Kimber does not stand behind its guns

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I'll jump on the wagon. I have two Kimbers, a Super Match and a Target II in 10mm both have been back to the factory on more than one occasion. The Target II was the worst. Bought it when they first came out and it was a total jamomatic. Turns out the cause was their early magazines which were total junk. Went back to them three times, once with a broken extractor. Finally got a hold of some Colt magazines which solved the jamming problems. Through out the frustration of it all Kimbers customer service acted like it was my fault and they were doing me a favor. On the Super Match I had to stake the barrel link pin to the link right out of the box and this is their top of the line gun.I've shot approx. 2000 rounds out of the Super when the rear sight fell apart, according to Kimber this is normal wear and my only course of action was to send them money for a new sight.
My 35 year old Colt Gold Cup with Ellison sights has never had a problem with 100 times the amount of rounds fired. I will never buy another Kimber product. I've learned my lesson and will stick to Colt in the future.
 
Sevens said:
A bit difficult to figure out exactly what you mean or are trying to say with the quoted text, but it seems to read that you are angry at Colt for the series 80/firing pin lock and would prefer Kimber for that reason? :confused:
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Angry? No. I simply wouldn't buy a new production Colt (actually, anything since the pre series 70). If I was in the market for another 1911, I'd choose Kimber over Colt. Now with that said, I'd buy another Dan Wesson over any other 1911 that's currently in production but that's besides the point.
 
My Kimber 1911 is roughly 10 years old with no issues. It is a much better gun than the Colt, Taurus, Springfield, Dan Wesson, or any other 1911 I've owned in the past. While it has performed perfectly since purchase, I will say that I simply like the S&W 1911 better. But 2nd place ain't bad.

My Kimber 84 has worked very well too. I guess I had better run out and buy a lottery ticket before my good luck runs out.
 
My first Kimber was garbage, the others were alright be even still, Kimbers are way overpriced for what they are and what they're made of.
 
Kimbers are way overpriced for what they are and what they're made of.
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Yep. There are much better 1911s from competing brands at every price point.

If I ever owned a Kimber, it would be from the time before Ron Cohen got there to send the quality tumbling downhill, just like he's been doing at SIG Sauer Inc. for the last decade.
 
Must admit Charter Arms quality control is below S&W etc. However, at least they have a fantastic life time warranty. The company does have a heart.;) Apparently, Kimber does not.
 
A few years back when interest in 1911s re-surged, a good friend of mine bought a Kimber. From day one he had feed and extraction problems. When he contacted Kimber they told him they wouldn't accept it back for warranty repair until it was broke in after 500 rounds. Like many handgun owners who only occasionally shoot, 500 rounds was more than a years worth of frustration and disappointment to my friend. It got so when he did shoot, he didn't shoot the Kimber because of it's issues. After a year and a half and 500 rounds he contacted Kimber again about the problem and they told him the gun was now out of warranty and he would have to pay to ship it and have it repaired. It appeared to me, at the time, with that policy, and a one year warranty, Kimber was preying on the high percentage of folks that bought a firearm and only shot the occasional one box of factory ammo 4 or 5 times a year. It also seemed at that time, Kimber targeted those types of folks to sell their firearms to and then further confused them with talk of 1911s being prone to being finicky and that they all needed a long period of "break-in".
 
Kimber takes out full page glossy adds in gun rags. They have good photos of their pistols. The are pretty and would make playboy proud. Dealt with them once. That was enough. Frame cracked on gun at 2000 rounds. Dennis told me a cracked frame on a gun was really no problem! After multiple trips back to Kimber each time coming back worse they sent me a new gun. Only after my gun dealer threatened to send back everyone he had.
Some folks get good ones and love them. But the point is a large companies guns should not be a crap shoot. Especially for what they ask for their cheap MIM part filled guns. No more for me. You make up your own mind.
 
I only dealt with Kimber once. I paid to send the gun back and in talking to CS he tells me there is rust on the barrel, that I am not taking care of the gun. My wife hit the roof, I keep my guns clean and it was spotless when I shipped it. Then the tried to say I was shooting a reloaded match ammo because a case feel into the box. They did clean it, but i will never send them another gun. That being saif both of my kimbers eat my reloadss and the triggers are great for carry gun.
I will not buy a new one the triggers are really spongy feeling, and not worth the money.
 
You could not give me a Mimber.

Well.... you could, but I would sell it for what I could get out of it and buy something worth having.
 
Kimber does not stand behind it's guns

I heard the same thing about this company. If I were to carry a single action .45, which I wouldn't, it would be a Colt. I carry a S&W CS45.
 
I t has to be remembered that originally, Kimber was a price point pistol selling pistols with lots of competition features at reasonable prices. When Kimber first started producing, Colts were pretty crappy. Kimber and others forced everyone's game to improve.

Unfortunately, as Kimbers became popular, their quality appears to have gone through the floor. My Kimber is an earlier one and is one of the best pistols I've ever gotten a hold of. However, I'd be very hesitant with their reputation now, to buy a new one.
 
As far as I can tell their bad reputation is exclusive to the internet.
I've never met a real person who's had an issue with them (beyond general 1911 mag issues), and a whole lot of people seem to own one. I never had any issues with mine.
As far as the OPs issue - it's to bad it wasn't covered, but it sounds to be an old shot out gun, and stuff breaks.
I'm not sure why shooters expect gun manufactures to offer life time warranties on their products when virtually every other mechanical devise is covered for 1-2 years.
 
You could not give me a Mimber.

Well.... you could, but I would sell it for what I could get out of it and buy something worth having.
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Funny coming from someone who owns Glocks and Kel-Tec's.....:rolleyes:

You don't think they use MIM? Colt uses it, everyone short of semi custom guns use MIM.

Typical Internet lore as usual.
 
Kimber has been plagued for years with poor QC and unreliable customer service. I hate to hear you are having problems but I am not really surprised.

I had 3 Kimber test guns and I had issues with all 3.
 
I t has to be remembered that originally, Kimber was a price point pistol selling pistols with lots of competition features at reasonable prices. When Kimber first started producing, Colts were pretty crappy. Kimber and others forced everyone's game to improve.

Unfortunately, as Kimbers became popular, their quality appears to have gone through the floor. My Kimber is an earlier one and is one of the best pistols I've ever gotten a hold of. However, I'd be very hesitant with their reputation now, to buy a new one.
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Earlier Kimbers were great. Then the company got Ron Cohen'd and has never recovered -- quality-wise, that is, as they're doing more than fine financially. SIG Sauer Inc. (not SIG Sauer GmbH, though the German Sig will be strictly a thing of the past within a year) has been undergoing the Cohen treatment for the last decade. American Sigs are a pale shadow of what they were before Cohen arrived in 2004. Hopefully someone changes course when he leaves, but I wouldn't count on it. His vision is great for maximizing a company's profit -- for a time, at least.

As far as I can tell their bad reputation is exclusive to the internet.
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It's certainly more prevalent on the internet, but your average gun store visitor is an extremely low-information buyer. They look at pretty photos in gun rags and believe the gushing praise of gun rag writers (no connection between the latter and the truckloads of money Kimber dumps into advertising in those rags, I'm sure), and the common conclusion among them seems to be that Kimber sits atop the 1911 world.

I've never met a real person who's had an issue with them (beyond general 1911 mag issues), and a whole lot of people seem to own one. I never had any issues with mine.
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Interesting. Several of the people I know who own newer Kimbers have had issues with them, some of which the company was never able to resolve to their satisfaction. My FFL says that Kimber is among four brands whose guns he most frequently returns for service for his customers (as a proportion of the brands' guns sold). Glad you've had good luck.

In reality, though, most people will not have trouble with any brand of gun they buy (not sure I want to include Taurus semi-autos in that category, actually). People who have problems are in the minority, but the size of that minority varies tremendously from brand to brand. There's a hell of a difference between a 0.5% problem rate and a 5% or a 10% problem rate.

You don't think they use MIM?
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He didn't actually say that. Kimber gets grief over MIM because of the sheer quantity and the low quality of the MIM they use (though it is true that any use of MIM will set some people off). MIM varies tremendously in quality. HK, for instance, is a company that uses high-quality MIM. Sig (Exeter/Newington), on the other hand, is a company that sources low-quality MIM from vendors like Indo-MIM in Bangalore. Taurus MIM is predictably pure trash.

everyone short of semi custom guns use MIM.
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Mostly true, but not entirely true. But again, with regard to Kimber, prevalence of its use at a given price point and the quality of what's used are part of the complaint.

The OP's mission is done here. Another repeat thread of an old topic ground into the dirt.
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Meh. An internet message board thread is no match for Kimber's marketing might. Repetition of the topic is not necessarily a bad thing, since it won't be old news to everyone.
 
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I t has to be remembered that originally, Kimber was a price point pistol selling pistols with lots of competition features at reasonable prices. When Kimber first started producing, Colts were pretty crappy. Kimber and others forced everyone's game to improve.

Unfortunately, as Kimbers became popular, their quality appears to have gone through the floor. My Kimber is an earlier one and is one of the best pistols I've ever gotten a hold of. However, I'd be very hesitant with their reputation now, to buy a new one.
Earlier Kimbers were great. Then the company got Ron Cohen'd and has never recovered -- quality-wise, that is, as they're doing more than fine financially. SIG Sauer Inc. (not SIG Sauer GmbH, though the German Sig will be strictly a thing of the past within a year) has been undergoing the Cohen treatment for the last decade. American Sigs are a pale shadow of what they were before Cohen arrived in 2004. Hopefully someone changes course when he leaves, but I wouldn't count on it. His vision is great for maximizing a company's profit -- for a time, at least.

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As far as I can tell their bad reputation is exclusive to the internet.
It's certainly more prevalent on the internet, but your average gun store visitor is an extremely low-information buyer. They look at pretty photos in gun rags and believe the gushing praise of gun rag writers (no connection between the latter and the truckloads of money Kimber dumps into advertising in those rags, I'm sure), and the common conclusion among them seems to be that Kimber sits atop the 1911 world.

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I've never met a real person who's had an issue with them (beyond general 1911 mag issues), and a whole lot of people seem to own one. I never had any issues with mine.
Interesting. Several of the people I know who own newer Kimbers have had issues with them, some of which the company was never able to resolve to their satisfaction. My FFL says that Kimber is among four brands whose guns he most frequently returns for service for his customers (as a proportion of the brands' guns sold). Glad you've had good luck.

In reality, though, most people will not have trouble with any brand of gun they buy (not sure I want to include Taurus semi-autos in that category, actually). People who have problems are in the minority, but the size of that minority varies tremendously from brand to brand. There's a hell of a difference between a 0.5% problem rate and a 5% or a 10% problem rate.

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You don't think they use MIM?
He didn't actually say that. Kimber gets grief over MIM because of the sheer quantity and the low quality of the MIM they use (though it is true that any use of MIM will set some people off). MIM varies tremendously in quality. HK, for instance, is a company that uses high-quality MIM. Sig (Exeter/Newington), on the other hand, is a company that sources low-quality MIM from vendors like Indo-MIM in Bangalore. Taurus MIM is predictably pure trash.

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everyone short of semi custom guns use MIM.
Mostly true, but not entirely true. But again, with regard to Kimber, prevalence of its use at a given price point and the quality of what's used are part of the complaint.

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The OP's mission is done here. Another repeat thread of an old topic ground into the dirt.
Meh. An internet message board thread is no match for Kimber's marketing might. Repetition of the topic is not necessarily a bad thing, since it won't be old news to everyone.
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I can assure you its over hyped on the Internet. I have handled probably more Kimbers in the past two months than guns people will own in their life span. They sell better than any other brand 1911 out there. Are they the end all be all in the 1911 world? No. Can they do things better? Almost any production company can.

I sell 10 Kimbers to every Colt, SA, Rem/Para ect ect. We rarely have issues with them and its my job to take care of warranty services. If you have more experience than me dealing with warranty repairs from firearms companies for the past 6 years or so, dealing with 2-3million dollars of guns sold annually, I am all ears. Kimbers sell, and the ones we do have issues with.. are mostly the 3'' Ultra models (which most 1911 guru's will tell you isn't exclusive to Kimber for 3'' 1911s) and the rough release of the Solo.

I am not by any means a brand loyalist, but I have sold, lots of them over the past years, and I am the sole one in charge of dealing with warranty repairs. I have dealt with Kimber service on behalf of my customers, and for myself (for special orders not repairs for my personal guns). The internet makes it out to be like they are as bad or as equal to as Taurus, and I can assure you, Taurus is much much worse. Taurus is with out a doubt our number 1 brand with issues, followed by Kel-Tec, which we won't sell anymore, and believe it or not its a toss up between Beretta and Remington.

Is Kimber perfect? No... everyone makes mistakes. Are they as good as a Dan Wesson... no... But after selling and servicing 1000's of them, and shooting every single model they make with their reps at an event I don't doubt their performance. LAPD SWAT is still carrying their TLE's I believe.

As for their ads.... well they work, so I can't talk smack about them. I made reference to it once with our respective Kimber rep and he said it does exactly what they want... Kimbers sell themselves, people ask for them by name, can't ask for more than that.

Personally my two worst 1911's were a Colt and a SA Loaded.. well two different SA Loaded models were bad.... I don't trash the companies... I got rid of them and moved on, they still make good guns, Everyone can and will make a lemon.
 
I don't doubt your experiences. My profession definitely does not involve selling guns. I am good friends with someone who moves a ton of guns, though, and his experiences seem to differ with yours a bit.

When I asked him a while back which of the major brands had the most issues with their handguns in his experience, he said the highest number of pistols/revolvers sent back as a percentage of those sold came from Taurus (far and away the worst), followed by, in no order, Kahr, Kel-Tec, Kimber, and Sig (which was having particular issues with newly designed models at that time, as they seem to with virtually every new model they release). The least problematic brands at that particular time were, in no order, Beretta, HK, and Walther (excluding the Umarex-produced junk stamped with the Walther name in this assessment, just as he excluded the Mosquito from his evaluation of Sig). Glock was very solid, but had had some recent bobbles. He said that FN Hi-Powers very rarely had any issues, to no one's surprise, but that the FNH USA poly pistols seemed fairly problematic (I don't view FNH and FNH USA as being the same company anyway); but he also said that he didn't move enough of either to feel like making a strong statistical claim about them. I wondered about CZs, but he said they didn't move in large enough numbers for him to feel like he could draw a solid conclusion. S&W and Ruger were good but not great.

This is just my hypothesis, but as someone said earlier, Kimber will tell you over the phone that they won't look at any reliability-related issues unless you've put what amounts to $200-250 of .45 ammo (500 rounds) through the gun. Since some customers are likely to contact the manufacturer first, there is quite likely some percentage of buyers having issues that you will never hear from -- especially since some number of people will not get around to shooting the required amount of ammo through the gun before the warranty is up. There's no way of quantifying this, but companies' differing reputations in the way of CS probably impacts to a fair degree what retailers see. The fact that S&W, for instance, will send usually send a shipping label to the buyer's house for any issue without arm-twisting might keep a retailer from being aware of a decent percentage of its problem guns. If the company tells the customer that they need to shoot the gun into a reliable state (Kimber and Kahr), that probably also screens out some number of complaints from ever making it back to the retailer. A company that's just a general PITA to deal with on the phone but that doesn't present a specific obstacle (break-in requirements), on the other hand, might have more of its customers returning to their dealers for help. So while different retailers' data is useful, there are also reasons that it may not present a consistent picture from manufacturer to manufacturer.

Then there's the variable of the retailer's reputation for helpfulness. I don't know your boss's particular way of doing things, but my friend provides more customer support than most. You pay higher prices for this (well, I don't, since I basically don't buy current-production guns anymore), but his store stresses to the customer that they should return to him with any issues. He doesn't screen for completion of Kimber's 500-round requirement -- if the customer says the gun is having issues after a couple of boxes of ammo, it goes back. (I have no idea if Kimber is aware of this or not, but he moves a ton of their guns, so he has some room for doing things his way.) You can argue that this is unfair to Kimber and that it results in him seeing more of their guns than he should, but he would privately retort that it’s unfair for Kimber to outsource final finishing to the customer (via burnishing the improperly-fitting parts through expensive shooting sessions), especially with fairly pricey guns.

Anyway, the only players that have anything close to the full-picture data are the manufacturers themselves, and we obviously don't have access to that. You have your experiences (work and Kimber ownership) with their associated limitations. I have mine (FFL friend's description of his experience and my knowledge of experiences of Kimber-owning friends and acquaintances) with their associated limitations.
 
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This is just my hypothesis, but as someone said earlier, Kimber will tell you over the phone that they won't look at any reliability-related issues unless you've put what amounts to $200-250 of .45 ammo (500 rounds) through the gun.
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Generally I agree with this practice, litterally, and other companies (such as S&W for example) have also said it to customers, and to me personally on the phone.

I will say the only times I have heard Kimber saying that to customers was with the fumbled release of the gen 1 Solo's which I can say openly admit were terrible. However a lot of companies recomend shooting a decent number of rounds through a gun to see if it will work out, or if its faulty ammo or mags.

My boss and your friend sound similar in the sense they take the approach of (if you bought it here, bring it back we will help) which is the sole purpose of my job. The gunsmiths are generally swamped, so I deal with the paper chasing and factory warranties. I can write a 50 page term paper on the in's and outs of all the brands warranties and repairs, but I can say personally we move A LOT of Kimbers, and I have a lot of first name basis customers. I carry a Kimber (on ocassion) , and would not recomend them if I had bad experiences.

At this stage I have seen EVERYTHING break / fail / come messed up. I have had guns come in where chambers weren't even reamed out of the barrel yet. I had a Glock where the slide wouldn't even go onto the frame rails. I have had a Taurus judge brand new that looked like someone used a claw hammer to fit the cylinder, and sent it back to them 6 times.

While I agree with the sentiment it sucks having a round requirement... I also see the benefits of it. It makes my life easier, and it makes the repair centers easier, because a lot of times things do smooth out and fix themselves, or people learn its a bad mag or the crap ammo they got at the gun show last month ect ect. YES IT DOES SADDEN me that its not the old days (for which I was a child) where manufactures went over every detail with their hands. This day in age, production made guns I don't care if its Colt HK Sig Glock Kimber, whomever you want to put on the pedestal, its more about staying alive and keeping profits high. Things are automated, things are MIM things are Cast, ect ect.

The issue lies in MIM IS AND CAN be GOOD, when done properly. Casting as proved by Ruger, can also be VERY GOOD when done properly. Does Kimber make mistakes, YUP. Does Colt.... you bet. Ruger does casting so well they also do it outside the firearms industry and in fields such as the medical industry. Obviously our SP101 and GP100 is thicker and heavier than comparable S&W's because casting requires more material for strength than forged.

Do we all wish our guns were all hands on and made perfect... sure... but not a lot of us want to spend WC, Les Baer, or Nighthawk prices for that. My STI set me back near $2000.

That being said, I don't doubt people have problems, and I don't doubt I don't see all those problems, however I think it is more prevelent on the internet. The guys who enjoy theirs are out shooting them, the guys who had trouble... are understandbly mad and most likely to post their opinion. I can't take that away from them, I have been in their shoes. I had a SA Loaded that would not feed ANYTHING, no matter what mags I tried, the internals looked like someone chewed on them. I bought another loaded later on, it worked great, but the slide stop was fitted too loose and would walk out and seize the gun. I got so fed up with it, I replaced the detent spring with a longer one, and had our gunsmith dimple the slide stop so the detent sat firmly into it. Solved the issue... but it shouldn't of had to be done. I had a Colt series 80 that would not cycle hollowpoints at all, and would jam often with ball ammo.

I don't go around bashing Colt or SA, I have owned amazing guns from both. I see the bad and ugly guns all day, I know they exist and its part of the buisness. Kimber has always been good to me, and my customers, maybe your friend has different luck.:confused:

I see you have four Pythons.... and I don't know their shape or condition, but for being so sought after, the two I owned, and the 1 Andaconda I owned had about the worst revolver triggers I ever felt....;) Doesn't mean they are junk guns.
 
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