Let's speculate

O

OhioGuy

New member
So, the trend in guns since 2018 seems to be cramming more rounds into smaller guns. We've also seen more options for optics on more pistols, like the PPS M2 coming with a red dot from the factory, and CZ's new line of P-10 pistols already milled for optic plates.

More rounds in smaller spaces, plus an increase in support for carrying optics.

Will that trend continue from here? Do you see Sig making a P365X with larger dimensions and maybe 14-16 rounds to compete with the 43X and 48 from Glock? Or Glock single stacks with "MOS" optic cuts to compete with Walther?

Maybe a miniaturized Romeo sight from Sig to complement the 365?

Will anyone bother cramming more rounds of .40 or .45 into smaller spaces, or will 9mm continue to dominate? What about stuffing 12 rounds of .380 into a pocket gun?

Nothing's more fun than baseless speculation on the Internet! Let's hear it! :D

What would be on YOUR wish list?
 
I would love to see Walther come out with a PPS that has 10, or even 12 round, capacity in the same height as the current PPS with the 7 round magazine that I now CCW frequently. I think there is a good chance Walther will come up with something like that with what the competition has come out with from SIG and Glock.
 
Amen! I have the PPS M2 RMS-C. If they just upped the capacity along the lines of Sig, and kept the same dimensions, we'd have a carry pistol with optics and a 10/12/14 round capacity option. I'd be a happy camper.
 
Still pretty happy with my 5 shot .44 Special snubby made of steel and walnut. It’s light, accurate, always with me, and I shoot it pretty damn good, if I do say so.
 
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Do you see Sig making a P365X with larger dimensions and maybe 14-16 rounds to compete with the 43X and 48 from Glock?
Click to expand...

I don't think there are going to go backwards on the P365.

I think this came out before the G43X and G48...

https://www.sigsauer.com/store/p320-xcompact.html


Looking at the "new" G43X and G48 it seems like when Glock introduced the original G43. Some folks were all giddy over a revolver size and revolver capacity. These "new" pistols look like a G19 do-over with a lot of "Look at the Monkey" from Glock as they roll out two mediocre pistols with typical size and capacity.
 
My P365 is darn near perfect, can't imagine why they would fuss with it further except maybe a standardized rail. Sig was brilliant designing a double stack 9mm around a single stack micro CC pistol.

KelTec had a good thing with their P11 but dropped the ball with that awful trigger.
 
I think it makes sense for manufacturers to start including optics cuts and I think it's value added for the consumer. That said red dots on handguns have a way to go to get where they are on rifles, imo. The forces exerted on a red dot sitting on a stationary rail versus riding on a moving slide are very different. Even the most reliable pistol red dot doesn't currently come close to the most reliable rifle red dot. We can find well documented cases of them failing, including the Shield red dot.

Part of this isn't just the red dot itself, but mounting systems which involve intermediary plates that don't provide the stability of a 1913 rail and where screws can end up bearing the force depending on how the system is implemented, with some manufacturers better than others (I don't hear a lot good about Glock MOS).

Then you have the limitations of a single screen, which unlike a tube housing doesn't help create an alignment between your eye and the red dot. This leads to the need for many to have backup irons to help find the dot where on a rifle the housing provides that reference. On some of the very small pistols fitting both a miniature red dot and a pair of irons tall enough to be seen isn't always easy or might not fit someone's idea of concealable.

The single screen and in many cases exposed emitter means that rain, dirt, etc. can affect the dot far more than it would be on a red dot with a contained emitter. This could or could not be a problem. I'm not opposed to electronics, I use lights on pistols and whatnot, but this is a case where it's not just an electronic failure that could be a problem but a fault of the layout of the electronic design.

I'm very interested in the Aimpoint Acro as it addresses a lot of these issues, frankly most, and from a company with a solid reputation, albeit an expensive reputation. I also know plenty of people run red dots on pistols and work around or aren't bothered by what I mentioned. That's totally fine, my point is that, IMO, for pistol red dots to dominate like rifle red dots there are evolutionary developments still needed to get the average consumer onboars. Once those fixes are there and have been around for a few years so they've been replicated by cheaper Chinese based optics companies I really see them taking off, and maybe some prismatic optics or the like for those with astigmatisms.



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As far as more rounds in smaller packages, to me the only real mover there was the P365. The 43X and 48 sort of amuse me. We've seen this story before. The P6, P7, and a number of single stack S&Ws from the 3rd Gen series (and while I get that these were still larger pistols the concept is very similar). Now we're seeing a return to that from certain manufacturers as people seem to be willing to accept fewer rounds for easier concealability. Of course the P365 gets capacity in a small size, so good for SIG. But really those are older ideas reimagined.

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Seems to me, if you stretched the dimensions of the P365 to match the new Glocks, you'd likely fit 14 rounds where they fit 10. Which would basically be Glock 19 capacity in a Glock 43 width.

I happen to prefer the size of the Glock 43 x to the p365, the latter being just a little too small for me to shoot well.

I'd rather have a slightly larger gun with full size capacity.
 
Eh, more rounds=more weight. I like to keep my CCW under 22oz loaded on my hip for all day carry/comfort. If these subcompact 9mm keep adding more rounds, I might as well just carry a bigger gun with the same weight for a better sight radius/handling.

I imagine more red dots will be coming to the pistol market soon.

The Mossberg MC1sc has my attention at the moment. I like the disassembly with the easy to clean striker+channel.
 
The Glock 43x/48 have inefficient magazines. Aftermarket flush-fitting 15 rounders are in the works. That would make the 43x/48 much more compelling. If they catch on, I could see other manufacturers introducing similarly slim and reasonably hi-cap pistols. I could definitely see Sig releasing a 15-round version of the P365.

I think the optic cut fad is mostly because it's easy, marketable, and profitable for the manufacturers. It seems like optics aren't really where they need to be in terms of durability vs affordability. Some people have good luck with cheap stuff, but even the fancy ones aren't 100% and they cost as much as the pistol.

I'm also wondering about how wide the slide would have to be for a double-stack double-feed magazine. That's an easy round or two bonus right there.

There's no way we aren't going to see the new Glocks with optic cuts. I think Glock just wants to let the market saturate first so they can release them later as something new and exciting. It's probably why the accessory rails were omitted as well.

I'm also very curious about the Glock 46...
 
Interesting as the 'more rounds' gig seems like a big marketing push. 'Statistics'(yes, I know) show that 'needing' more than 4-5 rounds in the very unlikely scenario of self defense is very, very rare. BUT..more rounds=more sales. Also interesting is the 'revolver' section here, of the number of people who CCW with a wheel gun, often with 'only' 5 rounds..whatchathinkin'???
Comfy with firearm, both in carry and use, much more important than 'rounds carried, IMHO. Particularly when the 'more rounds' thing makes for a more uncomfortable handgun..Like Glock 26 and Sig 365, for me..I prefer a slimline grip..43 with +2/3 mag extension..DOH!!), 43x, 48..but because it's more comfy for me.
 
a lot of "Look at the Monkey" from Glock as they roll out two mediocre pistols with typical size and capacity
Click to expand...
Doesn't this belong in the 'why I hate glock' section?
How mediocre? $450, very reliable, very accurate, 10 rounds..great ergonomics..Oh, I see, it's from Glock so....->'mediocre...got it..
 
You can be comfy with a firearm and have more rounds. Statistically speaking you likely don't even need a firearm in the first place, yet many of us carry one still. Some want more capacity still. The 365 isn't as wide as a Glock 26, noticeably so.

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The trend is similar to smartphones. Cram more capacity and features into a smaller package. It’s nice but what we’ll see is that in a few years people will feel less compelled to upgrade.
 
I think we're already there to a point. Will the person with an "old" Shield feel the need to get a P365? I'm not sure. Some will care about those extra rounds, others won't. Almost everything now is striker fired polymer framed pistols. It's all the same pie and the question is what you can do to differentiate yourself from the competition to get the largest slice. To me people argue about differences in ergonomics and triggers that aren't nearly as dramatic to me as they seem to be to others. There's a lot less to customize than a phone.

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Yea I think we’re getting there. Many shield owners are definitely already at that point. I’m not sure if glock owners will have enough enthusiasm for another go after G43x/48

Another comparison: Marvel movies haha
 
kozak6 said:
The Glock 43x/48 have inefficient magazines. Aftermarket flush-fitting 15 rounders are in the works. That would make the 43x/48 much more compelling. If they catch on, I could see other manufacturers introducing similarly slim and reasonably hi-cap pistols. I could definitely see Sig releasing a 15-round version of the P365.

I think the optic cut fad is mostly because it's easy, marketable, and profitable for the manufacturers. It seems like optics aren't really where they need to be in terms of durability vs affordability. Some people have good luck with cheap stuff, but even the fancy ones aren't 100% and they cost as much as the pistol.

I'm also wondering about how wide the slide would have to be for a double-stack double-feed magazine. That's an easy round or two bonus right there.

There's no way we aren't going to see the new Glocks with optic cuts. I think Glock just wants to let the market saturate first so they can release them later as something new and exciting. It's probably why the accessory rails were omitted as well.

I'm also very curious about the Glock 46...
Click to expand...

http://soldiersystems.net/2019/03/04/shield-arms-15-round-glock-43x48-magazine/

Well well well... If these aftermarket magazines work reliably, then a Glock 48 will literally become a single stack Glock 19. Now THAT'S an actual advancement in my mind. Easier to conceal in more circumstances but without sacrificing capacity. I wouldn't get one because I think I need 15 instead of 10 rounds, but if I were to get something new I'd go with the bigger capacity.

Some people get optics thinking they'll somehow become better shooters through technology. There's a definite fad aspect to it. If statistics hold and the average defensive use is at 3 yards then sights likely make little difference. I mainly started carrying with an optic because I shoot them so regularly in competition and training. I'm used to it now and very efficient, but there was a very steep learning curve.

I dunno... A 43X or 48 with 15 rounds and a red dot? Hell, I just might sell my soul to Glock for that :)
 
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