It happened to me.

Ronny

You have me wrong...

I'm don't mean you must shoot him...
I mean you must do SOMETHING...
If shooting him is REQUIRED then shoot him... :rolleyes:

But, in many cases like this, you can stop the perp's beating on the woman, by simply shouting for him to stop or you are going to shoot him...

Two guys... one with a knife and one with a gun, could VERY likely have ended the assault on the woman much sooner simply by "intimidation" and at least delay the beating until "backup" arrives... LEO's do this everyday!

The majority of the time... it is UNECESSARY to do more than that.

IF, in the event, the intimidation fails to work... then try something else...

And shooting may well prove necessary...
In that event, you must convince the perp that you mean what you say and you must NOT hesitate.

Live and learn... DO NOT LET this one incident screw with your head... You must be OK with yourself so the the next time you have a similar experience your head will be "in the right place" for it... and you won't go off "half-cocked" and shoot someone you don't have to shoot. :)

BUT YOU MUST TRY! NOT JUST FUMBLE AROUND WITH YOUR FINGERS IN YOUR EARS...


LIKE A LIBERAL... :D :D :D
 
A bad guy has to have some semblance of skill to effectively employ the bellygun, with the knife, all he has to do is get close. If you manage to survive an edged weapon attack, you will most likely be maimed for life...
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Amen to that! One of our officers was working a side job as security for a supermarket a few years back when he tried to stop a shoplifter. He never even saw the knife that slashed his abdomen, and the &#$% manager jumped in front of him when he went to shoot the SOB. He was on the floor with his guts hanging out when we arrived. He did survive it, but has trouble to this day. Don't ever underestimate someone with a knife!
 
Ronny,

If you don't mind telling me, where exactly did this happen? I don't live far from Tampa and I'm curious of the location.
 
What does this all mean? I need more training, I was just lucky, the Lord took mercy on me, and I wasn't prepared for this at all.
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Absolutely no reflection on you, friend, but you are correct. And believe me, I don't mean that in a bad way.

Way too many people feel that when they strap on a gun, it automatically makes them the most cool, ubertactical, gun savvy person on the planet! Jeff Cooper could take lessons; to them, Clint Smith is a serious wannabe.

This feeling permeates, and seems to become more entrenched as time passes....

Right until the first time that they have a REAL encounter.

I'm not saying that you did this, or had this mindset at all. Remember this, though, and remember it well:

YOU WILL FIGHT THE WAY YOU HAVE TRAINED.

Train the same way that you will fight; and fight as you have trained.

Under stress, you will revert to reflexive movements. It takes roughly 3,000 repititions to engrave something into muscle memory.

Your firearms training should be done in three phases, inclusively:

1. Legal considerations. This is by far the most important part. Learn the laws of your jurisdiction as they pertain to self defense, concealed carry, and permits. Contact your local prosecutor, ask lots of questions. Learn when NOT to shoot, when you CAN shoot, and when you'd BETTER shoot.

2. Marksmanship. Bluntly put, if you can't hit a 5" circle at 25 yards 100% of the time, within 3 seconds, train until you can. With either hand.

3. Tactics. Here is where most pistoleros fall short.

Practice shooting. Training in marksmanship is one thing; training for armed combat is another.

NEVER practice shooting while standing still. Fire two rounds, move; evaluate. Repeat as necessary. Practice shooting from retention, point shooting, Bill drills, Tueller drills, etc. Practice strong and weak hand reloads and shooting. Shoot from your right, left, cross body, sitting, on your back, from the prone, etc.

Use the "El Presidente" drill to evaluate speed and accuracy.

And above all, train. Train, and train again. Over and over again.

That being said, you did well. Of course, there were some things I would have done differently--but it doesn't count, because YOU were there, and I was not. ;)

Thanks for standing up. We need more people like you.
 
He said off of Bruce B Downs (30th St).

I'm guessing somewhere between Bearss and Busch. I could be wrong, just a shot in the dark.

Not a real "bad" area I don't think.....USF takes up a big chunk on the east side of that area.......and there's some pretty crappy areas on the west side, near the V.A and university mall.
 
Ronny, just doing something may very well have saved her life, even if you didn't shoot him. You did a lot more than many people (especially the unarmed masses that are self-centered sheeple), so for that, be proud. I generally wouldn't expose myself to possible criminal and probable civil liability for a complete stranger by taking that shot. If I tried to intervene (which I would) and subsequently became the target, THEN I would be OK with shooting the guy.
 
Wow, tough to criticize without actually being there, but I would have been tempted to stop the guy sooner. Especially, since he was such a big guy and could have easily killed the woman with his bare hands. It's a shame he got away and will likely do this again who knows how many times. It's good you and your friends did not get hurt, but now he knows where they live and might think you live there.
 
Ronny,

The only thing I could fault you for, is thinking that the cops were going to respond quicker then they did. Frankly, the fact that they do NOT respond quickly, is why most of us are packing.
Other than that, I think you did some quick thinking, that most likely saved the victims life, and you did not have to deal with killing someone.
Darn shame that more things don't turn out that good.
 
She didn't even thank me she was in so much shock.
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I'm confused here, what should she be thanking you for? You called 911 to report it then watched her get the heck beat out of her and almost killed.
I tend to agree with Pointer's view on this one.

kenny b
 
Ronny I think you did exactly right with the situation you were in. You did not know these people and only leaned that the 300 lb nutcase was a sexual pred after the incident. What if this creep that you almost took out was her husband..... And she sues you for wrongful death even if he was beating Marching through Georgia on her head. FMPOV he did not act like your typical sex pred more like a berzerk boyfriend during a domestic distrubance.

kjeff50cal
 
You did not know these people and only leaned that the 300 lb nutcase was a sexual pred after the incident.
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I think it was a safe guess that he was not the husband when she bailed from the SECOND story window.
 
I'm confused here, what should she be thanking you for? You called 911 to report it then watched her get the heck beat out of her and almost killed.
I tend to agree with Pointer's view on this one.
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Victims tend to be thankful to the strangers who call the police for them when they are unable to themselves.

But you're right, I could've done better. I had an ally with an edged weapon that I could've set upon the BG. I could've approached the BG from the side and shot him point blank.

I'm hoping that by sharing this, others may analyze how they would respond to this real life crisis and do better than I did. Already it seems, some would respond the way I did, and others would have pulled the trigger sooner.

I'm don't mean you must shoot him...
I mean you must do SOMETHING...
If shooting him is REQUIRED then shoot him...
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I called the police, got his attention and endangered my friend and her boyfriend in their own apartment. If I were an LEO, I'd have done a lot more a lot better. As it was, I was just an average man returning home from Church. But yes, Pointer, I've thought long and hard about the things you bring up and more ever since that night.

Also once again, I don't feel comfortable releasing the name of the apartment complex because it might have legal consequences that I really don't want to deal with. It was a off of 30th towards the University.
 
Two guys... one with a knife and one with a gun, could VERY likely have ended the assault on the woman much sooner simply by "intimidation" and at least delay the beating until "backup" arrives... LEO's do this everyday!
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Okay... suppose he and his friend's boyfriend had approached the BG with gun and knife drawn. BG pulls a knife out of his pocket and threatens to slit her throat. Now you've got a hostage situation, no training to deal with it, no good shot, and minutes before the police get there. Good luck.
 
Tyme

I truly don't mean to argue for arguments sake...

But "supposing" the perp might do something and seeing him do something are very different things...

The perp "coulda" pulled the knife and cut the woman up while "we" were standing in the doorway watching and doing nothing at all...

Any delaying action or distraction or intimidation or threat to the perp, has at least the effect of doing more than watching the crime take place...

According to Ronny the victim had asked for help...

Ronny Again, I repeat, DO NOT LET this screw up your head.
You are not a bad person because you reacted this way under stress...

NO ONE can know ahead of time what they will do under stress...
BUT you can go over this and many other scenarios until you are pretty confident that you will respond in a more effective manner.

I once went completely "blank" for what seemed like an eternity, when a guy was choking on his steak and I suddenly forgot how to do the Heimlich maneuver on a very over weight man... The reason? I had had no previous experience with this situation and had not pondered or visualized the scenario in my mind beforehand...

DO NOT LET this eat at you... you will do better the next time... and anything you can do to interfere with the criminal, is better than being a bystanding witness... :)

I'm sure the victim is glad to be alive and as NavyLT said if you can walk away from it... you did alright. ;)
 
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Ronny, as I said before, you did just fine. You found yourself in a typical unexpected scenario, and you discovered it requires, instant assessment, reaction, re-assessment, reaction, and so on. In fact, I would say you did an outstanding job, considering you aren't a trained LEO.

For those opinioning you should have shot the badguy and making chest beating statements like "defend the weak and downtrodden", I'll say this.

First, better check your CCW and use of force statutes. I can assure you nothing in there authorizes you to be a part-time-when-you-feel-like-it unsworn LEO, vigilante, or superhero.

Also, when I hear some guy (including LEOs) making these "kill em' all" statements, it tells me they haven't BTDT, and are just running their mouths. I don't know a LEO who has looked through the sights at another human being with pressure on the trigger faced with the decision, who talks this way.

The kid's table is over there, let the grown ups talk...
 
Not everyone was suggesting to shoot the person, just to try to stop the assult on the woman instead of watching it. Times change for good and bad and the reactions of many here clearly display such a change. Wether you had a handgun or not I can not imagin not doing something, it shows how weak we're becoming as a civilization and many condon it as normal today. I know there are still real men out there, they're just getting harder to find. This may offend some that fall into this catagory, but just call mom and vent.

kenny b
 
Kennyb

+1

I musta missed those posts that were advocating macho-kill-em-all stuff...

I agree with you... it seems that selfish attitudes prevail in these modern times.

Since when is it UNACCEPTIBLE to defend the weak and downtrodden?

Is self-preservation all there is in the hearts of our fellow men?

Selfishness is the foundation of everything liberal and the "Big City", New York mentality of watching a crime take place, and "not getting involved", has spread even into "our" ranks.

It is the same selfishness that "allows" them to go about their lives blindly ignoring the torture and murder and tyrannical treatment of innocents in foreign lands. "It's over there... it has nothing to do with me..."

And then when someone does want to step in to help "they" get upset and call him the terrorist and dictator.

making chest beating statements like "defend the weak and downtrodden",
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God help us... It's a cinch that NDTerminator won't help us and speaking of "chest beating", he is probably a "terminator" in name only. :mad:
 
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