Is this way out of line for a Gun Show or am I prude?

About the Brown shirts in Germany (separating from the Facists in Italy) - this is an historical question.

Were they from the get-go racist murdering bastards that were then corrupted? Did the original brown shirts then quit when they became that?

Far cry from fighting the king. So if you are going to make a comparison between the groups, give us some support to this seemingly outrageous comparison.
 
Boston Massacre. The "bloody lobsterbacks" who fired upon the "patriots" were tried before an American jury. The jury's verdict? Self defense. The incident began with name calling which the sentry ignored. More hecklers gathered and emboldened by their numbers (anonymity of the masses works then too), they began to pelt the sentry with stones. He called for help and other soldiers arrived. They too were taunted and pelted. In defense, they fired. The American jury agreed with the conduct of the soldiers and all were acquitted of wrongdoing.

Boston Tea Party. Does rioting and looting come to mind?

How about tarring and feathering of Tax Collectors? Ouch! I've read somewhere where they poured boiling water (or was it molten lead?) down one man's throat.

While the Sons of Liberty weren't racists like the Nazi Brown Shirts, their techniques admittedly falls short of diplomatic persuasion.
 
At the last Orange County (CA) gun show I attended late last year a guy was selling Nazi memorabilia. This is not unusual at gun shows since memorabilia of all types, especially militaria, are sold. One thing unique about his setup, however, is he was selling what he said were Star of David arm bands and patches, originals not faked, along with captured identity papers and deportation papers. I looked the stuff over. It was most interesting. My suggestion to him was to contact the Simon Wiesenthal Center Museum of Tolerance or the National Holocaust Museum in Washington. He said they are not willing to pay enough for the pieces. Hell, why not just donate them and take a tax writeoff. At least they would be preserved for future generations to see and not locked away in some attic somewhere.

As for porn, never seen it at a gun show.
 
Good question, Enoch, and a fair one. I can also see that I've touched a nerve, which is to be expected. It's not easy for many of us to understand that the sanitized, homogenized, sterilized, prepackaged, and venerated men who founded this country had some REALLY, REALLY dark sides.

The answer to your question is, yes, no, maybe, maybe not, probably, and who knows.

All of the above answers apply to both the Brown Shirts AND the Sons of Liberty. As ugly as it is, it is the truth.

The Nazi party originally began recruiting people based on ideological values: the reconstruction of German pride, renovation of the economy, putting Germany back into its rightful place as a power on the European mainland, scapegoating the Jews, etc.

This is not unlike how the early calls for independence went out. Increased freedom from Britain, greater representation and respect within the Empire, etc.

Scapegoating Jews, and even the leaders of the Wiemar Republic, for the loss of World War I, was an integral part of Nazi ideology from the onset. So was targeted, semi-controlled violence.

The economic unrest and upheaval of the 1920s, combined with the aftermath of WW I and the effects of the Treaty of Versailles, have very tangible comparisons to the situation that existed in New England in the 1760s and 1770s.

Resistance to the Navigation Acts, the Stamp Acts, the Tea Act, the Sugar Act, protests against garrisoning troops in New England, etc., began to break out in sporatic violence.

Burning the homes of tax collectors, tarring and feathering the tax collectors, attacks on British soldiers (as Gary notes, a mob throwing rocks instigated the Boston Massacre), and the Boston Tea Party were all events largely propagated by the Sons of Liberty, with Samual Adams in the lead.

Another point that is often glossed over, or even buried, in history is that there WAS a significant racial element in the formation of the Sons of Liberty. Most of these men were workers on the Boston docks, day laborers, who had reason to fear for their jobs. Adams used, to some degree, the spectre of freed blacks taking their jobs to motivate some of these men into action.

Samuel Adams had failed at quite a few pursuits prior to becoming a professional organizer: grocer, brewer, tax collector, among others.

Adams found his true calling as an organizer of the working class, the disaffected, the oppressed, and the disenfranchised.

Sound something like a certain Austrian born dictator?

The BIG difference, though, is the direction in which these events unfolded.

Unlike Hitler, Adams and the Sons of Liberty faded deeper and deeper into the mist as the movement toward revolution gained speed.

Why is that?

The answer to that is also extremely complex, but it has a lot to do with the fact that Adams was elected to represent Massachusetts in the Continental Congress, which got him away from his power base in New England. Once in Congress, he was also overshadowed by men of truly great character like Jefferson, Washington, Franklin, and his cousin, John Adams.

It also has to do with the fact that Adams simply didn't have the kind of rapport with people of all levels that Adolph Hitler had. Whereas Hitler could charm, mesmerize, whatever, people from the very low to the very high in society, people above the working class saw Sam Adams as a rabblerouser of the lower classes, and viewed him with great suspicion.

I agree, it's really tough to accept this sort of view of one of our venerated founding fathers. And, honestly, I didn't even want to give it much creedence when I first started realizing it when I was working on a paper in college. I also fully recognize that there are critical differences between the two groups and situations, but there are startling parallels none the less.

The day I raised this discussion in my Colonial American History class in college I thought I was going to be lynched. What startled me even more, though, was the realization that the professor not only knew what I was driving at, but she also, in large part, agreed with me.
 
This has nothing to do with the Bill of Rights

These are private transactions. The promoters can certainly tell the vendor that they, and their wares are not welcome. And, customers of the gun show can certainly tell the promoters that they will not be attending future shows if this continues. Folks attending the show can also tell the individual involved that they think his behavior and business are not appropriate ... shame and ostracism work as well.

These are all private ways of settling the issue, and IMHO, this is how the country should work. There is no need to involve the government.

The BOR doesn't say I have to let you into my house to swear and show pornography to my children. Same effect.

Regards from AZ
 
Thanks for the answer Mike. Lucky that the ultimate USA went one way and the Germans choose the dark side (not so lucky for them).

We always have to be on the lookout for scapegoating as a explanatory mechanism. Usually, the defenseless are the targets.

bye
 
Enoch,

The Revolution in the United States truly was, and really continues to be, unique.

Most revolutions/civil wars eventually end up consuming themselves, a good case in point is the French Revolution, which led to the rise of Napoleon.

The American Revolution is unique in that once it gained its stated goals, it switched off, and the same men who led the Revolution moved on to established a new legal order based on the rule of law.
 
battle flag vs. stars & bars

buzzknox,

The Stars & Bars is not the flag you are thinking of. The The Stars & Bars was the national flag of the Confederacy. The St. Andrew's Cross, or the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia, is the flag that some people have deemed offensive.

There are several web pages available that cover this subject. Here's one: http://members.aol.com/wlldrebel/flags.html
 
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