Lady Cop Observed During Range Session - Oh My

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Jhp147 is correct. Civy here, but I shoot with some LEs at my club. Luckily, one is SWAT instructor. But they have often told me that the civilian team can generally out shoot them. The average LE spends limited time at the range. Their advice to me. If I'm near an LE that pulls his gun. Drop to the ground and take cover. I laughed. But they said they were dead serious.
 
Lol....some good chuckles out of all that....but it does seem to mirror society as a whole, those who like guns leo's or not learn them, those that dont,,,dont.......When I was in nashville I had the opportunity to watch some police shooters at the bourdeau academy some were soso and I watched with fascination and awe as this older cop with a wheel gun no less, shot quite effectively, but what caught my eye was the brass going behind him as he stroked that ejector rod......the guy was ejecting and reloading as fast as some of the really top line competion shooters ...I know that type of skill is honed from years of experience.
...fubsy
 
Okay, guess I should tag in again. Misslecop, the guys aren't there griping on their day off, it's duty time. I don't want to give the impression that all or even most cops are not safe or good shots, most are safe and most are at least decent, it's just that the bad ones are amazing. The good ones are there, too, and have shown they can do it not just at the range but when the shooting starts. I just get angry that the few who can't shoot don't seem to worry about it. I have seen some civilians do some scary things, too, but they didn't have the benefit of training that the LEOs had.
 
When I was an instructor for the dep`t we had revolvers. The reason I make this point is I don`t know if things have changed any since they switched to semi autos. Anyway, we had an excellent safety record. The only time we had problems was with outside agencies. This included the FBI who had to be some of the unsafest shooters who ever lived. The first, last and biggest thing we taught our recruits was safety. You can`t teach a love of firearms to those who aren`t interested, but you can at least teach them not to hurt themselves and others. We did have AD`s on the street, every dep`t does, but not on the range.
As far as working cops, I shot a competition with a couple of guys from the town where I live now. These guys shot one and two against some pretty good competition. I shot as a civilian since I wasn`t a cop in this state and took first using my Model 10. Still, my score wasn`t as good as theirs. I felt a little embarrassed even though These guys are 20-30 years younger than me. But wait`ll next year!
 
I think most of us who have spent any time 'at the range' have similar stories to relate. Again this is not to disparge all the LEOs, whose purpose is 'to protect and serve'. There are good cops and there are bad cops. They simply mirror society as a whole. And in our society there is good and bad everywhere.

What troubles me is that anytime an 'incident' involving a LEO (ie poor safety habits or not hitting the intended target) occurs, the public's perception of the law enforcement community's competency takes yet another major hit. Their job is tough enough without the unarmed citizenry continually losing faith in the officers' ability 'to protect and serve'. Even in the best of worlds, the LEOs usually get to a crime scene long after the fact.

So where does this leave the 'media' in all of this? On the one hand, their 'job' is to report the news. On the other hand, the 'agenda' set by HCI, Klinton, and others is to 'convince' private citizens to voluntarily give up the ability to protect themselves. Give up your weapons and don't worry: Let the 'cops' take care of the Bad Guys; it's, after all, their job.

Quite a dilemma for the 'media'!

Ned, I'm with you - the next time I see an officer draw his/her weapon, I'm hollering INCOMING! and running for cover... ;)






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...save the 2nd. No fate but what we make...
 
Lots of good stories on this topic, I have 2 typical stories. I'm in the USAFR currently and have to shoot M9 and M16 on occasion, since I used to have imput into who had to go shoot I was frequently the backup if someone scheduled could not fire. 1 time after sitting in the classroom portion of recurrent training, which is where you decide who is your compitition and who you need to watch so that you don't have a loaded weapon facing you on the range. I had decided that most people would not have a clue in my class of 15 except the ex Infantry, the ex Pararescue, and actually a woman who was ex AD army papershuffler. We all did fine except the overly gun-ho ex-grunt who couldn't but but half his rounds within the centermass circle on the target. All talk,I should have known, I guess they teach more suppressive fire technique than actual markmansship. I have one last comment about military range days, When shooting M9's you can always see how you did after a shooting sequence compared to your peers, the last time a cop, the ex-PJ, myself and a bunch of nurses and medics were shootingandyou start checkingout targets down the line, then counting heads to see if your assumptions about who the shooters in your group are. To my surprise, after counting down about ten targetsI found a target witha fist sized hole blown out centermass with a 40 y/o female nurse giving me the look like "you want a piece of that" So my premonitions are not perfect. Anyway, Male Female it doesn't matter much at the range, on Active Duty I would still rather have someone stronge enough to carry his rifle bullets and beans and carryhisown weight so you don't have to.
 
Once upon a time, law enforcement was like other professions in that a potential employee had to bring the basic skills to the table before he was hired.

Today, individual candidates who already possess some of the required skills are considered to be misfits, or worse.
 
A story on A&E had the cops in LA and showing their routine. One was a lady. They went to the range to qualify or something. Her gun jammed because it was so dirty! Can you imagine this? To top it off, the host tried to explain that this just goes to show you how dangerous it is to be a cop in LA (you just never know what might happen). I agree that you never know, but I think he (and probably most of the audience) missed the point entirely. He just talked in a low slow voice about the dangerous life they lead. (It is dangerous, don't misunderstand me, just trying to make the point.) bone
 
hankrearden98,

"Today, individual candidates who already possess some of the required skills are considered to be misfits, or worse."

You hit the mark. About eight years ago when a close friend was applying for LAPD he was told to keep his interest in guns under wraps. LAPD had no interest in hiring "gun nuts."

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So many pistols, so little money.
 
The badge.
The gun.

These two symbols are icons in American law enforcement. Unfortunately, 90% of LEOs only care for one- guess which one. Yes 90%- I believe only 10% at best are interested in firearms. Of the rest, many take the time to learn, and should be commended. But far too many seem to view firarms as a necessary evil. I have showed up on free range days and been the only officer in attendance!

Erik
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>At this point she gave up, shrugged her shoulders, made safe (didn't see if a live round was ejected when she locked the slide back) and wandered off in search of someone who knew which end the bang came out of.[/quote]

Which end the bang came out of... ha ha ha! Now pardon me while I clean spit
coffee off of the monitor... geez.
 
Here's one I forgot.....

A correctional officer was told to go to the line and empty her weapon. Well she did just that, all 16 rounds, no hearing protection, no eye protection. Finished off before the range master could stop her. Needless to say, she was sent home without qualifying.
 
I work in a state supported big(sort of) city hospital, and we get quite a few prisoners as patients. They are usually accompanied by 1 or 2 guards armed with S&W .38 spcl revolvers. Some guards are pretty squared away, bit most are less than "cream of the crop". On rare occasions, a prisoner tries to flee. My advice to my co-workers has always been to hit the deck if a guard has to draw his weapon. You just don't know where those bullets are going to go.
 
Utah Highway Patrol carries Beretta Cougers. Recently was told by a Local UHP guy, how when he went to qualify, he drew his gun but the "top part" stayed in the holster. Didn't know how that happened, but it had been "several months" since it had last been drawn. I'm familiar with Berettas, and I'm still trying to figure that one out. He also said that there were two others whose guns had started to rust really badly while in their holsters. That is just sad.

I am going into LE, but I shoot every chance I get. I honestly can't figure out why somebody who will probably have to use their gun sometime in their career won't even bother to pull it out the holster once in a while.
 
Erik:
There is nothing more frustrating than lining up the range for officers use, and then not have anyone show up. That bothers me a great deal.

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Maintain eternal vigilance. It is the people who are prisoners of their own ignorance about firearms that pose the greatest threat to our 2nd Amendment Rights.
 
Last year for christmas i gave one year memberships to my brother-in-law and two cousins who are leo's.One cousin was at the range everytime i went and thanked me all the time saying it was the best gift he ever got.The other cousin never even went to get the paper work done and get his membership card.My brother-in-law went one time on jan 5 1999 to do his paper work ,got his membership card and never went again,but always talked about being a member.I also no about 5 other leo from the neighborhood and have never seen them at the range.There are at least 50 police officers that are members who do come alot,but from what i see, i have to agree that at least 90% of all leo's do not like guns and would be kicked off alot of ranges for safty reasons.
Also my range does require one of their range officers to be on the lane at all times when any pd or federal agency is using the range because of unsafe practices and damage to the range by leo's.

KEVIN
 
It does not seem that things have changed much since I retired in '84. I used to say most officers, if offered their choice, would have taken the new Parker pen set over a new service pistol (revolver or semiauto.)
The "Nothing will happen to me" idea was around then too. The department had us shoot once a month, they had to force one officer to the range by telling him if he did not go he would be suspended w/o pay until he qualified. He was using the same S&W M-66 as the rest of the department and it took us over 10 minutes to get it cleaned enought so it could have the cylinder opened. Just from the slop that had been spilled on the revolver while in the holster.
I told my Sgt. that if the officer was ever sent to back me up on a hot call and I survived I would hunt down who ever hired the officer and kill him. Ya know he was never sent to be my back up on any call.

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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
One year I was assigned to one of the indoor ranges. We would run a winter (low light) cycle for qualification and it was mandatory.
When the indoor ranges were open, cops were allowed 50 rounds per month besides the cycle. If you were working, you could come down on your meal and shoot. If someone came in, even if I was busy or on meal myself, I`d run them through. It really just meant making sure they were safe. Not a big deal. I could eat in the control booth as easily as at my desk. Most instructors I worked with were gun buffs, so if you had a new toy you wanted to try out, as long as you had the ammo, you`d be more than welcome. I very rarely had anyone come in.
 
It wpold be really interesting to see how much money PD's allocate for training and especially ammo.
The PD guy here tell me that they have NO practice ammo unless they buy it themselves. Guess how many underpaid LEOs get much practice.
I know a female Deputy Sheriff who carries a 4" S&W 66 and routinely drops something like 4 or 5 points on qualification firing.
I'm Not at all politically correct and I dont doubt any of the stories about men or women LEO's who cant shoot. There usually is areason for it.



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Better days to be,

Ed
 
Since you're talking about LEO's training, I'll tell you guys something that will really scare you all. In my country (Brazil) there's only one ammo producer. LEO's and civilians can only buy imported ammo while traveling abroad. This creates a "little" problem: our bullets are increadibly EXPENSIVE. Our government has little money to train cops, and in my state that's what happens: cops train with the handgun, shotgun, submachinegun and carbines while in the academy, but they only fire 100 rounds in total. As you can see, it's just 25 rounds for each weapon. The result is scaring: some cops don't even konw how to reload their DA pistols. And oh yes, our government is trying to forbid guns for civilians. It is said that we don't need them...
 
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