revolvers and rifles, definitely not my new vaquero.

So for sub sonic use, 45 colt might be your answer, I don't have experience with sub sonic or suppressed 45 colt loads.

For more information on the tiers of colt 45 loads, do a Google search for 45 colt in handloader mag.
 
45 Colt vs 44 mag

I think that for the purpose of of the original post, the 45 Colt makes the most sense. The two cartridges are nearly equal but the firearms too often are not. What I'm driving at is the 44 magnum rifling twist rate is in many instances too slow to stabilize heavier bullets unless fired at maximum velocity which would defeat the goal of remaining subsonic. In either cartridge it's more than likely that only handloads will give you exactly what you want. Personally, I think the whole, "Mare's Laig", concept is ridiculous, and will lose it's charm quickly. On the other hand, the idea of a suppressor has some merit. Yet the legal ramifications make it not worth it to me. The original Marlin Cowboy rifle has a 24" barrel. Loaded to 1050 fps, it's just not that loud. That should be subsonic down to 0 degrees Fahrenheit. The slightly technical aspects of the goals here almost require handloaded ammo. Remember, the speed of sound in air is variable according to temperature. A handy speed of sound calculator can be found here: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-speedsound.htm
 
It just looks like there are several factory .45 Colt loads that run from 850 to 1,000 FPS with 225+ Grain loads doing over 400FtLbs which is greater then standard .38SPL and .44SPL loads.

Maybe I should get the .357MAG version, I have my .357MAG Blackhawk and I can hunt subsonic with .38SPL loads with the suppressed rifle.

As for the mare's leg concept being ridiculous it's not a mare's leg when you add a full length rifle stock, I am making a new rifle and I have no idea why you keep bringing it up. It's will have the long gun aiming stability and a barrel longer then a hunting handgun, where is the problem?
 
You asked.....

I only posted once so it wasn't me that keeps bringing it up; at least not 'til now. In your first post you wrote:
Any thoughts on this?
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So, I think a 12" barreled levergun is ridiculous. But don't let it get under your skin; it's just my opinion. The only reason I'm responding is that I think some of your objectives are interesting and have merit; again, just my opinion. I would prefer if your experiment were conducted with a minimum 16" barrel and preferably a standard 20" carbine. But it's your experiment, not mine. By all means, go for it and let us know how it turns out. There are guns that I think are a lot more ridiculous than what you are thinking about. Like the Charger or Mossberg's tactical lever-action. I believe that people have a right to own an AR-15 if they so choose. But I don't want one.....that would be ridiculous!;) Aside from poking a little fun at the 12" barrel; constructively, I think a 20" barrel would have greater practical accuracy to a substantially longer range. Like 50 yards vs 100 yards. Of course, if you went with a Marlin you could easily add a scope, (I wouldn't, but it might be worth considering, if you don't think it would add too much to the ridiculous factor.). Cheers, Pathfinder.
 
Forgive me Pathfinder45 and thanks for your input, I did ask for it.

You know there is a reason I posted this in this threat category and not the NFA category, although a suppressor is part of the equation, it has almost no impact on the actual question because the loads I am asking about are predominantly all normally subsonic as is, they don't have to be specially made to be subsonic, they just come that way. I can walk into any LGS and there will normally be .38SPL, .44SPL, and .45 Colt right on the shelf and most will produce less then 1,000 FPS.

I hunt in Arizona high desert foot hills. Average range for a Javalina shot is around 50 yards max. Javalina in this country are a challenge to stalk.
 
It's growing on me....

......with the full size stock it's starting to make more sense. The short barrel makes room for the suppressor without making too long of a rifle. But then I guess you have an SBR to register as well as the suppressor..... If you went with a 16&1/4" barrel you could eliminate half your red tape; but then, would it be too long?
 
Too long, maybe, but yes, the short barrel was part of the equation, short barrel, less velocity, more ammo choices and a handy total length to the rifle.
 
Do you think it would be underpowered for the intended game?

I'll be in Arizona Mountain country within about 30 miles of the border. We get all kinds of activity out here. Game Wardens, Border Patrol, Illegals and their mules, drug runners, even National Guard. I'm thinking quiet hunting is the best kind of hunting to be doing these days, the less attention you attract the better.
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No for your intended task it would be fine. BUT, keep the paperwork on you at all times. The people you mentioned will be curious about someone running around with a SBR and suppressor under those conditions. You would draw less attention with a standard carbine lever action. And remember suppressed does not mean noiseless.

Jim
 
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